my first successful CF overlay!

[blcknspo0ln]

alright, I first got my info from this thread and from a very good mr2oc.com thread [ sign up and read, its worth it]. props to those who helped out . after wasting a sheet of 24x36 and 15x50 of CF, i finally ended up with ONE good piece, and sadly its far from perfect.

materials used from: www.sollercomposites.com and www.uscomposites.com. I used the thin med. fast epoxy/hardener [3:1] and 2x2 5.7 oz. twill CF. plus duplicolor clear coat.

so here it is: a single layer CF spark plug cover

*more details to come.

 

[Bigglesworth87]

Not bad man, its lookin good. Practice makes perfect.

 

[Talonman]

nice not bad at all for a 1st try

 

[blcknspo0ln]

since i can only type with one hand ill keep the process i used simple [ dislocated left elbow ]:

1. wet object and let dry until the epoxy gets sticky
2. lay DRY cf over piece and work around edges to satsfaction, use flat smooth object to dislodge air bubbles.
3. apply thin layer of epoxy on [just enought to cimpletely wet] and squegee [sp?] excess epoxy off.
4. let dry 1.5 hrs.
5. 1st flood coat, let dry 1.5 hours
6. 2nd flood coat, let dry 1.5 hrs.
7. 3rd " "
8. when COMPLETELY cured, wetsand 1500
9. clear coat [ spray evenly ]
10. 2 more coats
11. wetsand 1500, 2000
12. apply rubbing compound
13. apply carnauba wax
14. buff

now, those are the steps I used, but produced a far from perfect overlay. a big PITA i found is getting rid of the air bubbles in the flood coat. any insight?

also, in the next pictures youll see the uneven distrib. of epoxy, i think this is because the epoxy was not self-leveling enough. someone suggested the KLEER KOTE from uscomposites, but my research says that this epoxy will become soft during summer weather and become yellowed/pitted on exterior pieces. also, any insight?

please add all opinions and/or processes, i need to make better pieces!

 

[blcknspo0ln]

COMPLETELY cut-and-paste from MR2OC.com

accredited to turboguy-


Carbon Fiber Laminating Tutorial
I've seen a few post on the board and even more people e-mailing me for the proper way to laminate items in carbon fiber. I've decided instead of re-writing it every time somebody asks, I'll do a little tutorial.

The first step, obviously, is to decide what pieces you are going to laminate. The material of the piece to be laminated can also decide what resin you are to use also. A typical polyester resin WON'T stick to plastic. Some regular vinylester resins are more suited for plastics. You need to purchase supplies such as carbon fiber, sand paper, a surface prep wash (such as PrepAll), measuring and mixing containers, a couple of 2 inch wide paintbrushes, and resin. For resin, the easiest to work with while laminating an object is KleerKote from US Composites. It will stick to anything, has a uv protectant, and dries crystal clear.

Now, to prep the piece that you will be laminating. Start off by sanding with a coarse grit paper (I prefer 80). This will give the resin something to bond to. After sanding, wipe the piece down with prep wash. Using a clean towel and more prep wash, go over the entire piece once again to make sure there is no remaining residue. (resin will only stick to the piece, not to dirt or grease on that piece.) Let it dry COMPLETELY.

Mix a little bit of the KleerKote resin. using a brush, apply a layer over the piece. KleerKote has a pot life of 35 minutes, so if you are using a different resin, your times may be a little different. Wait about 15 minutes until the resin becomes tacky like glue.

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While the resin is beginning to set on the piece, cut a piece of carbon fiber cloth for the project. Use masking tape to outline the area you will be cutting. Cut down the middle of the tape. This will keep the fabric from unraveling.

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Now, after the resin is tacky to the touch, lay your carbon cloth ofer the piece. You are going to get a little sticky here. Use your fingers to press and form the carbon around all of the contours of the piece you are doing. After it fits satisfactorily, let it cure for about 1 1/2 to 2 hours. (Leave the overhang of cloth until it dries)

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After it is cured to the point that the carbon will not shift when touched, mix enough kleerkote to cover the piece. Use a brush to apply a liberal coat to the piece. This will seal the carbon and greatly reduce the chance of air bubbles in the finished product. After that coat is applied, let it sit for about 40 minutes.

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The next step is called a flood coat. You pour the kleerkote resin at the highest point of the piece and let it flow down. This resin is self leveling, so there isn't that much sanding to do later. Repeat this step 90 to 120 minutes apart until there is no surface texture over the weave. If you let the previous layer cure completely, you will need to lightly sand with a light grit paper (600 - 800 grit) so the next layer of resin has something to bond to. The below pic is after 2 flood coats. It will more than likely get 1 or 2 more before final sanding and buffing.

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After the piece cures overnight, you can trim the excess off with a pair of fabric shears. (its only one layer of carbon afterall. ) Trim the fabric short with shears and use a Dremel to take it even with the plastic around it. One final floodcoat helps to seal everything together.

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After the piece is COMPLETELY cured, you can wetsand with 1500 grit, then 2000 grit until the surface is smooth. After that, 3M rubbing compound does a great job of taking off the haze that wetsanding leaves behind. You are now done!!

I am laminating a couple pieces for a friend today, so I will update the tutorial with pics as I get the work done. Also note, this will not work for pieces wih complicated curves and dips. It will, however, work for every piece of interior plastin in the MKII. The complex curve and dips is a whole different writeup with molds and other fun!


If anybody has any more info or an easier way of doing a step, please feel free to post. Also, if anybody has any questions, ask! I will do my best to answer.


-Jason

 

[DGajre777]

This is why I love this website! I learn something new everyday!

 

[lngbrdr]

A typical polyester resin WON'T stick to plastic. Some regular vinylester resins are more suited for plastics. You need to purchase supplies such as carbon fiber, sand paper, a surface prep wash (such as PrepAll), measuring and mixing containers, a couple of 2 inch wide paintbrushes, and resin. For resin, the easiest to work with while laminating an object is KleerKote from US Composites. It will stick to anything, has a uv protectant, and dries crystal clear.
[/B]

Yeah if I was doing this I definetly wouldn't be doing it with epoxy since it would yellow over time. That's why on surfboards we use polyester now, although polyester can be a pain in the ass because it doesn't cure if the resin is exposed to the air. maybe a vinylester would be easier.

 

[diab0liK]

not bad for a first go at all. I'm sure you'll get the hang of it, and start pumping out some nice looking parts

CF is a little too commonplace, at this point, not to mention a bit riceriffic for my tastes (Can't wait to replace the CF guage bezel, and shift knob my car had when I got it). At least you did it the right way, instead of buying some chauncy "cf-like" super ### parts

g'luck

diab0liK

 

[gixrman]

I read the best way is to vacuum bag and a cheap-o way of doing that for small pieces is with a food saver vacuum bag system. That is really cool though.

 

[WombatTSi]

Yeah if I was doing this I definetly wouldn't be doing it with epoxy since it would yellow over time. That's why on surfboards we use polyester now, although polyester can be a pain in the ass because it doesn't cure if the resin is exposed to the air. maybe a vinylester would be easier.

Polyester will most deffinatley kick off (cure) if exposed to air. Mix it with 2.5% (by weight) of 45% MEKP and wait about 15 minutes. hard as a rock. Straight vinlylester must also be catalized to kick off, but it kicks much cooler (poly can heat up to 150+F/ignite itself if too much MEKP is used) and takes a lot longer to cure (about 45 min to get tacky @2% MEKP) However, Vinylester is most deffinatley the way to go. Not only does it adhere to plastics better, its a superior quality resin to begin with. and if you are making a mold, I wouldn't even think of using polyester. just be careful if cayalyzing with MEKP, the shit is nasty. Wash it off ASAP if you get it on you, and NEVER mix it more than 4%; unless you like watching things burst into flames.

 

[blcknspo0ln]

wow, i didnt even come across these composites before...

 

[lngbrdr]

Polyester will most deffinatley kick off (cure) if exposed to air. Mix it with 2.5% (by weight) of 45% MEKP and wait about 15 minutes. hard as a rock. Straight vinlylester must also be catalized to kick off, but it kicks much cooler (poly can heat up to 150+F/ignite itself if too much MEKP is used) and takes a lot longer to cure (about 45 min to get tacky @2% MEKP) However, Vinylester is most deffinatley the way to go. Not only does it adhere to plastics better, its a superior quality resin to begin with. and if you are making a mold, I wouldn't even think of using polyester. just be careful if cayalyzing with MEKP, the shit is nasty. Wash it off ASAP if you get it on you, and NEVER mix it more than 4%; unless you like watching things burst into flames.

Don't know what MEKP stands for but if you mix the resin with a certain compund maybe that is it, it's sort of like a wax that will float to the top and seel it off from the air and let it cure. But if you forget it have fun sanding it off! It will just tack up your sandpaper and be a nightmare to clean up.

 

[WombatTSi]

Nah, MEKP is Methyl Ethyl Keytone Peroxide, its a catalyzing agent for most polyesther and vinylesther resins. Doesn't form a film or anything. The thing about poly is that unless you use a LOT of MEKP (which will make for a weaker part) it won't kick if its below about 65*F (ideally you want it about 80* F) so yeah, maybe thats the deal with your guys' poly not kicking when exposed to air. not hot enough

 

[97gstnick]

hey dude, that would be awesome to do a valve cover IMO. i would love to start this project but i believe i need your help... what you think i would need to do this...

 

[Chuckster]

That looks really good, Black! I'd like to see it in person some day and buy you a beer.

 

['96_Talon_TSi]

Someone a few posts up mentioned using uscomposites Kleer Coat. On the USComposites website they said it actually ends up in a softer layer, in order to help prevent scratches. Are there any other self leveling epoxy resins that you guys know about, maybe ones that are also UV protective but finish a bit harder?

 

[blcknspo0ln]

That looks really good, Black! I'd like to see it in person some day and buy you a beer.

haha sure thing man... buuut im only 19

 

[theboogieman]

[QUOTE='96_Talon_TSi]Someone a few posts up mentioned using uscomposites Kleer Coat. On the USComposites website they said it actually ends up in a softer layer, in order to help prevent scratches. Are there any other self leveling epoxy resins that you guys know about, maybe ones that are also UV protective but finish a bit harder?[/QUOTE]

Casting resins that are made for high temp applications would work. I NEVER use Kleer Kote for exterior or engine bay apps. Actually I stopped using it all together cause even after just a year parts exposed to the sun will turn yellow. Seriously it is best used in home or resturant situations such as bars and those clocks/plaques and crafty things folks do.

And nice looking plug cover, especially for the first attempt!!

BTW, the learning curve sucks don't it? I went through like 15 YARDS one week trying to learn molding and vacumm bagging techniques so I feel your pain! I ate Ramen noodles for 2 weeks over that loss!
Now trust me though when I say that the KleerKote will not stand up to the engine heat very well. It will get soft when it gets hot, possible melt, could turn yellow on the edges...you will see the bolts begin to sink down into the clear. It will get hard again when the engine cools, but that's not the point. It really isn't a good choice for this part. You are better off doing flood coats with just the resin you are using for laminating. Skip using the Kleer Kote (sorry Mark)
Anyhow, I found this out the hard way when I first started making those, then I quit using the KleerKote as a coating and sold them with a "raw" finish...now I do not bother making them at all. At one time US Composite was selling a "harder" setting resin but even the "harder" setting Kleer was not tough enough. hard enough, nor stood up to heat from the engine or outside elements (I did a few mosaic garden tables, go figure). I did make a coulpe DSM fuse box covers and MAF covers, and they seem to be holding up under his hood, but they do get really soft when the bay is hot from running....but again, they are not directly on the engine.

Next project for you....make a mold kiddo' !! Less materials time and waste! You'd be suprised once you tackle it.

Leo

 

[9520g]

Leo too bad you are not making custom parts anymore, you are one of the few guys that do good work and especialy for dsm's, wish I didnt wait this long to decide to get things done!

 

[blcknspo0ln]

update:

it hasn't even been 3 weeks yet and 2 things are totally wrong:

the CF is starting to peel off of the overlayed piece and the epoxy is turning yellow. oh well, try again.

anyone know of a better epoxy I could use?

 

[HighPsi92GST]

that sucks, looked good though. better luck next time

 

[KlowdDragon]

if you get good enough you can make me a carbon fiber dash,