IS the 2.4l swap any good.

[Davion1089]

I have decided to stick with the 420a but i was wondering is the 2.4l swap was really worth the trouble as i plan to go 400-500 hp..w\turbo setup kit

 

[GSGoinFast]

I have decided to stick with the 420a but i was wondering is the 2.4l swap was really worth the trouble as i plan to go 400-500 hp..w\turbo setup kit

I'll let you know in a month or 2. But, I have never heard anyone say they were dissapointed with the results. But the swap isn't exactly easy, and by your comment of "I have decided to stick with the 420a" I question whether you are familiar enough with these motors and cars to attempt it.

 

[Davion1089]

Well i was under the assumtion that the 2.4L was a 420a but it looks as though it's a 4g64 which i will NOT switch too is this correct..

 

[GSGoinFast]

Well i was under the assumtion that the 2.4L was a 420a but it looks as though it's a 4g64 which i will NOT switch too is this correct..

There is a 2.4L version of the 420a and then there is the 4g64 which is a 2.4L version of the 4g63. The 2.4 420a is what we can use.

 

[VelocitàPaola]

I'll let you know in a month or 2...

I was waiting for you to answer this one.

 

[Davion1089]

OH i see so there is a 2.4L version of both 4g63 (which is 4g64) and a 420a (which comes out of the cloud cars??) Thanx for clearing that up well anyways let me know how it goes alright.

 

[VelocitàPaola]

OH i see so there is a 2.4L version of both 4g63 (which is 4g64) and a 420a (which comes out of the cloud cars??) Thanx for clearing that up well anyways let me know how it goes alright.

Good research.

 

[Davion1089]

So in theory the 420a 2.4L would be better with a turbo system because more displacement means more exhaust and with the 420a 2.0L Head it will have almost the same compression but it has longer strokes, (not sure what longer strokes does except add more midrange power Is there a downside to longer strokes?) so if this is all correct why wouldn't the 2.4L swap be a good choice other than cost prohibitive to some...

 

[VelocitàPaola]

So in theory the 420a 2.4L would be better with a turbo system because more displacement means more exhaust

Wow, you went from asking wildly general questions to doing quite a bit of your own research. Very good... This is what we like to see from our new members.

with the 420a 2.0L Head it will have almost the same compression but it has longer strokes, (not sure what longer strokes does except add more midrange power Is there a downside to longer strokes?) so if this is all correct why wouldn't the 2.4L swap be a good choice other than cost prohibitive to some...

The head has very little to do with compression. The reason you need to use the 2.0L head is because the other heads simply aren't compatible. The compression ratio (C/R) is determined by the pistons themselves.

The stroke is how far each piston moves up and down within its respective cylinder. Longer stroke adds displacement because now the maximum volume for each cylinder is increased. As you know, "there's no replacement for displacement." It follows the same principle as a turbocharger: more air = more fuel = more power.

The one downside to stroked vehicles is that the since each piston now moves a greater distance per crank revolution, the piston velocity is also increased. The increased velocity is acceptable up to a point, but when you start getting into the high RPM range, where top end torque/power matters, stroked engines just can't keep up because their redline is lower. This is the reason why you hear of muscle and race cars that have been "de-stroked."

A stroked engine will certainly give you all the bottom end you'll ever need, but personally, I think mid-range and top end is where us FWD guys need to concentrate our efforts. Low end torque is great, but you'll just spin tires if you have too much of it.

I'm not knocking anybody who's currently doing the swap (*cough*Chris*cough*), but you have to realize what your goals are. A 2.4L would probably a great choice to keep that turbo spooled throughout all of the bends in an AutoX race, but less helpful with a drag race. But hey, that's just my opinion...

 

[Eclipse98Spyder]

I was so confused on this whole thing until I found out I have the 2.4L version of the 420a and I love it

 

[Talon ESI-T]

you do not have the 420a 2.4L. you have the 4g64 which is much slower than ours. Then again ours is built with different intentions.

Terry

 

[Davion1089]

So if i was building the car for top speed. and daily driving then the 2.4L swap really wouldn't be a good choice for me right?? Also if thats true are the two engines close enough together that i can use the lightweight pulley's for a 2.4L on my 2.0L if not where do i get the ones specificaly for my 2.0 because i can't find any on sportscompactonly.com as that is where i am getting all my parts thanx for the help..sorry if this is a really vague question... these are the Visual parts i've selected so far... http://www.sportcompactonly.com/wishlist-viewer.aspx?guid=fe426cbf-bb11-4544-9369-291089998370

 

[VelocitàPaola]

I hate to say it, although it's true, but most of our site sponspors do not carry 420A parts. Howell Automotive is the best resource for both 2.0L and 2.4L parts alike. For just 2.0L stuff, look into Concept Illusions or Exile Racing.

I don't know the exact compatibilities between the two engines, so I'll let Chris fill you in on the crank pulley question...

 

[Talon ESI-T]

I hate to say it, although it's true, but most of our site sponspors do not carry 420A parts. Howell Automotive is the best resource for both 2.0L and 2.4L parts alike. For just 2.0L stuff, look into Concept Illusions or Exile Racing.

I don't know the exact compatibilities between the two engines, so I'll let Chris fill you in on the crank pulley question...

2.0 crank pulley is compatible. All timing equipment and AFTERMARKET cam gears are not. Stock cam gers are the same just flipped over. Crank sproken is the same.

Terry

 

[Davion1089]

ok what about the accessory pulleys ac,altenator etc..

 

[Talon ESI-T]

Well, see that is where you are going to need to do a lot of reading. This is where the swap gets messy. There is NO concrete method to getting the 2.4L to fit. You are going to re-use the accesories from your 2.0 but you are going to have to create all the mounts ect. We are not as fortunate as the neon guys that have a complete kit for the swap.

You will need to custom fab your oil pan, passenger mount, and acc mounts.

Now another way to make the acc bolt up is to acquire a pt cruiser bracket. Use the lower mount for the Alternator and you have the alt bolted up. PS will bolt up but you will need to alter a tensioner for the belt. A/C is a custom bracket.

Basically what your beginning to find out is that the swap is not liek a honda where the trick is to pick the right parts and assemble them. There is a lot of patience and fabricating that goes into these motors, be prepared.

My preferred method is to fab everything.

Terry

 

[Davion1089]

Woah i didn't mean i was going to swap sorry for the confusion.. What i mean is i can find lightweight pulleys etc for the 2.4L(420a) but i can't find any but the crank pulley for the 2.0L(420a) my question is If aftermarket accessory(not sure if thats spelled right..) pulleys that were designed or advertised as being for the 2.4L(420) will work perfectly with my 2.0L(420a) again sorry for the confusion..thnx

 

[Talon ESI-T]

Ok, the 2.4L pulleys will not work on the 2.0L. the accessories are different and vary per model. I am kinda confused here, the title of the post is asking if the 2.4L is worth the work of the swap. Where did we go off track..... Oh well, i think i answered your question.


Terry

 

[GSGoinFast]

Ok sorry I was MIA, just got back from vacation

The head has very little to do with compression.

When it comes to our swap, true, but when dealing with engine design in general, the head has a lot to do with it. I am pretty sure you know that and meant that, but I just wanted to make sure that didn't confuse anyone.

Otherwise just listen to Terry on everything.

On the part about piston velocity and upper end power, Paul is right to a point. Longer stroke will increase piston velocity given the same rod ratio. The cure for loss of power due to piston velocity increase can be eliminated by using a long rod kit, but you would need custom rods and pistons made which I cannot afford.

 

[VelocitàPaola]

When it comes to our swap, true, but when dealing with engine design in general, the head has a lot to do with it. I am pretty sure you know that and meant that, but I just wanted to make sure that didn't confuse anyone.

You're exactly right, sorry if I confused anyone. What I meant was that the head is usually the last thing one considers when choosing a compression ratio (unless it needs to be decked, or you're looking for a very specific ratio, etc.). This is at least true for us 2.0L 420A builders using standard piston sizes...

EDIT: You guys are nit-pickers.

 

[Talon ESI-T]

Actually some consideration needs to be taken when choosing compression ratio and a 2.0 head. Our combustion chamber is different than the 2.4.

I had to give the CC vol of my head to Venolia when I ordered my pistons. Otherwise the Compression ratio would have been much different than i had planned.

If your just using shelf pistons then sure, you dont need to consider what your head volumn is.

Terry

 

[Davion1089]

Ok, the 2.4L pulleys will not work on the 2.0L. the accessories are different and vary per model. I am kinda confused here, the title of the post is asking if the 2.4L is worth the work of the swap. Where did we go off track..... Oh well, i think i answered your question.


Terry

That's exactly what i needed to know and we got off track cause i decided if i can find the lightweight pulley etc. to go with the 2.0 then that's what i'd stick with..Thanx thou.

 

[AL92]

I just did the swap but in a 7 bolt turbo car. It was not all that fun but have done harder swaps.Not sure if its that much harder in an nt.
So far I am very happy with it ,the engine is much better off boost and still think a reasonable 8000 rpm limit is more than enough for me.
I would not hesitate to build a 2.3 either just that got lucky and found a low mileage 2.4 engine in hyundai sonata circa 89 to 91. Its 6 bolt .

 

[VelocitàPaola]

I just did the swap but in a 7 bolt turbo car. It was not all that fun but have done harder swaps.Not sure if its that much harder in an nt.
So far I am very happy with it ,the engine is much better off boost and still think a reasonable 8000 rpm limit is more than enough for me.
I would not hesitate to build a 2.3 either just that got lucky and found a low mileage 2.4 engine in hyundai sonata circa 89 to 91. Its 6 bolt .

I think you got lost and stumbled into the wrong forum...

The 2.4L swap that you did involved a 4G64 block (made my Mitsubishi). The swap we're talking about is for 2G N/T cars, which require a 2.4L 420A (made by Chrylser).

 

[AL92]

Oops..sorry you are right..my mistake..