Passenger Seatbelt Problem - *Motor doesn't run!

[DSMRevolution]

Ok my passenger seatbelt quit working awhile back and I am finally getting around to fixing it. It worked fine when I got the car. Now a couple weeks ago it would studder as it was moving. It would go, stop, go, stop, then finally be down in the B pillar or up on the A pillar. It was like that for a couple weeks until it finally quit working. The problem is that I can not figure out what is wrong!

Here is what I tired:

I took apart the passenger (right) seatbelt motor and cleaned it out. All windings on the armature look fine along with the brushes. So the motor is not the problem.

I am getting power through the large white wire that goes to the relay. This white wire feeds both passenger side and drivers side relays and the DRIVERS SIDE SEATBELT WORKS FINE.

I have good grounds.

The warning lights work fine. In other words, if I plug in the seatbelt, the dash light indiactor goes away.

The door switch is fine.

Also the relay is in working order.




ANY help would be great! Its driving me crazy that I can't figure this out. Does this sound like a faulty control unit? Thanks a lot in advance

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by DSMRevolution
...
it finally quit working. The problem is that I can not figure out what is wrong!

Here is what I tired:
...
the motor is not the problem.
...
ANY help would be great! Its driving me crazy that I can't figure this out. Does this sound like a faulty control unit? Thanks a lot in advance

You don't mention checking the mechanical aspects of the mechanism. I've not had an occasion to get into one of these but you have essentially a flex worm screw which has extremes. These can either be on a timer or have a switch of sorts at the travel ends which tells the motor to stop. Have you checked to see this is functioning or that the carrier has not stripped?

Cheers,
GTM

 

[DSMRevolution]

Thanks a lot for the reply. Are you talking about the worm screw that is part of the armature on the motor? That is fine, but I haven't checked the whole assembly. The thing is though, the relay isn't ingaging even though it is fine. The motor isn't even getting power. I can mechanicly move the seatbelt using the supplied jack screw adapter. On the rear panel you can just pop out that plastic insert then you can move the seatbelt up and down. I think mechanicly the belt is fine though. The timer though is worth considering. I think I will check that out tomorrow. Thanks a lot for the help. I also have a electrical diagram that I will post tomorrow for you electrical gurus out there. I went to school for electrical, but it wasn't the greatest when it came to how the complete assembly actually works.

Thanks again

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by DSMRevolution
Thanks a lot for the reply.
...
I also have a electrical diagram that I will post tomorrow for you electrical gurus out there. I went to school for electrical, but it wasn't the greatest when it came to how the complete assembly actually works.

It sounds like a micro switch or optical device which determines when it's reached it's limit has stuck in the open position or burned out. Something in the path has to switch polarity and that could be the source as well.

A limit switch has to tell the relay where the belt is... up / down. Either it's getting it's signal from physical contact at the end, a gear drive which as mentioned is on a timer, cam lobe, or counting revs. Can you hot wire the relay thus bypassing the problem portion?

Cheers,
GTM

 

[DSMRevolution]

I got to hand it to you, you definatly know what you are talking about. Anyways I will bypass the relay tomorrow morning and I'll post the results. I am excited to find out what the problem is! It looks like there is a couple of different switches. Not sure their locations, but here are a couple of diagnostic electrical charts.

 

[DSMRevolution]

Number 1

 

[DSMRevolution]

Aaaaaand number 2

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by DSMRevolution
I got to hand it to you, you definatly know what you are talking about. Anyways I will bypass the relay tomorrow morning and I'll post the results.
......................
I am excited to find out what the problem is!
...

What do you expect me to do with those, just a bunch of funny drawings by some drunk.
.......................

Me too!! hehehe Let me get up to speed.

Wonder what they mean by "release switch" comes in as a YR and exits as a R / [E07] >>ground?

Cheers,
GTM

 

[DSMRevolution]

Well I don't believe its the ground. I will double check that but the ground (08) is a dual ground location for both release switches and like I said, the drivers side belt works. Its always worth a check though. I guess my next thing would be to look for the release switch. I am asuming it is a mechanical switch of some sorts since I don't see a bimetalic strip or anything in the diagram.

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by DSMRevolution
...
I guess my next thing would be to look for the release switch. I am asuming it is a mechanical switch of some sorts since I don't see a bimetalic strip or anything in the diagram.

Connector E-61 looks to be a place to pin-out with your test light. Further upstream are pins 15&16 at the control unit which also find their way to ground. I sometimes find it's useful to draw my own diagram indicating pin-out results especially on conditional circuits. I just can't cope with more than half dozen if this then that, therefore check here conditions. The fact it started misbehaving over a period of time might suggest a loose connection that looks good but just needs to be unplugged and plugged a couple of times. After that you may be looking at a failed transistor in the control unit.

Cheers,
GTM

 

[DSMRevolution]

Ok thanks a bunch. I am going to go over the circuitry a few more times this evening. I think we are getting pretty close. I mechanicly moved the seatbelt up to the apillar and when I started the car, It automaticly moved to the B pillar. It will not move back, but everytime I move it mechanicly up the A, it will return to the B when I start the car.

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by DSMRevolution
Ok thanks a bunch. I am going to go over the circuitry a few more times this evening. I think we are getting pretty close. I mechanicly moved the seatbelt up to the apillar and when I started the car, It automaticly moved to the B pillar. It will not move back, but everytime I move it mechanicly up the A, it will return to the B when I start the car.

Super, that's what I was hoping for. Sorry don't know A from B position but it sounds like "Release" or the "Fasten" switch, E-61 connec plug, or pins 15/16 have an open circuit possibly at "E-38.

The default is an open on 15 thus 16 should be a completed circuit to ground with the key off and door closed.
...................I Think...........

Cheers,
GTM