Fresh build blwoing gas outa ex mani. VIDEO

[darkiller_666]

Just got done putting my new head on with MLS gasket. Also used a MLS exhaust manifold gasket. Copper spray on both. Car started first try idled well. First time i go to drive i dont make it 20 feet and the car starts smoking like crazy smells like fuel. Come home pop the hood, fuel is dripping from my o2 dump exhaust and outa my exhaust mani gasket. Here is a video. Please help. Also car was flooded very badly a few days ago. We drained all the fluids, oil coolant trannie transfer case and differential.
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[dawid4444]

did u set the timing belt right??

 

[need2boostpsi]

maybe a sticking injector that has stuck open, also double check your timing marks, not that that would have anything to do with it but it helps with everything else. I would recomend pulling the injector and testing to see if it seals.

 

[darkiller_666]

did u set the timing belt right??

Timing is 100% right. guarantee. I dont see how this really involves my situation.

maybe a sticking injector that has stuck open, also double check your timing marks, not that that would have anything to do with it but it helps with everything else. I would recomend pulling the injector and testing to see if it seals.

So i pulled the fuel rail off and hook injectors up one at a time to compare the injector cycle. That cylinders injector is spraying like mad.tried swapping injectors around so its not them cause all injectors only do it on that cylinders injector clip. All currency for the four injector pin outs on the ecu are the same. I also use a 1g CAS.

 

[96eclipzGsT]

That looks a little much to be fuel. It may be water with fuel mixed in it from being in the cylinder, that is the reason it smells like fuel. My guess is the head has a huge crack in it.

 

[darkiller_666]

It is straight fuel dumping into the cylinder that injector sprays constantly.

That looks a little much to be fuel. It may be water with fuel mixed in it from being in the cylinder, that is the reason it smells like fuel. My guess is the head has a huge crack in it.

The cylinders were fresh bored and cleaned for almost and hour with lent free towels and seafoam by me and a buddy, brand new head. I dont know where you think water is getting in there or why it would be cracked?

 

[96eclipzGsT]

How brand new... Brand new out of the junkyard or rebuilt and magnafluxed from machine shop for 500+

Pull the fuel relay and spin it over see what happens. I would also do a compression test.

 

[96eclipzGsT]

What did you torque the head to?

 

[darkiller_666]

The number 4 injector is getting signal and continuity from all four ECU pin outs of the injectors. So it is getting the signal from 1 2 3 and 4, or ECU pin out 1 2 14 15, which is causing it dump gas like a crazy women.

 

[darkiller_666]

What did you torque the head to?

82, followed exact torque sequence and detorque sequence with moly lube and checked it 3 times.

 

[darkiller_666]

How brand new... Brand new out of the junkyard or rebuilt and magnafluxed from machine shop for 500+

Pull the fuel relay and spin it over see what happens. I would also do a compression test.

Compression test turned out great, i had recently read an article about why not to use copper spray, i decided to and glad i did so far, good and even across the board. Though it was a little lower then normal, i did use a MLS gasket. I just spend 490 dollars at the shop completely rebuilding this head. It is all new. 16 new guides, new valves, spring, retainers, lifters, stem seals. Cleaned polished and painted with hightemp.

What do you mean by spin the MPFI relay over?

 

[96eclipzGsT]

And you can unplug that injector, start it on 3 cylinders, and it dries up??

 

[darkiller_666]

And you can unplug that injector, start it on 3 cylinders, and it dries up??

Yeah and if i switch injectors around they all do it in that cylinder. it runs much better on three then with the 4th blowing gas. Again my injector clip is getting continuity from all 4 ECU pin outs for injectors. WHY?

 

[donniekak]

Try another ecu.

 

[Rob10_99]

yeah. and if i switch injectors around they all do it in that cylinder. it runs much better on three then with the 4th blowing gas. Again my injector clip is getting continuity from all 4 ecu pin outs for injectors. WHY?

Trace it back to where the insulators are broken/worn through. Either tape(ghetto) or put some shrink wrap tubing on each wire around that break.
Sounds like you pinched the harness putting the head back in. Your injectors sound like they are ok if you swapped them around and another injector did the same thing.

That's a flamethrower waiting to happen!

 

[darkiller_666]

I am thinking it might not be the wires because the pin outs from the ecu are showing continuity though the wires together. Its hard to explain. I pull the injector clip from the fuel rail. Put a 12 gauge wire in one of the plugs. Run the wire down by my ecu. hook negative side of a voltameter to the lead wire from the injctor. Put the the positive side in ECU pin out 1 2 14 and 15. It shows continuity through all 4 pinouts. Now if i check a different injector plug the same way. It only shows continuity through 3-4 and 1-2. Could this have something to do with trying to use a 1g CAS?

 

[Rob10_99]

That's exactly what it is, do you have your old cas or head timing setup still?
That continuity is just on the ground side, you won't be able to catch the voltage to turn the injectors on.

Just found this on the web, quoted from the talk:
Like I said in my other post, though, cars with 96 or 96 ECUs might not want to do this mod, since it screws up your injector timing. Rewiring the injector harness would probably get you back to running normally without the fuel pooling problem. But as far as I know, no one has done this yet.

The firing order is 1-3-4-2. I'm not sure what direction the cam angle sensor is off between the 97 and 95 cars.

I think you have one of two choices to make things work right.
3 1 4 2 <- Injector harness
4 3 2 1 <- Cylinder

2 4 1 3 <- Injector harness
4 3 2 1 <- Cylinder

If you look at the way you have to swap spark plug wires, there are only two ways that you could swap the injectors around and still have it make sense. When you swap the spark plug wires, you swap them such that the 1 and 4 plug wires are where the 2 and 3 plug wires used to be, and vice versa. Since it is a waste spark system, it doesn't matter if you swap between 1 and 4 or 2 and 3. But it DOES matter with the injectors. The injector firing order is shifted. So to come up with those orders, I just shifted the injector wires along the firing order in either direction by one cylinder. That gets you both possible combinations where the 1 and 4 injector wires end up on the 2 and 3 cylinders.

Perhaps someone can study the trigger plate of the 95 sensor a bit more to come up with the exact order.

Again, this last part is just for cars with 1995 or 1996 ECUs. 1997 and up cars had their cam angle sensors on the same side of the head as the 1G cars, so there is no problem.

If you do have to swap the injectors around, the easiest way to do it is right at the ECU. All the wires are right next to eachother. Just swap the pins around.
The only problems I have heard associated with not swapping the injectors is a miss at idle. Perhaps some weird part throttle problems. Not something that a lot of people will notice.

At WOT, the injectors fire at a certain time before the intake stroke. But they also fire every 10ms. And then towards the upper RPM range, they are on almost all the time. With that much fuel being injected basically "around the clock," it really isn't going to matter much if the injector's initial fire is off by 180 degrees.

So, try it, and see if you can live with it, or if you even notice. But if you just think your car is slower than it ought to be, try swapping the injector wires.


/quote

Go check what year ecu yours is before you swap anything around.

 

[darkiller_666]

It is a 95. Im a lil confused by the post. Basically the 1g CAS sends an inverted signal causing my injector to fire constantly? Any way someone could break this down in lamen terms on how to fix it maybe? Could i possible just wire the injector into one of the other injectors to fire right? Do 2 injectors fire together or is it all seperate?

 

[darkiller_666]

A local told me to check my "resistor box" i dont know what that is or how to check it. Could this also be the coulprit? My car did run before with this 1g setup. Im still thrown off that it is constantly firing fuel.

 

[Rob10_99]

Ok if it ran fine before then did you check for a pinched harness?
If it were your resistor box it wouldn't be getting fuel.

What happens if you unplug that 4th cylinder and turn the key on, does it pump fuel out like its stuck open?
Have a friend key on/off and see if that injector stays open when the key is on. You should be able to feel it click with your finger on it.

 

[darkiller_666]

If i undo that cylinder spark and injector the car starts right up and runs well, for being short a cylinder, as soon as i hook it back up the car starts bogging and u smell fuel bad! I took the fuel rail off and checked and it is allways spraying that injector. I undid the whole harness and followed the two wires from the injector as far as i could and taped them seperately to make sure they werent touching each other. It is staying open all the time. Whats up with the "resistor box" could it be a couplrit? Do two injectors fire together or is it all seperate?

 

[->PrOjEcTGS<-]

Do you have anyone else with a '95 ECU? I'd try swapping that out as well as reverting back to the stock Cam/Crank Sensor. Eliminate all of the variables from what you changed since the last time it ran properly.

 

[malibu80]

Ok, from my understanding, the car was running without this problem before you changed head gasket and now you have this problem?

 

[jrohner]

You did the correct things so far diagnosing the issue. Next things: First I would check for a pinched or bare wire. Second I would try a different fuel control relay, which is located right next to the ECU (lower right corner). Two bolts hold it in, use an 8mm socket. Next I would try a different injector resistor box.

 

[darkiller_666]

I can pretty much rule out the pinched bare wire thing. Again i have the wiring harness cut open and the injector clip wires separately wrapped from each other all the way to the firewall. Where and what is the resistor box? Is there a way to check the MPFI relay with a multimeter?

My car has not been running for a few months ### i couldn't afford it. The car previously had the 1g cas and ran well. I know this isnt anything to do with my HG job. Again Brand new head, surfaced to a mirror finish, fresh decked block, MLS gasket, copper spray, proper torque, ARP's, MLS exhaust gasket also copper sprayed, timing is perfect, checked about 3 times before i put everything back on. Head was properly lubed before reassembly. Car was recently flooded.

I do not have access to a new ECU or any money left for a 80 dollar sensor. Nor do i want to undo all my soldering to convert back to 2g CPS.

I am going to try running the bad injector off of the signal to the other corresponding injector and see how that works.

Whats left as potential culprits (possible fixes)

ECU (evo8 ecu)
MPFI relay (how to check? multimeter?)
Resistor box (multimeter?) Apparently id have no fuel if it was bad????????????
Wires ground short ( almost positive this is not it)
Pinched Harness (Check tomorrow)
Wish i knew someone locally to just test parts with.