[RESOLVED] Lifter questions

[Whitetal]

I've had my 91 Talon for over 5 years now. Just recently I found out about the lifters how they depress. My bro in law has a 97 GST Spyder and it was ticking loud so he bought new lifters and I replaced them for him and now it sound brand new. He let me have his old ones after telling me something about sticking a pin into it and cleaning oil out. I didn't really pay attention much but after I took them, I noticed that I can press down on the lifters. I replaced my lifters with his 2g lifters. I started it up and it sounds terrible. Very very loud under the valve cover. Though this is what it sounded like before with my original lifters. The sound is very loud. Not really ticking sound. Don't know how to explain the sound but more like loud rattle. I opened valve cover and couple of the lifters were still depressable. I know the solution is to replace with revised lifters.

I want to know how the hydro lifters work in the valve train. Is there a link to this info. I know how the valve train works with the cam, rockers, valve, and lifters. What I'm wondering is how the hydro lifter works. How does oil pressure affect it's performance? Is it adjusting all the time or pretty much solid after oil has pressurized it. Where is it ticking, the cam lobe to the roller or the rocker to the lifter?

 

[interex]

Your tick is coming from between the top of the lifter and the groove in the rocker. The 1G and 2G lifters have a small oiling hole and if they are clogged up then no oil will be able to flow between the lifter and the rocker arm.

As for the way a hydraulic lifter works is to make sure the valve train operates with 0 clearance to maintain a quiet operation. If you lose oil pressure or have very little oil pressure or your lifters are clogged your hydraulic lifter can collapse thus causing it to tap against the rocker arm.

I just ordered a set of Topline Revised 4g63 Lifters with larger oiling hole for $89.00 tonight, not a bad price and SBR uses these lifters on all their heads.

 

[Whitetal]

By collapsing you mean the lifter will depress down? So does oil pressure keep it up? I though that once oil goes into it, the lifter can't depress down.

 

[interex]

The oil pressure in the lifter allows it to act like a cushion so that it "rides" easily on the valve train. The lifter can either depress and stop acting as a cushion, or can freeze while pressurized and be solid which you can try to bleed it off and re-use it but I'd replace them.

 

[Whitetal]

What is it that makes the lifters go bad that causes it to tick?

 

[tsiboostin]

I just ordered a set of Topline Revised 4g63 Lifters with larger oiling hole for $89.00 tonight, not a bad price and SBR uses these lifters on all their heads.

Where did you get them for that price?

 

[interex]

Bad hydraulic lifters are more noticeable during idle then during flight. A worn hydraulic lifter that leaks oil causes rocker arm to valve clearance. The rocker arm strikes the valve tip instead of pushing the valve open, resulting in a tapping noise. The noise goes away as the cold engine oil flows into the hydraulic lifter. Cold oil, being more viscous, doesn't leak out the hydraulic lifter as fast as hot oil. This causes the hydraulic lifter to pump up, closing the tappet clearance and causing the tapping noise to go away. This is fine and should not be a concern if the noise goes away shortly. If tappet noise occurs regularly then replace the hydraulic lifters. Worn or defective lifters cause the valve to pound against the seat, possibly causing valve breakage.

 

[BoostyTSi]

Can't you use 3g lifters as well? I'm pretty sure thats what I put in my 90 when I had it and the lifter tick went away

 

[interex]

The reason people buy the 3G Lifters is because of the new design with the larger oiling hole, which is what the "Revised Lifters" are anyway.

 

[BoredDSM]

To diffuse any chance of possible confusion 3g lifters are lifters out of an evo. Evo's are the 3rd generation of 4g63's. Generally the evo valvetrain is better or the same as ours which is why we use the rockers, lifters, and springs and retainers out of them.

The ticking is from lack of oil because the lifter oiling hole is to small. If you purchase a set of 3g lifters and compare them to your current lifters, the 3g ones will be massive.

http://www.mirage-performance.com/sonata/CylinderHead/Lifters004t.jpg

Theres a pic comparing the two. As you can see the ones on the left look a lot larger than the ones on the right.

 

[Whitetal]

What if I drilled the hole bigger in my 1g lifters? After my calculations, the closest drill bit to a 3mm hole would be an 1/8 which is actually one hundreths of an inch bigger. Not a significant difference. I have a drill press and clamps. I'll just do it for fun. Has anyone in the past asked this or tried this before?

 

[BoredDSM]

You can't do that because you would drill out those layers hold everything together. Sure you could do it for fun but you won't be able to use them at all.

 

[interex]

$100 isnt a bad price for lifters so you should just order them and stop worrying about your 1G lifters.

 

[Whitetal]

Yeah I know that's why I already said in my original post that I knew the revised lifters is the solution. I just want to see what could happen.

 

[Whitetal]

Do you guys think it matters if the rocker arms get mixed up?

 

[interex]

In my opinion, no.

 

[Whitetal]

Me neither.

 

[jenkinsfan1]

Go to the Mitsu dealer ship and get 3G lifters I did and they work great no noise what so ever.

 

[interex]

Why? The revised are just as good as the 3G lifters and at a much better price. They are an OEM replacement with the large oiling hole just like the 3g anyway. They are called "Revised" for a reason.

 

[DSMunknown]

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/151489885-post6.html
Lifter VFAQ

 

[Whitetal]

Anyone able to depress the 1g lifters? I tried with a needle but was not able too. How long does it have to go down? I read that there's a switch that will release the check valve. The longest needle I could find at the moment only goes in a little past half way down the lifter.

By the way, I tried drilling the hole down the lifter. Seems impossible. Every drill bit I used seemed to have no effect on the lifter. Feels like the bit is just spinning smoothly on the lifter. Feels like there's no surface for the bit to grab to.

How would a solid lifter run in the head? I know there are some but does solid lifters get rid of the tick. Here's another idea. What if I welded the lifters solid so that the top cannot depress anymore? I know it's crazy. Just want to try different things for fun and see if the results can turn into something good. The drilling thing ain't gonna work.