Major knock issues! What is wrong?

[EagleTalonTim]

I have been fighting with this for about 2 weeks now and I am stumped. After doing a complete tune up including changing plugs, wires, fuel filter, air filter, O2 sensor and adjusting the timing, I still have major counts of knock up to 43 counts of knock just while cruising down the road. It only happens sometimes and that is what is confusing me.

Here is my setup :
NO BOOST LEAKS
JDM 6-Bolt
BPR6ES NGK plugs gapped at .28
Timing set at 5* BTDC
Stock fuel pump
Stock 13g turbo that comes on automatics
450 injectors with Manual Transmission ECU
Cyclone intake with flaps open all the time since I can't figure it out and can't afford to get extra parts to make it work.
K&N air filter with hacked can.
Nothing to tune with.
Everything else is stock.

I can't afford to go out and buy anything to tune with right now so I have to just get the settings right on my car now so I don't blow anything up.

Here is a log of a test drive that I did today : http://www.dsmtrend.com/tim/2008-03-23.html

Any help would greatly be appreciated!

 

[EagleTalonTim]

Ok, someone told me that knock while cruising is ok. What would cause knock only in first gear starting from a stop? The rest of the gears at WOT is 0 counts of knock.

 

[Rob10_99]

The cruise knock is from piston slap of some sort at light/no load. Which is very annoying on the freeway.
Have you tried to pull the timing back from the CAS and see if that solves it?
But since you have no knock WOT I dont see any other issues. I think I had the same problem you have now, knocking below 3k in first seems to me like timing is too advanced.

 

[Rob10_99]

Looked a little bit more at the log and it seems even though your getting knock, timing is not being pulled.
Anyone know what the stock threshhold for knock retard is? I thought it was 5deg knock but I could be wrong.

 

[EagleTalonTim]

Piston slap? What exactly is that and is there a fix to that without rebuilding the motor?

 

[SloGN]

have you checked the knock sensor to see if it is starting to leak the black goo of death out of it?

Also there is no way to cure piston slap. the only way is to bore the block and installed larger pistons.

but you could maybe have a wrist pin slap and the involves changing out that rod/piston.

 

[EagleTalonTim]

I would be able to hear a slapping wrist pin though wouldn't I? I will check on the knock sensor tomorrow.

 

[bacalhau16]

Do you possibly still have the stock intake. Perhaps you intake setup right now is messing with your 1g maf. They arent very good anyway.

 

[EagleTalonTim]

Yeah, I do have a stock intake from my 7 bolt. The cyclone came with the JDM motor and I just left it on there. Would I be able to just get a 2g MAF and things be a little better?

 

[EagleTalonTim]

Ok, I just replaced the Knock sensor and I am still getting the same result. I am getting tired of sitting next to a honda wanting to race me and as soon as I take off, it feels like the car surges and is very hesitant to take off because of major timing pulls from knock. As soon as I let off the gas and get back on it again, the knock goes away. How to I get rid of this?

 

[SloGN]

Ok, I just replaced the Knock sensor and I am still getting the same result. I am getting tired of sitting next to a honda wanting to race me and as soon as I take off, it feels like the car surges and is very hesitant to take off because of major timing pulls from knock. As soon as I let off the gas and get back on it again, the knock goes away. How to I get rid of this?

go with a aftermarket ecm. The stock 1g knock sensor are pos and they tend to read alot of false knock. when i ran the stock ecm i simply drove the car with the knock sensor unhooked. i didn't beat ont he car i just needed to drive it to work and back without it doing tricks and stuff.

I dunno if the 1g ecm with work with the 2g knock sensors with having any issues. The 2g knock sensor don't tend to have the Phantom knock as they call it.

something else you can try is to take your old knock sensor and plug it up and just wrap it up in a sock so it can't bang around and verify that thecheck engine light is out first. then you can try driving the car around to see if it still does it. have you checked the base timing ? the timing set wrong will make it act crazy too. check all the basic before you think it might be pulling timing due to false knock.

HTH

pat broughton

 

[EagleTalonTim]

I have checked my base timing with a timing light and it is at 5* BTDC. I also put teflon tape on the threads to dampen some of the knock it may be picking up. I still get 20 to 43 counts of knock when taking off from a dead stop. When at WOT and moving, I get 0 counts of knock. The timing pull is defiantly caused by knock. I need to get rid of it somehow.

 

[JeffGST]

I have checked my base timing with a timing light and it is at 5* BTDC. I also put teflon tape on the threads to dampen some of the knock it may be picking up. I still get 20 to 43 counts of knock when taking off from a dead stop. When at WOT and moving, I get 0 counts of knock. The timing pull is defiantly caused by knock. I need to get rid of it somehow.

Knock counts during vacuum conditions can be ignored. Knock during boost conditions are always of concern.

There is nothing you can really do, unless you have DSMlink. Don't stress over knock in vacuum.

 

[twack]

Ok so your problem is when LAUNCHING you get knock and it makes the timing pull = no power. That log really dosnt help because it dosnt say at what rev your high knock was at. You got to look for loose things, is your turbo have shaft play? you are using 93 octane right. try using 20w-50, ith those stiffer mounts things are going to rattle harder. it could be rich knock from all you mt parts with your at turbo and fpr. but still at that high of knock it is phantom. try taking the sensor out and put it in the firewall but keep it plugged in and all knock should go away.

 

[bacalhau16]

That is a ton of knock. I would maybe try and put your stock intake back on for a little bit. See what happens. Im not sure what elso it could be. "Phantom Knock" as everyone else says it could be.

 

[EagleTalonTim]

the intake that is on the motor now is what came with that motor. I have not broken and gasket seals since I could not afford to buy more gaskets after purchasing that motor. I have noticed that my turbo makes a strange vacuum cleaner sound every once in awhile. I think I may have blown my turbo and it could be causing the knock. I will check on that as soon as i can.