brake rotor vfaq

[b00sted99-X]

is there ANY brake rotor / brake pad changing VFAQ out there for a 2G AWD? i have the shop and chilton's manual for my car but its not very clear on what i have to do.. i'd love a nice walkthrough and some pics so i don't do it half assed.. its the braking system we're talking about here -- pretty important IMO. thanks.

 

[NJGSX96]

http://www.vfaq.com/mods/BrakeRotors.html
http://www.vfaq.com/mods/BigBrakesInstall.html

For a 1G, but really no different. Remove wheel, remove caliper, remove rotor.
Reinstall rotor, reinstall caliper, with new pads if you prefer, reinstall wheel.

Brakes are an easy thing to do, as long as the rotors come off nicely. That is usually the worse part.

 

[b00sted99-X]

thanks i had seen those already.. they seemed too simplified for me.. the chiltons manual says stuff about doing wierdness with the piston(?) also they want you to drain half the fluid from the master cylinder before you start.. i also have no idea how to bleed the brakes. the shop manual also has some special tool listed you need for compressing pistons? all of that info just served to confuse me more.. was looking for a really newbie-ized faq. i mean i can pull the bolts, follow directions perfectly but i need to know exactly what i'm doing. thanks for the help, i'll try to re-read these and my books and see if i can make more sense of it. i really don't want to take this to a mechanic.. live and learn

 

[cmc]

Just take off the caliper, knock rotors off, put them back on, compress the pistons, put on caliper, then pads, then thats it! Basically. Not hard!

 

[b00sted99-X]

hehe thanks for the quick overview.. that really does sound simple enough, however (newb colors coming through) i had never even changed my own oil until i bought this car late last year. i've been learning everything step by step, doing my own bolt ons, changing all the fluids, but those were all from vfaqs. the questions i have about changing brakes are.. for example, do i need a special tool to compress the pistons like my shop manual says? what does compressing the pistons actually do before you put the caliper back on and why do you have to do it (probably sounds like a really stupid question but bear with me.. learning)? do i need to remove brake fluid from the master cylinder before compressing the pistons to avoid overflow? do i need to bleed / flush my brakes when i'm finished the job? how do you install brake pads, do they just slip or clamp on (<-- don't laugh).

I've never even seen a brake assembly taken apart so maybe some of this i could figure out just by looking how everything fits together.. but right now i just have a buncha questions about it. Thanks for listening.

 

[Tevenor]

To compress the pistons (assuming they aren't seized):

1) Open the brake fluid resovoir cap.
2) take the caliper with pistons still in in your hands.
3) Squeeze REALLY hard (you should feel the piston move, it is stiff).
4) Try to fit the pads in the caliper bracket and slide the caliper over the pads. If they don't fit, repeat 3 and 4. If they do, shim, reattach the caliper then bleed.

 

[cmc]

This is what I use, its a clap!! (To compress piston) Oh yea, don't forget before you move to pump brake several times until they catch!

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

 

[b00sted99-X]

, a CLAP? i don't want to catch that..
anyways, yeah i see... i guess you can use anything to compress the piston, not just the 'special tool' that is listed in the shop manual

that's cool.. with all this new info, and my manuals, i'll attempt the rotor/pad change this weekend.. wish me luck!

 

[crankbender]

Don't just compress them on that car. ABS systems can be seriously messed up if you force the fluid backwards through the lines in any serious quantity. You simply have to pull the bleeder valve on the caliper to make sure you don't put pressure down the line. You have to bleed the brakes afterwords because you have to open the valve...on non abs cars you don't have to open the valve and don't have to bleed them.

just don't want to see you have to do a serious fix because you didn't take the 30 seconds to pull the bleeder valve.

 

[Ludachris]

That special tool is pretty cheap at the parts store... just go in and ask for one, cause it's damn hard to get most pistons compressed enough by hand. The piston should be flush with the caliper - totally compressed. You'll need a helper to bleed the master cylinder. Just keep reading the Chiltons manual, it didn't make sense to me either at first... and have extra fluid on hand - you'll likely waste alot.

 

[b00sted99-X]

regarding the bleeder valve / ABS brakes: ok see this is what i'm talking about.. little tips that are common knowledge to experienced tuners but things that could screw me up bad since i don't know what i'm doing (yet) -- this is why i usually rely on vfaqs since they usually go overboard on the detail of what you have to do. maybe i'll just go out and get some speed bleeders while i'm messing with these brakes.

 

[Tevenor]

Originally posted by Ludachris
That special tool is pretty cheap at the parts store... just go in and ask for one, cause it's damn hard to get most pistons compressed enough by hand. The piston should be flush with the caliper - totally compressed. You'll need a helper to bleed the master cylinder. Just keep reading the Chiltons manual, it didn't make sense to me either at first... and have extra fluid on hand - you'll likely waste alot.

Its not hard if you open the bleeder valve. If you can't compress a piston by hand with the valve open, you have other problems. This way you are not forcing the fluid 'back through the system' but out the caliper. I am not saying its cake. You can't be a 110 lb wimp to do it.

Oh and I would ALWAYS bleed my brakes, ABS or not. If you have ever felt your brakes disappear on you in an autocross, you will be almost fanatical about bleeding. I bleed them before every race and at least once a month.

 

[b00sted99-X]

ok lets see if i got this straight. on my 2G GSX with ABS i should:

1. jack car up, remove wheel
2. remove bolts, remove caliper
3. remove rotor
4. put new rotor on
5. open brake fluid reservoir cap, remove some fluid
6. open bleeder screw (as to not screw up ABS by forcing liquid backward)
7. compress pistons by hand (liquid shoots out of bleeder?)
8. put new pads on
9. put caliper back on (do i need to regrease anything? read something about a guide pin and what not) and bolt back up -- what is shimming?
10. bleed brakes and add new brake fluid

is that all? did i miss anything? of course i'm going to go back and read my shop manuals but just by breaking this out step by step i'm beginning to understand more about this process. i really appreciate everyone's help. if this goes right i might think about making a vfaq myself

ONE MORE THING. i found a product called motive power bleeder

http://www.machv.com/motpowbleed.html

this seems to make bleeding the brakes stupidly simple.. do you all recommend i use this? i don't care about the cost, i just want to do this right and painless.

 

[Tevenor]

Originally posted by b00sted99-X
ok lets see if i got this straight. on my 2G GSX with ABS i should:
2. remove bolts, remove caliper

And the caliper mounting bracket. 2 17 mm bolts that bolt to the knuckle.

Originally posted by b00sted99-X
5. open brake fluid reservoir cap, remove some fluid

Add fluid. As you bleed and compress, some fluid will be drained through the system.

Originally posted by b00sted99-X
9. put caliper back on (do i need to regrease anything? read something about a guide pin and what not) and bolt back up -- what is shimming?
10. bleed brakes and add new brake fluid

Regrease the lock and slide pins that mount the caliper to the bracket. Make sure that on an ABS car you are running the engine while you bleed.

Originally posted by b00sted99-X
is that all? did i miss anything? of course i'm going to go back and read my shop manuals but just by breaking this out step by step i'm beginning to understand more about this process. i really appreciate everyone's help. if this goes right i might think about making a vfaq myself

ONE MORE THING. i found a product called motive power bleeder

http://www.machv.com/motpowbleed.html

this seems to make bleeding the brakes stupidly simple.. do you all recommend i use this? i don't care about the cost, i just want to do this right and painless.

Speed bleeders vary in design and usefulness. Some work very well and some don't work for $hit.

Find some that work well and they will be your best friends.

 

[b00sted99-X]

awesome.. thanks for the fixes to my list.. yeah i remembered the caliper / pad mounting bracket (cant get to the rotor with that thing on there) but forgot to write it

ok.. so by adding fluid to the reservoir, and then opening the bleeder valve, when i go to compress the piston to fit over the thicker new pads, fluid will drain out of the bleeder right? then it makes sense not to remove fluid. i had gotten this confused.. you remove fluid on non-ABS cars because when you compress pistons (with bleeder valve closed) then fluid shoots back UP into the reservoir and overflows. gotcha.

also i *just now* found a sort of vfaq

http://members.tripod.com/alexander_grabau/id15.htm -- these are 2 piston big brakes for galant VR-4s. i assume his isn't ABS because he didn't open a bleeder valve while compressing with channel locks, and didn't bleed the brakes at the end.

*whew* this has been a lot of info and learning.. and i haven't even touched the car yet! i really appreciate everyone's help.

 

[cmc]

Yea thats a big CLAP too. I took alot to catch that! j/k

 

[b00sted99-X]

Originally posted by crankbender
Don't just compress them on that car. ABS systems can be seriously messed up if you force the fluid backwards through the lines in any serious quantity.

Peter, not to doubt you but you seem to be the only one who has heard of this phenomenon on DSMs about three other DSM owners including a mechanic that claims he does brakes on 15+ cars per week, hasn't heard about damage caused by compressing pistons on an ABS system for our cars. None of my shop manuals have it either... you sure this is an issue on DSMs? I'll probably just go ahead and do it anyway since i'm bleeding the system when I'm done but just wondering if there's any documentation out there that specifically calls this issue out. Thanks.