SBR-GT10 BB vs. AGP SS44 (formerly L1R) differences?

[Sotarts]

I'm thinking of buying one of these turbos in near future.

SBR GT-10 or AGP SS44 - formerly known as L1R.

SBR say they use turbo housing made specifically to bolt to stock ex-mani and o2 housing (derived from mitsu 7cm housing).

AGP say all GT turbos are adapted to custom turbin housings that bolt to stock exhaust configuration.

As far as I understand, they both have the exact same cartridge and wheels.

Both flow 44 lb/min.

SBR has 3" inlet, 2" outlet. AGP has 2.75" inlet and 2" outlet. Both have T04B compressor housing.

They're both same freakin' price too.
Which one sounds like a better fit?

I'm thinking 3" inlet would be somewhat better, therefore SBR.

Can someone shed some light on this? I can't decide.

 

[jdmawd]

for the 9987546521326554855252186456954585452'th time


Before you ask about a TURBO!
If you're going to ask a question about a turbo here on DSMtuners, be sure you've read this whole message. We're going to be a little more strict about how turbo questions are asked in order to maintain the high level of quality in the forums. This is usually the most popular question, and the first question by newbies - and it shouldn't be. The truth is, you never need to ask which turbo to buy. You can answer your own question by reading and doing research on each turbo to find whether or not it will work for your goals. It's mostly personal preference anyway, as most turbos are capable of performance numbers that the average tuner will probably never see. Most of your questions can likely be answered by performing a search on the turbo name.

- Before you ask:
1. Be sure you have all your engine mods listed in your Profile.
2. Be sure you first understand what supporting mods are needed for larger turbos - check the Tuning Guide linked at the top.
3. No "X"-Turbo vs. "X"-Turbo threads... these are never useful.
4. Use the Private Message feature to ask various members about their setup.
5. Please avoid asking questions about turbo specs, unreleased turbos, or other questions that can be accurately answered by simply calling the manufacturer directly or visiting their website.
6. NO vague "which turbo should I get?" type questions. This tells us you don't even know the capabilities of the turbos on the market. Do your research and then ask a more intelligent question when you are more informed. Click the "Advanced Search" link up top and start looking for info on each turbo name.

- How to ask:
1. Ask about specific turbos only.
2. Title your thread specifically about the turbo you have a question on, and ask a specific question about that turbo.
3. Give all the information you possibly can in order to allow others to offer useful feedback.

- How to post an answer:
1. List your mods and achievements in your Profile.
2. List what your goals were when you, yourself were turbo shopping.
3. List what turbo(s) you went with - not which one(s) you didn't.
4. Post your experiences only for the turbo(s) you've used.
5. Do not give opinions on the turbo(s) you have no first-hand experience with.
6. Do not argue with other turbo owners from a competing manufacturer.
7. Stick to the topic. Give your feedback on the turbos in question. Don't try to talk the person into going with a different turbo manufacturer.
8. No bad-mouthing turbo manufacturers - use DSMreviews.com to review a part or a vendor.

 

[Sotarts]

Originally posted by jdmawd
for the 9987546521326554855252186456954585452'th time


Before you ask about a TURBO!
If you're going to ask a question about a turbo here on DSMtuners, be sure you've read this whole message. We're going to be a little more strict about how turbo questions are asked in order to maintain the high level of quality in the forums. This is usually the most popular question, and the first question by newbies - and it shouldn't be. The truth is, you never need to ask which turbo to buy. You can answer your own question by reading and doing research on each turbo to find whether or not it will work for your goals. It's mostly personal preference anyway, as most turbos are capable of performance numbers that the average tuner will probably never see. Most of your questions can likely be answered by performing a search on the turbo name.

- Before you ask:
1. Be sure you have all your engine mods listed in your Profile.
2. Be sure you first understand what supporting mods are needed for larger turbos - check the Tuning Guide linked at the top.
3. No "X"-Turbo vs. "X"-Turbo threads... these are never useful.
4. Use the Private Message feature to ask various members about their setup.
5. Please avoid asking questions about turbo specs, unreleased turbos, or other questions that can be accurately answered by simply calling the manufacturer directly or visiting their website.
6. NO vague "which turbo should I get?" type questions. This tells us you don't even know the capabilities of the turbos on the market. Do your research and then ask a more intelligent question when you are more informed. Click the "Advanced Search" link up top and start looking for info on each turbo name.

- How to ask:
1. Ask about specific turbos only.
2. Title your thread specifically about the turbo you have a question on, and ask a specific question about that turbo.
3. Give all the information you possibly can in order to allow others to offer useful feedback.

- How to post an answer:
1. List your mods and achievements in your Profile.
2. List what your goals were when you, yourself were turbo shopping.
3. List what turbo(s) you went with - not which one(s) you didn't.
4. Post your experiences only for the turbo(s) you've used.
5. Do not give opinions on the turbo(s) you have no first-hand experience with.
6. Do not argue with other turbo owners from a competing manufacturer.
7. Stick to the topic. Give your feedback on the turbos in question. Don't try to talk the person into going with a different turbo manufacturer.
8. No bad-mouthing turbo manufacturers - use DSMreviews.com to review a part or a vendor.

There are only TWO turbos like that out there, you DOLT! Might as well do a f*cking comparison between them.

And if you think there was already a discussion about these ONLY TWO TURBOS OF THIS KIND ON THE MARKET in comparison, be a good boy, and find it. F*cking DOLT!!! You make me sick.

 

[jdmawd]

Originally posted by aovsi


There are only TWO turbos like that out there, you DOLT! Might as well do a f*cking comparison between them.

3. No "X"-Turbo vs. "X"-Turbo threads... these are never useful.

 

[Sotarts]

Originally posted by jdmawd



3. No "X"-Turbo vs. "X"-Turbo threads... these are never useful.

Very useful in this instance! God f*cking damn you're slow!

And the fact that you're throwing some forum technicality that does not really apply here, is PATHETIC!

 

[mike9146]

It's really a shame that so many turbo comparison threads have turned into flame wars, thus causing the mods to institute the "No Direct Comparison" rules. I can understand why, but it doesn't change the fact that it's only natural (and necessary) to try to determine what performance characteristics a particular component (turbo in this case) has versus another in the same context.

The biggest problem I see, is that there is a tendency to use the word "Best" or "Better" when the term isn't warranted. There is no "Best" turbo for every application, as everyone's needs are different. If we could stop with using language that is inflammatory to describe a turbo's performance characteristics, we might be able discover some valuable information about a turbo that we might want to purchase. Personally, I would like to hear from people who have owned Brand X and Brand Y, and can offer a first-hand account of what he/she did or didn't like about either, without getting into hypotheticals. With so many choices these days, I think it's crazy that a proper technical discussion can't be of use when trying to narrow the choices. After all, we do "X versus Y" comparisons for every other go-fast part, why should turbos be any different, so long as the posts are kept scientific and non emotional? Just my $.02

 

[Sotarts]

Flaming is jdmawd's specialty. That's all he does. Check out his latest bash on a vendor.

Regarding this turbo comparison, I'm not looking for power output comparison, that's already known with AGP L1R reviews. SBR sells basically the same thing with few minor differences. I just wanted everyone's opinion on feasibility--involving those few differeces, as there are only two turbo's out there that I know in that category.

 

[Ben K]

Originally posted by aovsi

As far as I understand, they both have the exact same cartridge and wheels wheels.

No they do not.

I'm thinking 3" inlet would be somewhat better, therefore SBR.

You want a 3" inlet SS44? We can do that.

 

[Sotarts]

Originally posted by Ben K


No they do not.



You want a 3" inlet SS44? We can do that.

But that would drive up the cost? And SBR turbo already comes with a 3" inlet.

And since you say they do not have the same cartridge and wheels... yet both flow 44 lb/min. They're both not GT-10's?

Why should I consider AGP instead of SBR or SBR instead of AGP?

Does anyone have any info I can use?

I'd love to see SBR and AGP talk about their BB turbos in the same thread.

 

[Mike 99GSX]

Companies aren't just going to go into a sales competition over a public forum. The best thing you can do is make a list of all your questions and call both of them. See how each company answers your questions the best and makes you feel the most comfortable.

 

[Sotarts]

Originally posted by Mike 99GSX
Companies aren't just going to go into a sales competition over a public forum.

I fully realize that.

I think all the answers are answered on their sites. I don't know what else to ask. That's why I posted.

I want a fast-spooling ball-bearing turbo. Of course both turbos are overcompensation for what I'm looking to get out of my car performance-wise, but they both fully meet my needs. I consider them identical on the performance level. I just need to know the drawbacks or issues with either set-up that I'm not realizing.

And there seem to be no threads regarding that.

 

[Keaka26]

I e-mailed AGP about this already, and Im sure they get this question all the time. The response I got was:

Yes, the price of a bare L1R is $1200. And with an internal it's $1320.
Not sure why Ben never changed the website, it's been wrong for a long
time.
Just to set this point strait, the GT-10 has no parts in common with the
L1R. We tried the 700177-10 and it had as much lag as an L2R but made
much less power. Nothing like the L1R.
I could do you a custom extra large w/g flapper if you want but take it
from me, you don't want that. The flapper we use will have no problem
holding 13-14psi to redline with no creep. And when you go with a larger
flapper they tend to blow open at high RPM/ high boost and you get your
boost dropping off. But it is up to you, I can build you whatever you'd
like.

Kevin

I really like their customer service, and I hope to do business with them in the future.

 

[bigfoot]

AGP uses the better turbine housing, casted by PTE. It's designed for the Garrett wheel and it also flows better, it's not the same as the L1R.

jdmawd has a small dick and tries way too hard to compensate for it. :laugh:

 

[Sotarts]

Originally posted by Keaka26
I e-mailed AGP about this already, and Im sure they get this question all the time. The response I got was:

Yes, the price of a bare L1R is $1200. And with an internal it's $1320.
Not sure why Ben never changed the website, it's been wrong for a long
time.
Just to set this point strait, the GT-10 has no parts in common with the
L1R. We tried the 700177-10 and it had as much lag as an L2R but made
much less power. Nothing like the L1R.
I could do you a custom extra large w/g flapper if you want but take it
from me, you don't want that. The flapper we use will have no problem
holding 13-14psi to redline with no creep. And when you go with a larger
flapper they tend to blow open at high RPM/ high boost and you get your
boost dropping off. But it is up to you, I can build you whatever you'd
like.

Kevin

I really like their customer service, and I hope to do business with them in the future.

Awesome. Thanks for sharing.

Regarding the huge flapper blowing open, they offer this:
---------------------------------
"nternal Wastegate Option

For those of you who wish to run one of our DSM hybrid turbochargers with an internal wastegate, we can do it. We use a 15lb spring Garrett actuator that holds the oversized wastegate flapper valve closed for high boost pressures up to 25lbs and it doesn't creep at lower levels.

Price - $100"
---------------------------------

But aren't both of them using Garett dual row ball-bearing cartridges? So how do they not have parts in common?

I was sold on AGP in the begining, I think it's staying that way.

 

[Sotarts]

Originally posted by bigfoot


jdmawd has a small dick and tries way too hard to compensate for it. :laugh:

jdmawd has many more issues than that, we all know it. :laugh:

 

[Sotarts]

Originally posted by bigfoot


jdmawd has a small dick and tries way too hard to compensate for it. :laugh:

jdmawd (Mr. Cyclone ) has many more issues than that, we all know it. :laugh:

With all the bling-bling in his car, I'm surprised he's not runing a huge ball-bearing turbo to compensate further.

 

[jdmawd]

Originally posted by aovsi




With all the bling-bling in his car, I'm surprised he's not runing a huge ball-bearing turbo to compensate further.

Actually Im about to drop a "full evo spec motor with all the accessories " in my car.

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[Sotarts]

Originally posted by jdmawd


Actually Im about to drop a "full evo spec motor with all the accessories " in my car.

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You're still taking that literally? Dork.

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[jdmawd]

Originally posted by aovsi


You're still taking that literally? Dork.

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Did you ever get your definitive answer on that press bent exhaust system that you are plan to power that beast you have over there.:laughu