Yet Another 6 Bolt Swap No Start Go Figure

[jimbob_843]

Alright so my setup is a 95 gst with 6 bolt swap. 95 ecu no tuning stock everything other than 16g turbo and exhaust. 1g cas rewired the RRE version 2 way. RRE Instructions

Now everything was running fine upon 1st startup. Had a tapping noise from a slightly bent valve (discovered afterwards) but other than that nothing was wrong. Did a couple break in pulls and what not, then just started to cruise around. Next day was cruising for about 30 min or so and next thing i know the car dies out and i hear a loud backfire. First initial thought was oh great heres that 6 bolt swap misfire..but no. Let it sit to reset ecu swapped another cas (junkyard) and still nothing. Just turns over no start.
I have new valves they are lapped and seal perfect.
Fuel is getting to rail and into cylinders.
I have spark
ECU is good no signs of shorts.
I have no idea what is going on here guys. Things in question are thermo sensor? Knock sensor? injector firing order? Bad CAS??

Tommorow i am gonna get some starter fluid to spray to see if she fires up a lil. Feel like a noob all over again

Oh and mechanical timing is spot on.

 

[dsmlover07]

Ok have you checked your coolant temp sensor yet?
Sometimes it can cause your car not to start, problems i had with my tsi.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/421353-6-bolt-swap-no-start.html



This may help.

 

[jimbob_843]

Not yet i will tomorrow when i get a chance. The link just talked about firing order mess and a maf being bad. Which i dont think is my problem because my car will not actually start.

 

[dsmlover07]

Ok did you check out the ecu, is it in good shape, plugs, wires, etc.

 

[TAL0NTSi]

This may be an obvious question, but have you checked your timing marks? I had a similar situation after my build where I had a backfire followed by a no start. Turned out the timing belt tensioner failed causing the belt to jump a few teeth. No valves were bent, thank God, but all I had to do was re-time it and it fired right up.

 

[jimbob_843]

Yes this is all stated in the first post.

 

[TAL0NTSi]

Yes this is all stated in the first post.

I apologize, I don't know how I missed that in your post. The next thing I was going to say is it kind of sounds like a bad CAS. I would test that next.

 

[jimbob_843]

Wouldnt a bad cas cause no spark tho..?

 

[stuckwithgsx]

Does our factory oil pressure sending unit have any connection with starting issues?

Are you still running the 2g maf?

Boost leaks?

When you say it's not starting, what exactly is it doing? Is it turning over? Is it chugging like it wants to start? Does it sound like it's just rolling over and over with no intentions to start? Have you tried turning it over in the dark to see if perhaps your plug wires are shorting out?

Sounds like you're on the right track, you'll get it!

 

[assassin3117]

Those are all good starting points. Back probe the wires and see if your getting the right voltage while trying to start it. If you need some pointers on what numbers you should see just ask or send me a PM and I will post the info you need.

 

[jimbob_843]

Will do. I keep thinking that the cas is to blame throwing the ignition timing out of order as its setup to produce cam and crank signals. Maybe its only sending one and not the other?

Did some more testing. Sprayed some starter fluid in the intake and ....nothing. Those dam spark plugs arent sparking enough and are being drown in fuel. Ordering a good coil pack, i tested the old one with ohm meter and got nothing between the coils. Its a piece.... Guess i will update when i get the coil pack. Hope its working and not a dud like the previous one i got......

 

[jimbob_843]

K got the new coil pack. Sparks like a mofo. I still get nothing. New plugs properly gapped and i pulled the engine fuse and turned over a couple times to get fuel from cylinders. Sprayed in some starter fluid and all i get is a backfire from the intake. I dont understand. Mechanical Timing is dead on! !!! This dam car is about to get parted out! Can anyone help here? How would it only fire onthe intake stroke? My cas is in question and is not 180* out. Someone please help.

 

[renovatdkitchen]

Not saying to do it, just throwing ideas at the wall, but if the cas is properly set but it's not firing correctly, would it work to set the cas 180* the other way? If everything is fine, could it maybe even be a second broken CAS? Been reading the forums for a while and have seen cases where people would have two faulty replacements in a row.

 

[jimbob_843]

Very possible that its no good... But wouldnt it not spark and or have no fuel? I have spark and fuel just not at the right time i guess...

 

[michael102691]

Hope you get it running, my guess would maybe be the timing jumped or possibly ignition timing .

 

[renovatdkitchen]

Ignition timing is possible, but that is controlled by the CAS is it not? No need to give up this close. And it's not something super simple is it? Throttle body is letting in air for idle? (just want to make sure)

 

[jimbob_843]

Its nothing obvious like that i mean one day its runnimg fine.. then it dies. Im gonna mes with the firing order a little today. Why would it change randomly idk but worth a try. Also gonna use new gas...was running fine on the older gas but new gas will rule that out. Ill post up later

 

[mebetter]

When is the last time you ran a compression check?

 

[92 GSR-4]

Did you verify spark in all four cylinders?

Check the power transistor. I had a situation similar to yours, in the middle of a pull the car ran like shit then died. I couldn't figure it out until I found the connector on the power transistor was loose.

It's worth a shot. Good luck.

 

[jimbob_843]

Every connector i mean down to the ecu is 100%. I have narrowed it down to the cas. Is there anyway that maybe it isnt functioning correctly and somehow sending the crank signal at the wrong time causing the spark to ignite upon the intake stroke which could be causing my intake backfire?

It actually caught some gas i was draining from the rail onfire and i melted some shit! This car is pissing me off at this point. I need help.!

 

[2ndGenTurbo]

ok I've read all the posts and all I can figure is that you're timing jumped or your cas is bad. Did you ever actually take the timing covers off and verify that your tensioner is good and that your belt is still tight? Have you tried another cas yet? Sounds like your getting fuel, air and spark so I have to assume its a timing issue.

 

[chadjoe]

Did you switch ecu pins in the ecu harness?

Injector pins I mean

 

[jimbob_843]

Narrowed down to the cas, mechanical timing was and still is dead on. Dam cheap junkyard cas's. Anyway, waiting on some plastic parts that got melted and will figure it out then. Thanks for the help guys

 

[m3five11]

I am working on a 6 bolt swap currently on a 95 tsi awd.

I had a tonne of start problems to begin with, you have to be very careful when you wire up that CAS and use the signal of the 1g and cut them into your 2g harnesses. If you didnt purchase the plug and play harness I STRONGLY recommend soldering and shrink tubing everything.

Have you taken a multi meter to your CAS signal and power wires to verify anything ?

You can physically remove the CAS, and turn it by hand with your ignition on to verify if its sending proper signal to at least get your fuel rail pressured up. By doing this you should be able to hear all your injectors begin to click and your fuel pump switch on.

Do that WITHOUT your coil pack plugged in or you could be in for a surprise.

Verify that you have fuel, then work on spark. Chances are things aren't broken, they are just out of sync.

One very important thing not to forget is to set the base timing before you let your ecu start changing it with information from all your sensors, so find your timing ground test plug. This ground out the cars timing information and lets you get the motor started , even if it runs horribly.

Once you have verified you are getting fuel, ensure you are getting spark, and if you haven't done a compression test yet do so.... once all those 3 are verified, if its mechanically in sync it should fire when you have the timing plug ground out.

A side note to look into, is making sure your phase is correct 100% for your injector wiring, as the 1g ina 2g swap requires a few changes. I know the write up mentions to swap the pins around at the ecu,but in my case, I never had to do that.

I know a lot of this is going into some repetative speech but if you verify it all and start from the base timing you should be alright. It sounds to me almost like you skipped a tooth on the timing and the engine is drowning itself because its off now. Either that or if your CAS was loose and turned enough to drown your motor in fuel.

But as you said everything lines up mechanically, so if you're sure about everything, Test the CAS with a multimeter , put it back in, ground out your timing circuit and start with a timing light and get yourself to that 5 degree mark or so.... that should get you started..... hopefully.

Sorry I know some of that is scattered information, its been a long day but hopefully something useful comes out of it. And never assume you got it right until you've tested and written down why you know each piece of the puzzle is correct or else you'll be going in circles....

 

[jimbob_843]

Dudes...........it's been a WHILE and my car still does not run. I am contemplating just replacing the under the hood harness and maybe the ignition module (the thing on the firewall that causes no starts). Anyone else agree that this is a good decision? I have strayed far away from the dsm scene lately. Mainly because i caught mine on fire and got pissed. I am making an attempt to come back.,