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Very Strange 5spd tranny/clutch issues

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98evoIIIpwr

15+ Year Contributor
430
3
Jan 29, 2005
Moreno Valley, California
So I recently picked up a new DSM (99 GS-T) for a good deal. The only issue with the car was the owner had the clutch replaced appx. 2 years ago and the car was having issues going into gear sometimes. I picked up the car knowing that I had a brand new SBR 3500 and a freshly rebuilt tranny with an SBR LSD insert so I was good to go.

Here's the issue. The car did in fact not want to go into gear, this was an intermittent issue. I figured maybe it was the slave or master cylinders so replaced them both. Didnt fix the problem so I figured it had to be the clutch. Replaced the clutch and pressure plate on top of putting the new tranny in and the car seems to have the same problems as it did prior to doing anything to it. Ive read and read on what it "could" be. The issues are only similar but not completely alike what ive read from other posts/ forums etc.

The car will not go into gear when it is on, when it's off it goes into every gear fine. When I get the car into gear and drive it shifts fine while im driving all the way to fifth. If I have the car on jackstands with the wheels in the air it will also shift into gear even with the car on but the wheels spin even with the clutch pedal down. Also, when I try and put the car into gear when it's on it makes a wierd whining noise almost as if there were a very small metal to metal contact being made, this noise is resonating from the transmission and seems to be more over towards the clutch / flywheel portion of the trans. The placement of the fork seems to be about where it is supposed to be and the slave pushes the rod over as far as it will go when the clutch is depressed.

Ive tried bleeding the system on numerous occasions and tried adjusting the clutch master rod to just about every point it can be adjusted, i also adjusted the top play of the pedal by moving the cruise control switch up some.

The linkage seems to be fine and I didnt find any black debris in the fluid so i dont think its the master that's bad even tho its brand new. The fluid is a bit milky but I dont think thats an issue although correct me if im wrong.

Im very lost and unfortunately bought this car to be a DD and am in dire need of it. My father is a mechanic of over 30 years and he seems to be stumped himself. damn DSM's :notgood:

If anyone has any input on what to check or what they think it could be It would be appreciated.

The car is a FWD 2G 5 speed for the record.

I've read a little bit about gear clash and it almost seems like it could be it but again not everything applies to it. Anyone from a transmission shop have any input, looks like I might just need to take it in and have someone look at it.

One thing I didnt do is check step height on the flywheel. The car is a 99 and has about 160k on it. Is that something that should have to be done to a car with this amount of mileage on it? As far as I know the clutch that Im using doesnt require any alterations to the flywheel and should be a bolt in affair, assuming the flywheel is not warped or something.
 
did you check the fork for hair line crack? are you 100% sure you installed clutch correctly? did you use mitsu slave and master? did you adjust the rod for the master? also did you resurface the flywheel or use a new one?
 
Guess I should have mentioned what I replaced and what not. I replaced the TOB and fork with Mitsubishi OEM stuff. The slave and master were AutoZone parts which I've been hearing bad things about but I did switch back to the old parts after realizing I had the same problem to try and weigh out either cylinders being the issue. I did not resurface the flywheel and edited my post above to reflect that. I didnt think that was something that needed to be done so early on. Ive replaced a few clutches in my day's and never had an issue with a flywheel, especially with a car under 200k, but, this is a DSM.
 
I have read through that entire thread and although some of the issues people are having are similiar they are not absolutely alike. I didnt see anyone mentioning the fact that when the car is actually moving, that it shifts fine through every gear. Until recently it was making no noises but now that noise that seems like things are coming into contact with each other is scaring me.

I did use an auto zone MC so I think I might just go ahead and buy the OEM one fromt he dealer and see how that fairs. I just hate throwing parts at a car now knowing what the problem is. Hence the reason Im trying to get some input.

I am right to belive the SBR 3500 doesnt require any altering of the step height of the flywheel?
 
I have read through that entire thread and although some of the issues people are having are similiar they are not absolutely alike. I didnt see anyone mentioning the fact that when the car is actually moving, that it shifts fine through every gear. Until recently it was making no noises but now that noise that seems like things are coming into contact with each other is scaring me.

I did use an auto zone MC so I think I might just go ahead and buy the OEM one fromt he dealer and see how that fairs. I just hate throwing parts at a car now knowing what the problem is. Hence the reason Im trying to get some input.

I am right to belive the SBR 3500 doesnt require any altering of the step height of the flywheel?


I just picked up a 90 awd knowing the same problem with it as yours...and they too put on a auto zone mc,so im going to order a oem one and i will let u know if that fixes mine..good luck man
 
I unfortunately am leaning more and more towards the flywheel itself. Seeing as thats the only thing really I didnt change and the same problem persists it is almost at this point the verdict. Im going to pull the trans again and go have it checked and resurfaced and see how that fairs. Ill keep you posted on that also.
 
OK so took the trans out and this is what I found! I can see why the car was making noise when I tried to put it in gear. This is a brand new clutch disk and PP from SBR (3500). Im going to be emailing SBR also to see if they have any input. I dont know if the PP is faulty or what. Take a look at the pictures and PLEASE feel free to give me any input. Im at a loss as to what would cause this.

You can see hot spots on the flywheel and around the center of the disk looks as if the PP fingers were pressing against it with an odd amount of pressure or at the wrong times maybe. This clutch was put in and the car was not driven except around the block to find out that it had a problem, maybe less then .2 miles TOPS! This shouldnt be happening obviously. What is going on?
 

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Pedal pump up. You've overstroked the clutch, pushing the PP fingers into the clutch disk.

You need to go through the procedure of adjusting your clutch pedal. When it's all said and done, you should be able to push the S/C pushrod into the body of the S/C. If you can't, the pedal is still misadjusted
 
Pedal pump up. You've overstroked the clutch, pushing the PP fingers into the clutch disk.

You need to go through the procedure of adjusting your clutch pedal. When it's all said and done, you should be able to push the S/C pushrod into the body of the S/C. If you can't, the pedal is still misadjusted

I tried and tried to adjust this thing and even followed the steps on jackstransmissions youtube vid that someone posted. I contacted SBR and Mike got back to me very promptly and is wondering if its the flywheel step height. I didnt check this as I stated above and Ill be taking it down to the machine shop to have it checked for tolerance and resurfaced.

On a second note, just in case its not the flywheel. Your saying that overadjusting the clutch can make the PP put excessive wear on the disk? I mean the hydraulic system can only build up so much pressure, right? Maybe I'm looking at this the wrong way as Im not 100% sure on the theory behind a hydraulic clutch system. Also, when you say "overstroked" what exactly does that mean? Could I have adjusted the rod on the MC too far out?

I appreciate the input LOTS, thanks a million.
 
I tried and tried to adjust this thing and even followed the steps on jackstransmissions youtube vid that someone posted. I contacted SBR and Mike got back to me very promptly and is wondering if its the flywheel step height. I didnt check this as I stated above and Ill be taking it down to the machine shop to have it checked for tolerance and resurfaced.

On a second note, just in case its not the flywheel. Your saying that overadjusting the clutch can make the PP put excessive wear on the disk? I mean the hydraulic system can only build up so much pressure, right? Maybe I'm looking at this the wrong way as Im not 100% sure on the theory behind a hydraulic clutch system. Also, when you say "overstroked" what exactly does that mean? Could I have adjusted the rod on the MC too far out?

I appreciate the input LOTS, thanks a million.

You adjusted the M/C input pushrod too far out, which inturn blocked the self-compensation port in the M/C. THis results in fluid that is 'locked' in the line and when tehe pedal is released, it can't self adjust. Depending on how the pedal is actuated, it can continue to draw fluid in, but not left fluid out. If this happens enough, you can get to the point, the starting point of the relase fork is too far (already applying pressure causeing potential slippage) and you end up overstroking the PP.

In the first 2mm or so of clutch pedal stroke, the comp valve is blocked, so that as you continue to stroke the pedal, you no 'push' that volume of fluid through the system. When you release the pedal, if will self adjust. Over time, the S/C rod will ride deeper and deeper in the S/C body compensateing for disk wear. With the clutch pedal released, you should be able to push the S/C rod into the body of the S/C.
 
Having the same porblem at the moment. Next step is to pull the tranny again, and check the clutch fork and pivot ball. I would try that if you have not already.
Mike
 
Yea fork and TOB are both brand new along with the fulcrum ball. Essentially everything in the trans / clutch is new including a freshyl rebuilt trans w/ LSD.
 
I would start looking into linkage issues then. Under the console and at the trans.
Mike
 
Thanks Morphius. Now that I think about it when I was bleeding the system I wasnt able to push the MC rod into the body w/o opening the bleeder valve. This theory as to what went wrong is making more sense then any so far. Do you think that that clutch disk is still useable? I have another disk but It has had some time on it and that one that has the burn marks is brand new aside from that issue.
 
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