Starter - Clunking noise

[bgugi]

I've been searching like a fiend, but i can't find anything that solves my problem. After several months of owning it, and no relevant problems, during a cold start the other day (-15, took too damn long) my starter started making a "clunking" noise, loud, like somebody swinging a socket around under my hood. over 2-3 days it went from making one or two clunks during startup, to being one of the most violent sounds my car has ever made (KAHKAHKLUNKLUNK-vroom). As soon as the starter is disengaged, the noise is completely gone.

I've already looked at my flywheel, all the teeth seem to be there, if just a tiny bit rough. already replaced the starter, but the clunking is still around. bolts are tight, starter feels secure. The starter mates directly to the flywheel when starting, right?

 

[Albanator]

Had this issue and I put a shim between the starter and the transmission to solved the problem... It seemed that the starter was to close to the flywheel and was causing the teeth of the starter to actually hit the pressure plate sides. Try putting a thin washer between the starter and trans just to see if it help first and if solves the problem pull the washers out and get a shim same size as the starter housing to put in place of it. I actually made my shim from spare aircraft aluminum I had at work. You could possibly leave the washers in, but it may cause the starter to shift. I don't think it would because of the clapping force on the starter but it might. But go for a thin washer first to see if it is a shimming issue. Hope this helps man, let us know!

 

[luv2rallye]

Anything changed on the engine like A/T to M/T OR N/T to T OR aftermarket starter which is actually the wrong one for your engine/tranny?
Make sure you have both the right start and starter plate: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/new...459007-bought-my-first-dsm.html#post153217957.

 

[bgugi]

ToughOne Starter - Remanufactured 16869: Shop the best Starter at Advance Auto Parts replacement starter i just put in.

dec 96 manufacture date, 97 model year. manual turbo, as listed on the vin. Not sure if the engine is an exact match or if i have my original turbo. I haven't changed anything except the starter lately, and didn't have any problems until the cold night i started.

I'll try shimming it tonight to see if that changes anything.

 

[Albanator]

The engine really dose not matter for the starter.... The stater mounts to the transmission. The FWD mounts a little higher due to the .5" bigger flywheel. The AWD mounts lower, the actual mounting point on the start is not what changes it is the transmission holes are actually in a differant position. People will say you can't use and AWD starter in a FWD.... I will call BS on that, as long as it is not intermixed between auto to 5speed and your good. I Have a buddy that I helped put a so called FWD starter in a gsx and has been running it without problems for 2 years now. I used to have a gsx and used a FWD starter and ran fine up until the point I sold it. I currently have a AWD swap spyder using a fwd starter. I did not have a starter plate for the AWD and that is why I needed a shim. When you try the shim put some white out on the starter gear and you will be able to see where it is making contact with your flywheel. You can make adjustments in thickness of your shim to make sure the starter gear is making contact with the flywheel at an optimal position.

 

[fisher83]

I noticed he said the temp was -15...will the cold weather affect the the expansion of the metal of the shims? Or should a person get the car up to operating temperature and then check the spacing between the starter?

 

[bgugi]

It's back up to 30 nowadays, and it's clunking hot or cold.

 

[dsmcrazy2]

1. I would make sure you have the correct starter plate.
2. The starter technically doesn't sit directly on the flywheel. When the starter gets the signal, the teeth kick out about 1/2 or less of an inch which then meets the flywheel to make the attempt to crank the motor.
3. Take off the starter you currently have and inspect the entire flywheel by spinning the crank sprocket. Make sure you don't miss any teeth to ensure they are all still present.
4. Make sure you have the correct flywheel installed. People tend to get confused and make the mistake of using the wrong one due to the fact that the clutch kit bolts up to both awd/fwd flywheels.
5. You might also want to check to see if when you are pressing the clutch, if the actually drivetrain shifts. Had an issue on a friends car.. When pressing the clutch, the pressure plate would practically push the trans away from the motor.

Good luck. Hope this was helpful

 

[Albanator]

-15 is cold but the clamping force of the starter being tq down would have minimal if any effect of the metal. When you take the starter out to put a shim in, take it to advanced. They have a machine that will test the starter. It can also tell you if your bendix is extending to far or not enough to make contact withstood the flywheel. If you have had the starter in there and it just started making the noise then I can only think that all flywheel components are the correct ones. The starter itself is the issue. Make sure it is Tq down and tight, then try the shim, our cars have a starter plate witch is the shim. But that only works for OEM spec parts. If it is an advanced part then the bendix specs might be a hair off and another form of shim will be needed. Hope you get it working keep us updated

 

[bgugi]

So i got the starter back in with 0.085" washers. It's still making noise, but i'm not sure if it sounds better or if my brain is just getting desperate. What's the typical range people will shim out to?

also: pulled the engine fuse to make sure it wasn't a combustion noise (knocking, etc), and checked all the flywheel teeth... again. They're definitely still there. The problem didn't start until after six months of typical starting, and happened across two starters. This is driving me nuts, especially with how hard it is to line up the bolts for the damned starter with my comically large hands.

edit: shimmed .165" out, still noisy. starting to think it might be an incredibly short grind. beats me.

 

[Albanator]

Wow that is weird,Have you tried to mark the starter bendix gear to see where it is making contact with the fly wheel. Will tell you how far out the bendix is going.even if the bendix is extending even 2mm to far it will make contact with the pressure plate..a video of the noise would help too if it is the same noise it was doing on mine keep shimming but until you verify the bendix distance and all kind of risky to putting the shim further out...

 

[luv2rallye]

MOST starters (and alts) sold at auto stores have PROVEN to be junk. Just search these forums and you will see a HUGE (and I'm not exaggerating) number of people have returned their newly purchased starter (or alt) 4-5 times. What good is a lifetime warranty when your starter (or alt) keeps going out and you have to do the replacing (not to mention getting stranded somewhere)?

The only reliable place to get a starter (or alt) is at a starter/alternator repair shop (and I talk both from experience and reading all the starter threads on here over the last 12 years!). Here's my take on auto store alts which also applies to auto store starters: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/263621-alternator-output-problems.html#post151468330.

 

[bgugi]

and in the end, it turned out to be one of those problems... you know, the ones you're kind of ashamed to confess to?

yeah, the connector on the positive terminal on the starter managed to work itself a little loose during installation. It had enough juice to start, but would cut out a few times, allowing the solenoid to release and engage the moving gears...