self life of a turbo'ed 420a

[Jimi]

I'm rather new to the dsm world, but i currently have a 420a // manuel and i was planning to up the power by adding a hahn stage 2 to it as well as strengthening the bottom end. I have done some extensive research on the matter, however there doesn't seem to be any info on the long term effects of turboing a 420. I was wonding if any of you that have "turbo'ed" the 420 have had any problems. Or should i just sell my ride and go for the turbo tsi( oh ya i have a esi talon if you don;t already know).
Oh ya the only reason i do have a esi in stead of a tsi is that for some strange reason( i blame hollywood ...namely a certian " fast to jump on the band wagon" movie) the tsi is about 5 - 8 g's more then the esi, and that is for cars with over 100 k's on them. I bought my esi with 50k's for less then half of the going rate of tsi with twice the clicks.
So should i go with the bullet proof mitsu engine in a tsi and shell out the extra cash, or is a turbo'ed esi with strengthen bottom gonna last is my question. Pls help

 

[98Turbbo420A]

2 years and not a problem so far!

 

[Jimi]

Really, was your bottom end built up as well, and if you don't mind me asking ,how much hp r u pushing and how much boost do you run, and is it a daily driver. sorry about the q's, but i'm just afraid if i push 200 hp out of the 420a it might go to crank walk ville.

 

[98Turbbo420A]

The 420A Owner Slogan "420A, crankwalk sold seperatly" you don't have to worry about crankwalk in this motor, dosen't happen man. I'll try to answer more later, i'm tired and I'm going to bed!

 

[Jimi]

Actually any engine can have a crank walk problem. It's just that the 4g's are more prone to it. Correct me if i'm wrong but the 420a are said to be non-crank walk prone simply because in it's stock form it would never be pushed to that much power. I'm just afraid if i slap a turbo on a 420a, a couple of years from now the engine my blow or something. The mitsu 4g's are ment to be turboed. the block is way stronger, even though some are known to do the c walk.

 

[Jimi]

It's the long term i'm worryed about. I love my dsm even though it's a esi. I kinda wanna hang on to it for a while.

 

[TalonRalph]

if you rebuild the bottom end it will last for a while. cause rebuilding your bottom ends is like making your cars mileage going back to 0. so i should last you a good whle

 

[cucumber]

If you want to run high boost and be a fast 420A, you'll need to rebuild your bottom end.

 

[1TuffRS]

420as are less prone to crankwalk compared to the 4G63s because of their design, not because of their power output. Hell even stock 4G63s have crankwalked before, but its not as big of an issue its made out to be IMO.

 

[Jimi]

but dosn't the 4 g's have a much stronger bottom and block to start off with.

 

[dudasd]

The stock 4G's have a lower compression ratio because they are turbo, that is where the advantage is, but like was said ^^^^ if you do a rebuild and drop compression then you will be the same. I am running a HRC Stage 2 right now with stock internals still and it's doing very well(4 months and counting) It's been good enough that even witha slow 60' time(2.3) I still got a 14.7 out of her on only 6 PSI...the time could be lower with a better launch. If you have the cash readily available then go ahead and do the rebuild when you do the turbo. If you haven;t done it yet, I would HIGHLY recomend you go ahead and swap your head gasket out for the MLS one or you will have major issues. And while you have it down that far you might as well go ahead and beef up the bottom end. Just make sure you keep it tuned right and have enough fuel and you will be worry free......

 

[Kirby]

Originally posted by Jimi
but dosn't the 4 g's have a much stronger bottom and block to start off with.

Yes it's stronger, because it's made for turbo. If you rebuild the 420a with forged internals then it's stronger and cheaper than your 4g63. Think about it, it's about $3000 to rebuild the motor, and have a stronger block than a 4g63. VS. going and buying a tsi, gsx, gst for thousands more at the start and then having an engine that holds less power than the rebuilt 420a, plus more insurance costs. Rebuild the 420a and turbo it you won't be upset with the results.
And for the main topic question, don't worry about the reliability, the only thing that will make it unreliable is you. If you don't make a mistake tuning and set it up right it would last just as long at 8 psi as it would N/A. I have had my kit on for almost a year and havn't lost a bit of compression.

 

[Jimi]

thanks dudes. You guys really helped alot. i think i might jut do that. Especially since all tsi , gst, and gsx's are going for more then twice the cost of a n/t dsm where i'm from.

 

[Malenko]

Originally posted by 98Turbbo420A
The 420A Owner Slogan "420A, crankwalk sold seperatly"

That was my old sig quote but I gotta lotta hate e-mail/private messages from it... besides my new one is funnier =p

 

[siueclipse]

im on 3 months with no problems. running 10lbs of boost with the hahn stage 2 kit and fmic. sometimes i feel like something might break. haha, but its been on the dyno and if it was going to break, in my mind it would have done it already

 

[eclipsebabyblue]

im going on 4 months with a hrc stage II with fmic. its my daily drive and i beat the #### out of it stock internals and 8 lbs of boost. no problems yet...(knock on wood) but it is a good idea it goes to the shop soon for the motor rebuild and all together im glad i bought an n/t and built it up beacuse my insurance is alot cheaper and i didnt have to spend the extra$$$ for a gst or gsx

 

[cucumber]

Originally posted by Malenko


That was my old sig quote but I gotta lotta hate e-mail/private messages from it... besides my new one is funnier =p

Thing is, it probably isn't true.

 

[legaleagle]

You know funny thing is, a GSX is an AWD Turbo, that is why you are paying extra for it. And think about the money you are going to be spending on an NA, The car itself, + HRC Stage 2, You are going to have to rebuild the tranny, and the bottom end. Hell for what you are paying to build the NA engine to handle 280 hp, you could build a 9 second GSX or TSI AWD. And dont come at me with the "You are a 4G owner, you dont know the 420" cause I own both and know the both of these engines very well. Save your money and get the car that is meant to be turbo, IMO.

Originally posted by Jimi
Especially since all tsi , gst, and gsx's are going for more then twice the cost of a n/t dsm where i'm from.

 

[Malenko]

This is the most tired out subject on this board and it never seems to go away.

Turbo guys are gonna say their car is the best and NA guys are gonna say their car has more potential. I try to stay out of it myself, but I will say this, I KNOW my 420A non turbo is faster then the 4G63 non-turboed.

Now if the original poster is asking if he should turbo his 420A or Swap out to a 4G63.... Im sure everyone would agree its more cost efficient to turbo then swap.


And CUCUMBER how is your car doing?

 

[legaleagle]

I am not argueing any thing about what is better, I am talking about cost to power ratio. I have both so I can give a non biast opinion on this. The 420 is a good engine but it is not a turbo. If you wanted a turbo, why didnt you buy in the first place??

 

[eclipsebabyblue]

Originally posted by legaleagle
I am not argueing any thing about what is better, I am talking about cost to power ratio. I have both so I can give a non biast opinion on this. The 420 is a good engine but it is not a turbo. If you wanted a turbo, why didnt you buy in the first place??

because in my case i bought the car before i was into the turbo and speed phase all i cared about was looks. and im not here to argue about the better motor because the both pretty much the same dam thing a 420 can go just as fast a 4g so i dont see your point. but my main question is if you know so much then why arent you a ####ing wiseman????????

p.s malenko you are absolutly right this is tired

 

[legaleagle]

Because I dont spend my life posting on this board. And I am a wiseman, you will never achive that because you are a F*&^ing dumb @$$. I wasnt being a di*k but since you want to be, go ahead and burn your money, Smart guy.

 

[DSMNightmare]

Meeeoooowww. Catfight!

You cant really compare the 4G63 N/A to the 4G63 turbo. That would be like comparing the 4G in the EVO VIII to the 4G in the 2G. While the name is the same the engines are not. The fact is it all comes down to numbers. Show me a 9 second 420a.

You want good insurance buy a honda. Turbo or not insurance on these cars is not cheap.

 

[Malenko]

Originally posted by DSMNightmare
Meeeoooowww. Catfight!

You cant really compare the 4G63 N/A to the 4G63 turbo. That would be like comparing the 4G in the EVO VIII to the 4G in the 2G. While the name is the same the engines are not. The fact is it all comes down to numbers. Show me a 9 second 420a.

You want good insurance buy a honda. Turbo or not insurance on these cars is not cheap.

Your just proving my point, it dumb to compare different engines. As for the 9 second 420A here is something close

http://www.hahnracecraft.com/auto/neon/neon.htm

10.55@139MPH

so STFU about the 420A not having potential. AND YOUR WRONG.... it doesnt come down to numbers, what it comes down to is money, PURE AND SIMPLE! If you have the cash almost anything is possible.

And dont try to downplay the insurance factor, it was about a 100 dollar a month difference at the time I was buying my car and made a sizable impact on my choice of cars.

 

[DSMNightmare]

Ok I pay 400 every 6 months for my TSI so insurance is not that bad for me. As for the comment about the neon that would be like if some Dumb A$$ tried to say that turboing a DX can get you 9s so that makes the honda engine better. I would tell that dumb a$$ that its about power to weight and that the less a car weights is going ot make a difference. The neon weighs about 1000lbs less than the GST so that would be a big difference. If you want to be fair lets take a car that weighs about 400lbs less than the GST like the conquest and slap a 4G63 in it. Guess what?!? It ran 8s!!! So you can see how much of a Dumb A$$ this guy would be for not realizing the P/W factor.

I would suggest the guy do more research before talking S%&* wouldn't you. I never said the 420 sucked. I was merely stating that the 4G has just as much potential.