Running a 2g ECU in my Evo8 ?

[TuRBoTaLooN]

Hey guys, I'm mostly posting this thread to generate some discussion and get some feedback.

Quick history:
I've been in to DSMs for about 10 years now and by no means am a guru of any sorts, but I am pretty knowledgeable. Picked up an 03 evo 8 about 3 years ago. Mostly stock, but now I'm at the point where I want to start wrenching on it. Basic goal is a street/strip weekend warrior that can handle well on an auto x as well. So no 9 second passes here.

I'm looking in to tuning solutions and a friend of mine recommended a 2g ecu swap in my evo 8 so I can use ECMLink since I've used it before and I am very comfortable using it. I have never used ECUFlash, but did some research and there will be a sizeable learning curve for me. I did some research into the 2g ecu swap and seems fairly straight forward. I would get the wiring harness extention that MAP sells and do the wire swapping there so I can plug and play the stock ecu in a pinch.

So my question for you all is have any of you done this and what was your experience. What limitations or issues did you run in to? It seems a lot of the little nuances have been addressed and from what I've read shouldn't have any issues with a 450 - 500 awhp pump gas machine. So what are your thoughts guys?

 

[FLASH1970]

There are some write-ups for EVO Tuning. Google "Merlin's ECUFlash guide" and download the pdf. Also, on EvoultionM.com a member named "recompile" put together a set of videos on using EVOScan and ECUFlash. It's really not that hard to use especially if you've used DSMLink and know how to tune. Plus the EVO forums have good user support for ECUFlash.

 

[SonySlave]

Another option you have for installation is to have Thomas at ECMTuning modify the 2G ECU to be plug and play with the Evo 8 harness. I believe he calls it back planing. Basically he'll solder all of the connections at the pins of the board to essentially "swap" them. I don't think he charges too much to do it. Wouldn't hurt to ask. I attached a picture of an example of the modded ECU.

I have never heard about any tuning issues with using ECMLink v3 in an Evo. Works just like a 2G. However, the one recurring issue I have heard of from several users is starters failing. No one is entirely sure of the problem that causes it and not everyone has the issue. Personally, I had been planning on running v3 in my DD Evo but ended up selling the car before I could do it.

Here is the wiki: 2ginevo8 [ECMTuning - wiki]

Here is the quote directly from Thomas:

The starter issue is real, but it's apparently pretty random on who has the problem and who doesn't. But Lucas [English] knows his stuff and he said he killed 2 or 3 starters on his EVO before finally swapping out to an EVO ECU and not having any issues since. I was kinda bummed to hear he was back on the EVO ECU.

The problem seems to be that while cranking on a DSM ECU, there are situations where the ECU may reset (probably due to low voltage, if I had to guess) and cause ignition on the currently charged coil to fire immediately. ECU powers down, field collapses and spark happens...where ever the engine/pistons just happen to be! This can cause the engine to almost instantly stop rotating and even kick back on the starter since, by definition, that's still engaged.

This happens on DSMs too (again, usually due to low battery voltage while cranking). But Lucas said the DSM starters are just beefier all around and the EVO starters just weren't tolerating it. They would flat out die and stop working.

Apparently the EVO ECU did not have this same problem. Maybe they're charging the coil later in the cycle while cranking, which reduces the time window where this could happen. Or maybe that ECU is just more tolerant of whatever was causing the DSM ECU to reset and wasn't resetting at all as a result. It's a mystery to me.

I do know that I've never had a problem with in my own EVO and, obviously, a lot of other people haven't either. But some have and it's definitely something to keep in mind.

For reference, here's a thread where I gave some brief description of the back plane mod we do every once in a while.

2G ECU modified for use in EVO8

Then the DSM ECU plugs directly into the EVO8 harness. You just have to run a single wire over to the diagnostic port (pin 56 - Cut this wire, run a wire from 56 at the 2G ECU to pin 1 at the data link connector. Cut pin 1 wire at DLC, do not splice this in). This isn't as easy as it sounds, though, because pin 56 on the EVO ECU harness is unpopulated since the EVO ECU doesn't use it. So you have to add a pin to the harness yourself. Some people have spare pins off other 2G/EVO harnesses and some people just moved an unusual pin off the existing EVO harness (like an IC sprayer wire, for example).

If you don't add that wire, then you will have constant problems datalogging the car. You can start a datalog but then can't stop it. You have to cycle the ignition (waiting long enough for the ECU to power down) before you can connect again. And you have to lock the ECU in ECMLink mode too. It's really not a good setup, so I highly recommend running that extra wire.

Once you have that setup, then you can ignore all the wiring swap stuff on the 2G in an EVO8 page. You still want to run through the code changes, though. Particularly with respect to the fan operation. And that power steering load pin mode....that's a good one too. Oh...and that moving idle adjustment file...definitely gotta have that one or else you'll get mad every time you start to drive away from a stop.

Thomas Dorris

 

[JusMX141]

Ricky Nichols (dacowgod on here and the Link forums) has had a 2G ECU & DSMLink in his Evo VIII since he bought it either last spring or the spring before last. He's gone a best of 11.18 on snow tires earlier this year, and made 550whp with an HY35 on the car burning pump fuel.

 

[TuRBoTaLooN]

There are some write-ups for EVO Tuning. Google "Merlin's ECUFlash guide" and download the pdf. Also, on EvoultionM.com a member named "recompile" put together a set of videos on using EVOScan and ECUFlash. It's really not that hard to use especially if you've used DSMLink and know how to tune. Plus the EVO forums have good user support for ECUFlash.

Thanks! I have read some of these write ups and manuals and I'm sure I could do the tuning and learn the software, but my original point was that I already know ECMLink and am proficient in it and comfortable tuning with it. So if it wouldn't pose any major issues it would be preferable to using ECUFlash.

Another option you have for installation is to have Thomas at ECMTuning modify the 2G ECU to be plug and play with the Evo 8 harness. I believe he calls it back planing. Basically he'll solder all of the connections at the pins of the board to essentially "swap" them. I don't think he charges too much to do it. Wouldn't hurt to ask. I attached a picture of an example of the modded ECU.

I have never heard about any tuning issues with using ECMLink v3 in an Evo. Works just like a 2G. However, the one recurring issue I have heard of from several users is starters failing. No one is entirely sure of the problem that causes it and not everyone has the issue. Personally, I had been planning on running v3 in my DD Evo but ended up selling the car before I could do it.

Here is the wiki: 2ginevo8 [ECMTuning - wiki]:

I've seen the wiki and some other info here and there. I did not know about the pin swap INSIDE the ecu. Sounds like a more eloquent solution to me. As for the starter issue, I'll have to dig in to that some more I suppose.

Ricky Nichols (dacowgod on here and the Link forums) has had a 2G ECU & DSMLink in his Evo VIII since he bought it either last spring or the spring before last. He's gone a best of 11.18 on snow tires earlier this year, and made 550whp with an HY35 on the car burning pump fuel.

This is EXACTLY the kind of feed back I was hoping for as this would be similar to what I plan on building. Maybe not with snow tires, , but with dot slicks or some grippy street tires. I want to be able to get in the car, turn it on, drive to the track, race, drive home.