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pauleyman

DSM Wiseman
9,298
3,541
Nov 19, 2011
oklahoma city, Oklahoma
I've got a giant box of tools so now most of my purchases are for convenience or specialty. I have found in specialty items there are often (especially online) many brands that look identical so I can't tell a "quality" tool apart from another. I also know some tools are rebranded. Even basic hand tools do this so it's hard to know what's what or who is who. For instance this morning I was looking for a thread restore kit. Not helicoils or taps/dies. But for fixing mildly damaged threads, The kit has taps and dies that are not tooling but rather thin or with cuts in them designed to just straighten stuff out. Usually they come with a set of thread restoring files. On amazon at least there are a bunch of kits that look identical except for the layout on the case. How can an end user tell one tool from another? Unless it's a brand you know. I don't necessarily trust that either and I don't like overpaying if it's just a rebranded tool. Not everything is quality either. I have some Lisle stuff and the lock ring pliers are just crap. There is a proto/stanley set out there MUCH nicer and similar price point. I happened to find a set identical to the proto at an estate sale. They are older/vintage and a brand I don't recognize but seem durable and they are worn so they've seen some use.

Anyway back to the original question....who do we trust now or how do we find out who is rebranded etc? I refuse to buy severely marked up tools from the likes of snap on, matco or any of the big names if I know they didn't make it but merely bought it and stuck their name on it.

Discuss.
 
I've found myself just reading reviews of tools--especially the negative ones--to weigh whether or not they're worth buying.

I'm in the same position (several large tool boxes filled, yet still piles all over as well), so it's mostly specialty tools. That being said, if I know that said specialty tool will only be used on rare occasions, I typically look for cheaper tools that I don't mind them having a shorter lifespan, or a slightly less quality feel. I used to buy a lot of Snap-On, etc., but then it got through my thick head that those tools get lost, or store for years, unused the same as a cheaper brand.

Recent example was a cheap hydraulic crimper for wire lugs. The directions were basically non-existent, the quality a little suspect, but it was 1/10th the price of a "quality" piece and worked well for rewiring the charging system on my old Cummins truck. I'm sure I'll use it again at some point--if I can find it again. If not, I'll just buy another at that point.

The above probably doesn't give much input towards what I believe is your main question, so I'll also reference this as another entry to the rabbit hole: https://toolguyd.com/tool-brands-corporate-affiliations/
 
The problem with tools today is that a typical lifetime warranty is not really a lifetime guarantee, like it used to be. It's essentially just a replacement/trade-in agreement. Almost nothing is really built to last a significant amount of time with regular use. Hardly anything out there is meant to be purchased once these days. Our economy is built on throwaway products that get replaced every so often. The term "quality" has become an increasingly relative term.

On the flip side I know I tend to shop for products based on how much I'll use them, tools included. Like Josh, if I'm not going to use them often, I don't know that I'll invest in the higher price level option available. If I feel I'm going to be using it often, I'll likely pay the extra cost. Another factor is the application and importance/risk involved for the job the tool is being used for. The more important the results are, the less risk I'm willing to take on a potentially inferior tool - though again, even the higher priced options aren't always guaranteed to be higher quality. I'm betting I'm not the only one who looks at it this way.
 
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That might be helpful. I try and shy away from anything that just looks like complete crap unless it's just ridiculously simple and torque isn't applied. Plastic stuff comes to mind.
I'm a lot like other mechanics I suppose. I have way too much stuff I've used once and sits in the box for years.
 
There’s a group on Facebook called “den of tools”. You might could do a search for what your looking to buy and see some comments on it. Honestly tho, you’re probably better off just reading Amazon reviews because it’s mostly just Milwaukee vs ryobi arguments :idontknow:
 
And on top of all this, it's also a challenge to find real, unbiased feedback for said tools (or any products). Most of the "product review" sites out there are nothing more than marketing websites that have been thrown together to earn Amazon affiliate revenue. It can be nearly impossible to find REAL feedback from someone who has honestly used the tool in question. The review you're reading on most sites, 9 times out of 10, was written by some gig worker who was contracted to write a blurb that has a high likelihood of converting a click over to Amazon. There are certainly some exceptions to this, but it's not always easy to find those exceptions.

So, not only are most of the tools all made in the same factories today, the lifetime warranty is no longer a lifetime guarantee, but finding real world feedback has also been diluted and corrupted by profit too. :toobad:

There’s a group on Facebook called “den of tools”. You might could do a search for what your looking to buy and see some comments on it. Honestly tho, you’re probably better off just reading Amazon reviews because it’s mostly just Milwaukee vs ryobi arguments :idontknow:
Ughh, another FB group... no thanks. Amazon reviews, as fake as a lot of them are, can be fairly easy to sift through. Well, at least easier than finding good quality information in a FB group using their search feature. I hate having to expand comments 50 times just to see the whole discussion on FB.
 
I'm a well equipped amateur mechanic. Got my first set of Craftsman tools in college when I got my first car (Used FJ-40 Land Cruiser, worth 100k now, sigh) While I read the 'Pro' tools were better, I've never had a tool failure of any kind. Now that Sears sold Craftsman, I've been looking elsewhere for add ons.

Harbor Freight is a love/hate relationship for many, including me. Their tool boxes are excellent for the $$., I have 2. They have some decent tools, for instance I have a telescoping 1/2" ratchet in one of my cars for an on the road lug wrench. They also have some nighmarish stuff. Garage Journal has an ongoing HF review thread.

My GST is telling me a set of crows foot wrenches might be in my future. They won't be used much after that, along with most torx sockets, flare nut wrenches, and other specialty tools.

I don't own any Snap-on or tool truck tools. Name brands like Klein have turned out to be favorites. Gear Wrench has some creative tools.
 
Any tool set will work for just about any machine of ours. We're torqing no more than 45lbs. If its more, a 100$ snap on 100lb torque wrench will work. Power tools, i use Milwaukee(only for crank bolt & lug nuts). For my dye/rethread i use Matco. Snap on wratchets, various wrenches, HF hex set(lil red box)HF 20$ cut off wheel/grinder, and misc. Pawn shops sell tools cheap & individually so make a list and hunt away.

There is a time to pay up, but take in mind how many times youll be using it, the time itll save you, and money youll possibly make w it.
 
I had a nice Snap On roll cab full of tools, but sold it all in 2005. I now mainly use a all-in-one-case set from Channel-lok, definitely made in China, but honestly not too bad. I've found that often the cheaper wrenches simply are shorter, so you can't apply the same kind of torque with them for a given effort. I would probably upgrade to finer-tooth ratchet if I got caught up on other needs. Mostly my money goes to parts, not tools as much. Once HF gets a combination parts washer/ shop press/ blast media cabinet; I'm all in!
 
I like project farm tool reviews on YouTube. Here is a recent one that informed my decision on what side cutters to purchase:
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When in doubt, I buy made in USA and do the research to verify it is substantial made in USA. I spent a pretty penny on a vice last year, but it is a tool I use nearly daily.

Other items I buy because I use them at work. Wiha screwdrivers come to mind. Though I’ve also invested in JIS tip Phillips Vessel brand screwdrivers from Japan. Comes in handy for jobs like headlight replacement on 1g pop up headlights.
 
Great info. The more discussion the better. I would like to circle back to identical looking sets. This may even be true of some bigger names when you're talking about specialty stuff and not wrenches, screwdrivers etc.
 
Project Farm youtube has lots of good videos. I own easly $40,000+ in tools as i make my living with them. I sometimes over pay for say a snap-on tool for the piece of mind if i break it i will have it taken care of within a week.
 
For me it pretty much comes down to how much I expect to use them and how many hours/days I want to spend searching for creditable reviews and reading them. I just wrench on my own cars at home so I don't need anything pricey like Snap-on, etc. I bought a LOT of Craftsman sockets (like every one they made) and wrenches 40 years ago that are still going strong. HF's Pittsburgh brand specialty tools always work good enough for me and I like them. Of course once in a while there's always the exception specialty tool I'll only use once where I'll pay the price to get the quality proven one (like the Euroexport DSM valve spring compresser to do valve seals). BTW, Craftsman tools are still sold at Lowe's but only the basic wrenches, sockets stuff.
 
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I bought a digital gauge tire inflator from Eastwood while all of my coworkers were buying them from Matco and snap on. It honestly looked rebranded to me like @pauleyman said. It’s been several years and still works great. I just changed the batteries this week.

Does anyone else have experience with Eastwood? Someone told me they thought of them as a compromise between expensive and harbor freight.
 
I think you're referring to thread chasers in your initial post. I've had to do that several times but couldn't justify a real chaser set, so I made do with a GearWrench tap and die set I got on Amazon. I used it to restore threads on both sheet metal (engine bay) and cast metal (top exhaust pipe flange bolt hole on a Camry). If you need to do this often you're probably better off with a real chaser set.

As for tools, I've mostly gotten Craftsman from Sears, ok or better quality consumer grade tools from Amazon and Advance Auto (Tekton, Gearwrench, Astro Pneumatic, etc.), and some HF house brand stuff like ratchet wrenches and sockets. It's worked out ok, but I'm a newbie DIY mech and not one of you veteran mechs let alone a pro. I do a lot of research first though, both on vendor sites and via 3rd party reviews like Project Farm and such. I run Fakespot a lot to get a sense of how authentic Amazon reviews are.

As for those identical-looking tools and kits on Amazon, if I ever need one I just get the one with the highest rating that has at least a few hundred reviews, that gets an A or B on Fakespot, and which doesn't have too many "this tool is crap!" reviews, with photos of broken tips, taps, anvils, etc. Ideally it's a brand I've heard of and even purchased before, like Tekton or GearWrench, but I've taken my chances on no-name ones and lucked out. Hell, I have a few dollar store tools that have done me good, low tech stuff like picks, wire brushes, extendable pickup tools, etc. It's like anything, use your best judgement.

What I wouldn't skimp or take chances on is power tools. But of course you know this already. I just got a rotary tool kit with a flexible shaft attachment for $40. Nothing fancy but it does the job. Chinese brand I'd never heard of. But it's not an impact wrench or angle grinder so it didn't have to be a name brand. For the tools that really matter, that you'll use all the time for critical applications for years on end, or ones that could hurt you or worse if they fail, obviously you want to go quality brand name. For the rest, again, use your judgement. No one will know but you if it's a no-name.
 
I don't care about names on a lot of this stuff. I already own quality stuff on most if not all major components, power tools etc. Now I'm just buying convenience stuff on occasion and I don't mind the cost. I guess the thought is sometimes you see two items. One is 50 and one is 100 when they may be the exact same tool from the same maker just packed differently. With cheap stuff it's probably impossible to know. That's the sort of stuff that bugs me.
Honestly I have crap that amazes even me. My neighbors have a good laugh about it. Whatever it is I've got one when asked. I don't make a habit of loaning but to next door neighbor...safe enough.
 
For me it pretty much comes down to how much I expect to use them and how many hours/days I want to spend searching for creditable reviews and reading them. I just wrench on my own cars at home so I don't need anything pricey like Snap-on, etc. I bought a LOT of Craftsman sockets (like every one they made) and wrenches 40 years ago that are still going strong. HF's Pittsburgh brand specialty tools always work good enough for me and I like them. Of course once in a while there's always the exception specialty tool I'll only use once where I'll pay the price to get the quality proven one (like the Euroexport DSM valve spring compresser to do valve seals). BTW, Craftsman tools are still sold at Lowe's but only the basic wrenches, sockets stuff.

What’s the difference between that EuroExport tool and the $30 one that’s all over Ebay and Amazon, PGY brand I believe? Looks to be the exact same tool to me
 
What’s the difference between that EuroExport tool and the $30 one that’s all over Ebay and Amazon, PGY brand I believe? Looks to be the exact same tool to me
Probably nothing. But at the time 3 years ago I didn't want to spend hours searching for one that might work, order it, and wait a week to find out it didn't fit properly - when I knew this one fits and works perfectly. I did search but don't remember if those others were even around then but if so, I didn't want to chance it. I did get this one new off eBay which also included the valve stem seals.
 
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Here is an example

That is 100% a mityvac kit with a blue point label at twice the price it should be.
Blue point is almost 100% all rebranded stuff. Some is obvious while others are harder to tell because they'll try to make it look a little different. Actual snap-on brand however is for the most part all made by them. I've replaced a few sockets with snap-on brand ones because I've broken them more than once. Pretty much everything else I own is gearwrench just because its good quality from my experience but not as many $$$ as the tool trucks brands and they seem to follow the lifetime warranty pretty well when there is an issue. Although you do have to wait for them to send the new tool in the mail. Hence why I have replace commonly used sockets with snap-ons that I'm not worried about breaking.
 
I recently snapped a tap from a GearWrench tap & die kit I bought last year, and when I contacted them about it they sent a free replacement in the mail. Took a couple of weeks but I don't do much tapping so it wasn't an issue. Supposedly they don't use the highest quality HSS steel, but for the price it's a decent set. I've basically used it to chase the threads on broken bolts I've extracted (which is massively tedious work so it helps to have good tools).
 
I did buy a set of drill Nitride drill bits from HF; they are worthless on anything but soft wood and wearing out drills. But their jackstands are fine. I think there is something to the "right tool for the job" saying, where having more variety of marginal tools can sometimes be better than just the basic tools of utmost quality. It can go the other way, of course. I can recall when I got my snap-on wrench set back in the 90s, and Flank Drive seemed to be a snap-on innovation (radiused corners in the box end or socket, so the force goes farther onto the flats of the fastener, so less rounded bolt heads). Now they sell that feature in the tools at Lowes. So perhaps you pay more to be first with something.
I did buy a fairly comprehensive set of metric thread chasers right after I got my eclipse, as I knew there would be plenty of threads to fix. I got them on Ebay, and have been very pleased. I can even use them as a guage to figure out unknown thread size (of course all taps and dies do that). I had to by my chaser file separately. Very handy to fix the end threads on a bolt that get boogered up.
 
One tool I eventually want to get a better version of is an impact wrench. I have a decent 300ft-lb Craftsman C3, but it's not enough for really tight fasteners that have seized or rusted on, and something that has at least 500-600 would be nicer. Plus brushless, and with that nice feature for reinstalling fasteners where it shuts off as soon as it starts to get tight so you can then use a torque wrench. Sounds like a major time and pain saver. And maybe a 3/8" one as well, for lower torque fasteners, which is most of them. The 1/2" ones can be pretty heavy and unwiedly.
 
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