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2G NO START, NO WINDOWS NO DOOR LOCKS

AWD-Tony

Supporting Member
6,800
3,688
Sep 11, 2017
Cincinnati, Ohio
Nobody stated the potential for a bad battery?
Are you 100% sure it's good?
I agree. Continuous click (not mentioned before) is a low battery. Doesn’t matter what voltage reads, cca (cold crank amperage) is what it needs. This may also explain the windows not working. Bring your battery to the parts store and have them test it. Do this first before you start pulling your hair out.
 

Sniffbooger

Proven Member
309
132
Apr 12, 2020
Torrance, California
I agree. Continuous click (not mentioned before) is a low battery. Doesn’t matter what voltage reads, cca (cold crank amperage) is what it needs. This may also explain the windows not working. Bring your battery to the parts store and have them test it. Do this first before you start pulling your hair out.
Thanks, but my hair is already gone. It fell out years ago LOL...
I am sure my battery is NOT the issue. I have tried 3 different batteries that all work fine in my other cars. There is NO continuous clicking sound.
I only hear ONE click under the dash somewhere. The engine just won't turn over, and the door locks/windows don't work at all. I'm going to look behind the stereo in the dash and see if that jumper wire trick will do anything.
 

luv2rallye

DSM Wiseman
8,441
1,202
Jun 7, 2003
Minneapolis, Minnesota
From what I understand, the relay for the starter sits on top of the starter itself. Power to that relay comes directly from the ignition switch that is in the steering column.
No, that's the starter solenoid on top of the starter. The ignition switch Start position operates a separate starter relay which operates the starter solenoid. The starter solenoid then connects the battery positive to the starter through the very large battery positive cable. Note the massive starter current does not go through the starter relay.

Some other points:
- Try tapping the starter with a hammer. When they get old sometimes they stick.
- Battery negative large cable should go under a starter mounting bolt (on the bell housing). Another battery negative large cable should go to the firewall.
- There is a power window relay but it has nothing to do with your starter not working.
- Both battery positive and negative cables (both ends of each) must be clean and tight or there will be too much resistance (> 0.1 ohm which will drop too much voltage) for the starter to work even though other electrical stuff works. In fact if you have > 0.1 ohms total resistance in both the positive and negative large starter cables combined (or their terminal connections) the starter will not work. Measuring voltage right on the starter main positive terminal (must be terminal at the starter, not cable end at the battery) while key in Start position will tell you this.
 
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GSXRunner

Proven Member
150
33
Feb 24, 2013
Queens, New_York
This is from the FSM. I see just a connection from the ignition switch to the starter solenoid. I don't see any other relay in between. The ignition (ST) comes directly from the ignition switch.

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GSXRunner

Proven Member
150
33
Feb 24, 2013
Queens, New_York
You can see from these schematics that the doors and windows are driven from IG1 and IG2 that come from the ignition switch. My money is on a bad ignition switch.

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luv2rallye

DSM Wiseman
8,441
1,202
Jun 7, 2003
Minneapolis, Minnesota
This is from the FSM. I see just a connection from the ignition switch to the starter solenoid. I don't see any other relay in between. The ignition (ST) comes directly from the ignition switch.

Interesting. What year/make/model/engine/tranny is this from? Because all my FSM manuals show a starter relay. This is from my 1999 FSM:

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GSXRunner

Proven Member
150
33
Feb 24, 2013
Queens, New_York
My diagrams are from a 95-96 GSX. Your diagrams are probably for his car, so in that case he does have this extra relay. However, I don't think it's that relay because his power door locks and windows don't work. I bet if he tried the fan for the heat/AC , he will find that doesn't work either because it gets its power from the ignition switch when in run position. I'm still very sure it's his ignition switch. It's a 3 pole, 6 position switch that feeds a lot of stuff on the car. He just needs to remove the plastic cover under the steering column (3 screws I believe), locate the ignition switch and remove the two small Phillips head screws. The ignition switch pops right out.

If the plastic isn't all melted up, it can be fixed easily. They are cheap, but if he wants to get it up and running right away, and doesn't mind fixing at the atomic level, like I do. He can remove the top by prying the two plastic prongs with a screwdriver to separate the cover. Carbon can be scraped out from the inside. Do not pull out the guts because there are two metal balls that are pressurized by two springs that will fly out if you do pull it out. There is no reason to pull that out as nothing in there will be broken. Just get all the metal clean and shiny and it will work as good as new.

The ignition switch can also be tested once it's out. There are little holes in the case that are labeled (ST,IG1,IG2,etc). You can probe those with an ohmmeter before and after you fix it. You should get zero ohms if you did a good job.

I see, they have to put that starter relay in auto transmissions as a lockout to prevent the car from starting when in gear by putting it in series with a neutral safety switch.

Manual transmission don't have/need that starter relay.
 
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Sniffbooger

Proven Member
309
132
Apr 12, 2020
Torrance, California
I'm working on the car today. I did the jumper thing behind the stereo with the red and black to the yellow black wire and still nothing. No start. Also, the headlights don't work, and the fan does not come on with the key in the run position. I have checked resistance from the disconnected battery negative cable (with the positive cable still on the battery) to various points in the engine and the most I got was 0.6

Also, I don't know if it matters or not, but my radiator fans are unplugged and my air condenser fan is unplugged with this stop the car from starting???
 

GSXRunner

Proven Member
150
33
Feb 24, 2013
Queens, New_York
Also, I don't know if it matters or not, but my radiator fans are unplugged and my air condenser fan is unplugged with this stop the car from starting???
Did you read my post #34? It contains the solution to your problem.
 

Sniffbooger

Proven Member
309
132
Apr 12, 2020
Torrance, California
Did you read my post #34? It contains the solution to your problem.
The ignition switch worked fine before and I'm not sure how it would just go bad in a few months without driving it. I also see on the driver side in front of the wheel this box with all these wires that are disconnected...see photo

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GSXRunner

Proven Member
150
33
Feb 24, 2013
Queens, New_York
The ignition switch worked fine before and I'm not sure how it would just go bad in a few months without driving it. I also see on the driver side in front of the wheel this box with all these wires that are disconnected...see photo

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Good god, you just found this now? According to your first post, the car was sitting for a few years. Now you say it was a few months?

I'd of suspected squirrels or chipmunks chewing the wires, but those have been stripped by humans.
 

Sniffbooger

Proven Member
309
132
Apr 12, 2020
Torrance, California
Good god, you just found this now? According to your first post, the car was sitting for a few years. Now you say it was a few months?

I'd of suspected squirrels or chipmunks chewing the wires, but those have been stripped by humans.
Well, the truth be told, I don't really know how long it was sitting. It might have been a couple months or a couple years I really don't know... however I am trying to get it back to life and if you have any suggestions about this little box in front of the driver side front wheel...cuz it seems to be part of the alarm system and I don't want that... it's probably affecting and locking out everything right now... I can't even get the headlights to work this is just not right something is disabling everything
 

Sniffbooger

Proven Member
309
132
Apr 12, 2020
Torrance, California
I'm confused. I see a bunch of dangling wires coming out of harnesses but they don't come out of any box (like the ABS-ECU box in the pic). Also what year is this GSX and is it AT or MT?
It's in my profile, 1997 GSX Auto... not sure about these dangling wires but there's a little box right behind the driver's side headlights and in front of the driver side front wheel and I don't know if it's part of the alarm system or what... They come from under the fender. I really think this is some kind of an issue with the factory alarm disable that is not allowing me to operate the windows or the doors or the lights or the ignition..... BTW, is that box for the ABS?? I don't have it on the GST, so I'm not familiar with it.
 
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Sniffbooger

Proven Member
309
132
Apr 12, 2020
Torrance, California
OK, well I didn't make much progress this weekend...I messed with the car Saturday, and I think I discovered the little black box ABS in front of the driver side wheel, but I can't figure out why it still won't start or even headlights, door locks, windows don't work...I tried the jumper thing with the relay bypass behind the center console, no luck...I tested the grounds everywhere and the highest resistance was 0.6 ohms to the transmission. Or maybe it was 0.06 ??? Is this too high? I gave up and went to the casino, had a beer, and won 10k at a slot machine. I guess I should just pay someone to fix it for me...
 

1990TSIAWDTALON

Moderator
9,902
5,789
Nov 14, 2013
Independence, Kansas
Can you temporarily run a wire from the battery + to the fuse box and touch a fuse terminal to give the fuse box juice? I wouldn't be surprised if there is a short somewhere so be ready to pull it right back out but it is JUST A TEST to see if your lights and such come back on.
 

Sniffbooger

Proven Member
309
132
Apr 12, 2020
Torrance, California
Sure, I'll try it, but I won't be able to until next weekend...and I think I need to trace those wires up by the front ABS box and see what they are connected to...the black/red wires I don't think are OEM...its strange...
 

luv2rallye

DSM Wiseman
8,441
1,202
Jun 7, 2003
Minneapolis, Minnesota
I did the jumper thing behind the stereo with the red and black to the yellow black wire and still nothing. No start. Also, the headlights don't work, and the fan does not come on with the key in the run position.
- Do you have the factory theft alarm, or aftermarket alarm, or no alarm?

- Is that starter relay (behind the stereo) a 4 pin connector? Is there another relay next to it that's not 4 pins?
- When you jumpered its red/black to its yellow/black did you turn the key to Start? Try measuring the voltage on that jumper (multimeter positive on jumper, negative on ground {body metal}) when you turn the key to start.

- If no voltage and with no many things not working, I'm wondering if your 30 amp "IGN SW" fuse in engine fuse box is blown. Don't trust just looking. Remove it and test it with your meter in ohms (resistance) setting - should be zero ohms. IN FACT CHECK THIS 30 AMP fuse FIRST before doing my other stuff above!
 
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1990TSIAWDTALON

Moderator
9,902
5,789
Nov 14, 2013
Independence, Kansas
Sure, I'll try it, but I won't be able to until next weekend...and I think I need to trace those wires up by the front ABS box and see what they are connected to...the black/red wires I don't think are OEM...its strange...
The Blac/Red wires are DEFINATELY not stock......they say "Made in USA" on them ROFL
All my test was about was to see if you could power up the fuse box which is why I said from the battery + to the fuse box. IDK anything about wires behind the stereo, it only to get 12v to the fuse box to see if things came back to life.
 

chrysler kid

20+ Year Contributor
2,613
579
Dec 20, 2002
Mckinney, Texas
OK, well I didn't make much progress this weekend...I messed with the car Saturday, and I think I discovered the little black box ABS in front of the driver side wheel, but I can't figure out why it still won't start or even headlights, door locks, windows don't work...I tried the jumper thing with the relay bypass behind the center console, no luck...I tested the grounds everywhere and the highest resistance was 0.6 ohms to the transmission. Or maybe it was 0.06 ??? Is this too high? I gave up and went to the casino, had a beer, and won 10k at a slot machine. I guess I should just pay someone to fix it for me...

Youre going to tow it to a shop to have them tell you that you need a new engine wire harness, and that the part is discontinued and they dont make it anymore.

Buy a factory service manual off of ebay and start seeing where the wiring circuits get power from so you can start tracing 12v power leads.

You need to start getting under the dash and checking the primary accessory power wires coming out of the column. As mentioned before it could be a ignition cylinder problem or wiring problem under the dash
 

Sniffbooger

Proven Member
309
132
Apr 12, 2020
Torrance, California
The Blac/Red wires are DEFINATELY not stock......they say "Made in USA" on them ROFL
All my test was about was to see if you could power up the fuse box which is why I said from the battery + to the fuse box. IDK anything about wires behind the stereo, it only to get 12v to the fuse box to see if things came back to life.
OK, I SEE IT!!! Definitely not OEM LOL....I'll trace it back into the dash and see where it goes...

I already have a factory service manual for this car, I just don't know how to read it very well...I will spend some time checking wire colors and see where the black and green ones go...maybe they are for lights in the bumper?? I don't know yet... I'll spend some time this weekend and post updates....appreciate all of your input!!!
 
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