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ECMlink Intermittent Shift Knock!! Template Filled out

Posted by pooonpower, Aug 21, 2019

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  1. pooonpower

    pooonpower Probationary Member

    8
    2
    Joined Aug 21, 2019
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    1). Any boost, vac, or exhaust leaks?
    No
    Boost leak tested 5psi above your max boost with no leaks?
    Tested to 40psi

    2). Verified mechanical timing?
    Yes

    3). Verified base timing?
    Yes

    4). Ignition system
    COP or Stock Coil: COP
    Spark Plug brand, type and Gap: NGK-BPR8ES/.025

    5). Motor health (Compression Test)
    Cylinder 1:
    Cylinder 2:
    Cylinder 3:
    Cylinder 4:

    6). Performed basic throttle body adjustments?
    Idle Switch: Yes
    Throttle Cable: Yes
    TPS: Yes
    BISS: Yes

    7). Compression ratio
    9.0:1

    8). Any known bad sensors or brittle wiring?
    no, re-loomed knock wiring

    9). Any DTC/CEL codes?
    No

    10). Electrical system
    Car off (not running): 12.4 volts
    Car running: 14.4 volts

    11). Base fuel pressure and injector values
    Base Fuel Pressure: 43.5
    Injector Size (cc/min): FIC1050

    12). Properly calibrated and configured wideband sensor
    Sensor Brand: AEM
    Calibration Date:

    13). Type of fuel
    Type: 94 Octane

    14). Watched ECMlink how-to videos?
    Yes

    Good day all,

    Long time lurker, but I decided to make an account after failing to find answers after many weeks of searching, both on google and on here.

    The engine brand new, just finished building it in March, still breaking it in, so I haven't taken her to redline yet. Please check profile for mod list. Car is an Evo 4 with EcmLink V3, with the a brand new evo knock sensor.

    I seem to have a problem with shift knock, and it seems to be intermittent, the worst kind of problem....

    Attached is a log, which shows knock right when I get on the throttle after shifts sometimes. In the same log it shows there is none or very minimal knock when pulls are done in gear.

    Just looking for help or I can even pay someone to help me out with this. This is pulling a lot of timing and it's killing the performance!

    Thank you for continuing to support the community!
     

    Attached Files:

    101  1

    1997 Mitsubishi Evo 4
    awd · manual · Lancer Evolution
    Loading...
  2. motomattx

    motomattx Proven Member

    1,765
    560
    Joined Dec 9, 2010
    wampum, Pennsylvania
    What make and model is this on? I have known this to be an issue on the 95' ecu for some reason, it may be all 2g ecu's that act that way, not sure but I know that for whatever reason the 95' seems to be prone to phantom knock when getting on the throttle and if you let up and then hammer down on it, it seems to go away for the rest of the pull.
     

    Drag Race Build 3K  16

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
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  3. lglracer

    lglracer Supporting VIP

    77
    14
    Joined Jul 13, 2008
    Sacramento, California
    Looking at your mods list what kind of bushing do you have? I know from forums of different cars you can get knock from shifting depending on setup. I'm not saying that is it but might be something to look into. I am on my cell. I'll look at the log in the AM.
     

    Road Race Build 453  1

    1991 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 1G DSM

    Street Build 409  1

    1990 Mitsubishi Galant GSX
    awd · manual · Galant VR-4

    Street Build 1K  4

    1991 Mitsubishi Galant VR-4
    awd · manual · Galant VR-4

    462  0

    1991 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    manual · 1G DSM
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  4. gofer

    gofer Moderator

    5,484
    972
    Joined Feb 18, 2006
    South Gilbert, Arizona
    Looking through your log I don't see any indication that it should be knocking ie lean AFR's or timing advance so I'd suspect a loose/broken motor/trans mount, specifically the front/rear roll stops. Make sure they're both in good condition and all the associated hardware is torqued to spec.
     

    Street Build 16K  12  61

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.634 @ 126.050 · 2G DSM

    2K  0

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
    lglracer likes this.
  5. pooonpower

    pooonpower Probationary Member

    8
    2
    Joined Aug 21, 2019
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    The ECU itself is a 1997 2g ECU, and the car is a 1997 lancer evolution. Most of the wiring are the same, but I had to read the Evo 8 guide repeatedly to get it right. I'll try that trick with letting off the throttle during a wot run though, just to see if it continues to Knock. Will report back.

    I have ralliart hard rubber engine, trans, and front mount, and a super pro rear mount. I'll loosen and retorque all the mounts just to make sure though.

    Thanks for the reassurance gofer, that makes me sleep better at night. All the mounts are within two years old, including the rear diff mounts. Ralliart hard rubber engine, trans, front roll stopper, and all diff bushes. Super pro rear roll stopper. The dp is also not touching anything as well.
    I see on the Ecmlink page that there is a mod for disabling knock retard, do you think it's a safe mod to try given this isn't real knock?
     

    101  1

    1997 Mitsubishi Evo 4
    awd · manual · Lancer Evolution
    Loading...
  6. lglracer

    lglracer Supporting VIP

    77
    14
    Joined Jul 13, 2008
    Sacramento, California
    Them being rubber should make too much of a difference. But good idea to check them. Do you have all solid bushing in the shift linkage?
     

    Road Race Build 453  1

    1991 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 1G DSM

    Street Build 409  1

    1990 Mitsubishi Galant GSX
    awd · manual · Galant VR-4

    Street Build 1K  4

    1991 Mitsubishi Galant VR-4
    awd · manual · Galant VR-4

    462  0

    1991 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  7. pooonpower

    pooonpower Probationary Member

    8
    2
    Joined Aug 21, 2019
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    I do yes. I have solid bushings for the transmission side and also on the shifter cage as well. It feels nice, haha.
     

    101  1

    1997 Mitsubishi Evo 4
    awd · manual · Lancer Evolution
    Loading...
    lglracer likes this.
  8. EVLGSX

    EVLGSX Proven Member

    404
    153
    Joined Dec 7, 2017
    Wallingford, Connecticut
    awesome car

    All the knock is happening at WOT

    somethings up

    dont disable the knock sensor
     

    Street Build 2K  15

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
    pooonpower likes this.
  9. pooonpower

    pooonpower Probationary Member

    8
    2
    Joined Aug 21, 2019
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    All the mounts check out, nice and solid and still new. Here is the latest log and snippet. As you can see the knock just shoots straight up right when I shift.
    I do notice my wideband reacts pretty slow though since its downstream. Could that be a problem??
    3rd gear shift knock.JPG
     

    Attached Files:

    101  1

    1997 Mitsubishi Evo 4
    awd · manual · Lancer Evolution
    Loading...
  10. gofer

    gofer Moderator

    5,484
    972
    Joined Feb 18, 2006
    South Gilbert, Arizona
    That snippet shows your target AFR's (AFRatioEst) and your actual AFR's (Wideband) are no where near each other and they should match. The ECU is trying to achieve a 10.3:1 AFR and your WB is displaying a 12.9:1 AFR. This doesn't indicate the reason why it's knocking though, like I said before, but it does indicate that your car isn't tuned as is obvious since you haven't touched your VE table and have only made adjustments to your fuel injector globals.

    Do 3rd gear pulls from 2k to 6k and adjust your VE table to get AFR's to line up, then figure out your knock issue after shifts (since it's not an obvious fix with a loose motor mount or exhaust dp).
     

    Street Build 16K  12  61

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.634 @ 126.050 · 2G DSM

    2K  0

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  11. pooonpower

    pooonpower Probationary Member

    8
    2
    Joined Aug 21, 2019
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    You are correct, I haven't touched the higher loads and upper rpm range of the ve tables yet, just focused on the cruise part of it, and it's driving really well on the street.
    The wb eventually catches up to the afrest though, and its actually lower than the afrest. Does adjusting the ve table help solve the slow reacting WB?
     

    101  1

    1997 Mitsubishi Evo 4
    awd · manual · Lancer Evolution
    Loading...
  12. gofer

    gofer Moderator

    5,484
    972
    Joined Feb 18, 2006
    South Gilbert, Arizona
    The WB isnt reacting slowly, its displaying what your AFRs are at that RPM/load/psia based on the VE cells being used. Where its rich you're giving it too much VE in those cells and where its lean you're not giving it enough. Doing a 3rd gear WOT pull from 2k to 6k AFREst and WB should marry within 2%> of each other at around 2.5-3k and stay lined up as far as you rev it.

    To correct the VE in those cells where the AFREst isn't matched to your WB do the following...

    Divide your WB reading by your AFREst...
    ie. 12.9 / 10.3 = 1.25.
    Then multiply this number by your current VE being used in that VE cell, we'll say it's 78.
    ie. 78 x 1.25 = 97.5 <-- this is the number you'd put in the VE cell.

    You'd do the same if the WB is richer than the AFREst, say it's reading 9.3:1 and AFREst is 10.3...
    ie. 9.3 / 10.3 = 0.9.
    Then multiply this number by the VE being used in that VE cell, we'll say it's 80.
    ie. 80 x 0.9 = 72 <-- this is the number you'd put in the VE cell.

    You do this throughout the entire WOT pull and smooth them out, then do another WOT pull and see if AFR's married up with the AFREst. Rinse and repeat until they do...
     

    Street Build 16K  12  61

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.634 @ 126.050 · 2G DSM

    2K  0

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
    DarkKnight86 and pooonpower like this.
  13. pooonpower

    pooonpower Probationary Member

    8
    2
    Joined Aug 21, 2019
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    You Corey, are a true hero. Not only do you provide critical feedback, but also provides answers and tips as well. I will have some free time tomorrow morning to make some runs. Will report back!

    Thanks Corey
     

    101  1

    1997 Mitsubishi Evo 4
    awd · manual · Lancer Evolution
    Loading...

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