GOAL: 97 GSX to handle like the Skyline R34s

[Kinovic_GSX]

Hey, i just recently bought a stock 97 eclipse GSX. i had a GST for a while b4 totalling it. i drive a 97 3000GT as my daily driver, so i was wanting to build the heck out of this 4g63 car. I have a list of mods that i want to get done to the car. i will be doin most of the work myself. My goal for this project is to be able to handle 480-525 HP, and be able to give most cars a run for there money.

the mods

Evo III exhaust manifold
Evo III O2 sensor housing
Apexi GT Downpipe
Apexi GT Exhaust

Ingen Cold air intake
HKS new super seqential blow off valve
Venom Drag intake Manifolds
Garrett GT35R Turbo

Greddy FMIC
Greddy Intercooler piping
Flexalite Direct fit electric cooling fans

ACT 2600 clutch kit

Bian Crower DSM Stroker kit (BC rods and pistons)
Unorthodox ultra T cam gears
HKS camshafts

Walbro 255 fuel pump
new turbo gauge
aeromotive fuel pressure regulator
AEM fuel rail
Venom Super Flow injectors

Brembro cross drilled rotors
Ebachi Springs
Tein struts
Front and rear sway bars, don't know what kind yet

Super AFC
Greddy Boost Controller
Greddy Turbo Timer
AEM EMS

I think thats about it. I just want to get other people opinions and any suggestions would be great. thanks

 

[imagine3163]

Super AFC
Greddy Boost Controller
Greddy Turbo Timer
AEM EMS

Why would you get the Super AFC if you are getting the AEM EMS?

 

[kahl23]

Ok, I definitely have a few comments on this build. I would say you need to do some more research. I made a similar mistake to you when I first started modding, assuming that name brand parts that are advertised in magazines are the way to go. This is not the case, let me explain below.

Evo III exhaust manifold
Evo III O2 sensor housing
Apexi GT Downpipe
Apexi GT Exhaust

A few things, one, the EVOIII exhaust manifold is a good piece, but the FP race manifold is probably a better unit. Also, the E3 O2 housing will route your downpipe right into your transfer case, so realize that you will chew through your flex section if you don't get a downpipe specifically designed for use with the E3 O2 housing. The only one I know of is the RRE downpipe. Finally, the Apex'i exhausts are not true 3 inch exhausts, they have internal resonators and bottlenecks in them. Look into the Thermal R&D, which only has one minor section that is less than 3 inches, or VRS, or make your own.

Ingen Cold air intake
HKS new super seqential blow off valve
Venom Drag intake Manifolds
Garrett GT35R Turbo

That turbo might be a bit overkill for your goals, but you could definitely get there. A GT30R, HX-35 or BW S256ET or S258ET would be smaller, faster spooling turbos that are still capable of your power goals, it would just be harder to get there with them than with a GT35R. However, running a GT35R in a bolt on housing is really a waste, IMHO. You are cramming a large turbine wheel into a very small housing. If you were to keep it bolt on, the only 35R variant I would suggest would be the Forced Performance DSM82. That would give you good spool and will more than meet your power goals. Last time I checked, the INJEN air intakes were designed for a stock sized turbo inlet, not the massive 4" inlet a GT35R has. I would recommend getting a FP 4" intake pipe. Haven't heard all that much about Venom intake manifold (this is an I-4, we only have one mani), not that many people run them, and I would venture a guess that DSM specific vendors like Magnus, or JMF have products that outperform them, but I would do some research on that

Greddy FMIC
Greddy Intercooler piping
Flexalite Direct fit electric cooling fans

In my opinion, Greddy FMICs are not worth the money at all. They have long route piping, flimsy cores, and also route the LICP right in front of the core, no thanks. Look into ETS, SBR, or if you don't mind dropping some serious coin DV/DT Fabrications. All are better choices than Greddy.

ACT 2600 clutch kit

Bian Crower DSM Stroker kit (BC rods and pistons)
Unorthodox ultra T cam gears
HKS camshafts

The ACT 2600 is a tried and true option, but your goals would probably be more torque than it can handle. I would say get an unsprung 6-puck disc for sure, or maybe look into getting a 2900. The high dollar option on this one would be a Quarter Master or Power Train Technologies twin disc clutch. I see no transmission upgrades, you definitely need to get on that. Personally I would say John Shepherd is the man to talk to. I dont know anything about the BC stroker kit, but I would do some research on it and make sure there aren't cheaper or better alternatives. Also, what HKS camshafts? For your goals you'd want 272/272 minimum. 280/280 is another good option, but if you want more midrange or want to road race you might want to sacrifice the additional power of the 280s for the lower powerband of the 272s.

Walbro 255 fuel pump
new turbo gauge
aeromotive fuel pressure regulator
AEM fuel rail
Venom Super Flow injectors

Fuel rail is useless, the stocker is just as large if not larger than a -10 AN rail, keep it. Don't know anything about Venom injectors, but I highly, highly recommend FIC. Those guys make a great product and stand behind it. You'll probably want 950cc injectors minimum. On regular gas they'll be able to support your goals. If you want more power you'd need larger injectors and probably a second pump, either two in tank 255s or the 255 with an inline pump.

Brembro cross drilled rotors
Ebachi Springs
Tein struts
Front and rear sway bars, don't know what kind yet

I was unaware that Tein made just shocks, pretty sure they only make springs and full coilovers for DSMs. I can say that my Flex's are great on the street and still very capable of aggressive driving, but if you really want to take on cars on the racetrack look into Muellerized JIC's from RRE (IF they still offer them, I havent heard much from RRE in the past few years). Those JICs will, however, be much harsher than the Flex's or really anything else Tein offers for us. For sway bars look into RM racing. Finally, don't get cross drilled rotors, get slotted rotors. Same functionality of drilled rotors with better longevity.

Super AFC
Greddy Boost Controller
Greddy Turbo Timer
AEM EMS

As said above, EMS and AFC makes no sense, one or the other. AFC is really limited, and cannot support your goals. EMS is incredibly functional but incredibly hard to tune. Personally, I would suggest either getting an EPROM ECU and getting ECMLink (what I use and love), or wiring in an EVOVIII ECU. Much simpler and almost as functional as the EMS. I doubt that you would see any advantage by using a full standalone with your setup anyway.

You have a pretty complete mod list, but it honestly seems like it was constructed by going through magazine ads and not by doing actual research on these cars. Go through this site and familiarize yourself with the upgrade paths. Also, SEARCH. Almost any question you have can be answered by the little yellow button.

 

[rush2252]

I think I would do lots of research before I did anything. THere are better turbos than the GT35R and just because you throw some money on some parts doesnt always mean you will have a fast car. Save your money for tuning and engine management. Set a goal and stick to it. Dont buy something for its name or you will be sadly disappointed in the long run

Just some food for thought
Kolby

 

[xioca]

For god sakes do the Timing belt too.

 

[kahl23]

I was debating telling him to do maintenance too, but it sounds as if he's getting this car and immediately tearing it down and rebuilding the engine with a stroker, so I figured it would be a moot point to say that. But, xioca is right. Make sure to use new items that degrade over time like timing belt, water pump, oil pump, etc and do a balance shaft elim while youre in there. Also, obviously use new gaskets.
That reminds me, you never specified what headwork or gaskets you were using. You should look into at least some springs and retainers, 3g lifters, new valves, guides, and seals, maybe a 5 angle valve job and some mild portwork to clean up the casting of the head. You don't necessarily need the springs and retainers for the 272s, but it is a smart idea. You can definitely go farther than that, but that is the minimum I would do. Use at least ARP head studs with your choice of gasket. The beefiest setup would be A1 Technologies studs combined with a FelPro PermaTorque headgasket, though you could get away with some standard ARP's and a stock composite. Just realize that the composite will be much more sensitive to knock than an MLS gasket and more likely to blow. A good middle range would be ARP L19s and a Mitsubishi MLS headgasket. Just remember, the sealing surfaces of both the head and block MUST be perfectly flat in order to use an MLS reliably. I believe the spec on the head surface texture is 40 ra or better, which any competent machinist can do for you.

 

[BoostFrenzy]

Good god is there some reading to be had...

Look's like the kahl23 bro's have already covered most of it though. Just do a LOT more reading. And if anything, just learn about different parts of the car in general. Doesn't matter if it's not going to make you faster, it'll most likely break at some point in the cars life .

 

[xioca]

At least he appears to have read then most so far.

 

[rick_dsm90]

I agree with kahl23 100%. It doesn't matter how big your turbo is unless you can accurately use it.

I made the same mistake thinking that I could just throw a bunch of "names" at my car to make it go fast. Here's something else to think about, are you going to get rid of the 7bolt trash??????? I take my dog for a walk but id rather not take my car if you know what I mean. It gets really expensive!

Here's an easy fix when your crank goes nova. Check out karking in the vendors section, they have a drop in long block for the 2g and it's the 6bolt motor! I think it is around 2200 bucks but don't quote me.

Please do some research and then make your build. if road racing is what you want to do maybe go to a track day and talk to some other 2g guys that have what you want. First hand experience is so much better then sport compact tuner from Wal-Mart.

 

[habitatguy187]

Scratch out the aem ems and get link, some 1600s, and run e-85. If you don't want to/can't run e-85 look into meth/water injection.

 

[spectr019]

You very much remind me of me back starting out, although you are one step above me by not asking how to make the 'whoosh' sound when shifting

I noticed that this is your very first post, so you've read import tuner (the cliche mag), bought a car, signed up, and wanted people to give you acclaim for the names of parts you dropped down. This also means that you havn't asked any questions to the people who have done it all before. Now either that means that you took the 'search' button to the extreme and found EVERY SINGLE answer to EVERY SINGLE question you may have had, or that you just havn't asked anything yet. My list (as I'm sure others as well) changed DRAMATICALLY from part to part as I installed them. I made a list like yours, but now when I go look under my hood it is ALL different. What you are talking about is a LOT and LOT and LOT of money, and considering you've already totalled a dsm, make sure you're ready to possibly wave all that money goodbye in a second out on the road or on the strip.

How resourceful are you in your own garage? Are you a novice and fabbing your own stuff and plan on learning as you go? That's what I did, and it worked out well, but I would suggest starting out in steps. Learn how to use a dremel, learn how to use a sawzall, learn how to use a welder, learn how to use a WRENCH.

Every single part you have listed is a name brand piece (minus the 'turbo gauge' you have listed, which I am only assuming you mean a boost gauge). You'll be surprised to learn how a pipe is a pipe. As mentioned before, read on how pieces work with other pieces. I found out myself (as mentioned earlier) how the evo o2 housing won't mate with most downpipes (I use a megan dp, and I had to adjust that). And that's just an example, so learn how everything works.

You can spend $5,000-20,000 on parts yet not have a car running 14 seconds in a 1/4 mile. Your TUNING will make your car fast. And no, I don't mean that turning a few dials on an AFC will get you another 200hp, but when you list that you will have an afc along with an EMS, I feel that you need to learn a great deal about tuning (plus, not from personal experience, but I understand it that the AEM unit doesn't work very well with our cars..it may be because it IS extremely difficult to tune with, but either way, go with what was mentioned in previous replies). I'm also thinking that you're coming from more of a naturally aspirated family (yes I did read your previous vehicle history), but Venom products excel with cars like Honda and Acura. Their communities talk about Venom as we do Apexi. My friend's ex boyfriend brought his srt-4 over to my house and was showing it off to me all proud and everything, telling me that he bought "all the toys" for a stage 2 setup. By that I'm thinking me means the toys, the goods, the parts, whatever. But apparently "the toys" is a term for a stage of products. Asking him what kind of parts they are (what cc injectors, what flow power of a pump, what spec of turbo), he has absolutely no freakin clue, all he can tell me is that his car is 'stage 2.' I tell him I'm stage 0, take him for a race, and absolutely embarass him. I bring up this what may seem like a pointless story because of your planned injectors, your Venom 'super flow' injectors. Any idea what cc they run at? When switching something like injectors out, if you buy something that sounds pretty powerfull like 'super flow' that only pushes out 680cc, then you're going to be very surprised at what the results are...as well as pissed. Same thing with your electric cooling fans. What is the cfm that you plan? You going to do push or pull fans? As mentioned earlier you have nothing about transmission. Launching a car with that much torque WILL BREAK THE TRANSMISSION. Otherwise if you slip the clutch half way down the track, you'll be replacing that every few weeks and not having good times. For the stroker kit...what will you ultimately have the engine output at? 2.1? 2.3? Why Brian Crower? May want to look at a dual pump setup also. For your boost controller, are you going to do manual or electronic? I don't think (could very much be wrong) that greddy makes a manual...Be careful, cause manual and electric have their strenghts and weaknesses for high boost and low boost. Coming into this post I thought you flat out meant you wanted a gsx to HANDLE like a skyline, as in suspsenion. You're not going to handle in the same ballpark as a skyline with what you have mentioned...not even a ballpark, you won't even be in the same sport. You'll need to get something adjustable (you didn't mention anything about that), and by something I mean coilovers. For your brakes, do you JUST plan on throwing in some new rotors and calling it a day? No ss lines, no nothing? I am very very happy that you didn't even MENTION anything about rims, for so long as your rims are straight and truley round without any dents or anything, they are not going to make you go faster, even the lighter ones are not a great deal lighter (try holding a tireless 2g stock rim....it's not that bad).

With everything I just wrote, I do not think that it added to what has already pretty much been said, but we want it to be VERY VERY clear to you that you can not just go online, put your credit card number on every vendor's site, install your stuff, and expect to be a skyline. Otherwise with all the money you're going to be spending, if you want something that matches up to a skyline, then use that money to put a down payment ON a skyline and have that brought on over. But hey, don't think that we're against ya (again, in my case you remind me of me, as I'm sure with a bunch of others), just do research and take your time with things. Stick around the forums and learn. Speaking of stick, that is something that you make NO mention about....is your car a manual tranny or automatic? Sounds like a stupid question because it would be obvious that if you wanted to do all of this that you would have a manual, but lots of kids would come into the shop wanting to buy a short shifter kit for their auto... Take it easy

Ben

 

[Gamble97]

Hey, i just recently bought a stock 97 eclipse GSX. i had a GST for a while b4 totalling it. i drive a 97 3000GT as my daily driver, so i was wanting to build the heck out of this 4g63 car. I have a list of mods that i want to get done to the car. i will be doin most of the work myself. My goal for this project is to be able to handle 480-525 HP, and be able to give most cars a run for there money.

the mods

Evo III exhaust manifold
Evo III O2 sensor housing
Apexi GT Downpipe
Apexi GT Exhaust

Ingen Cold air intake
HKS new super seqential blow off valve
Venom Drag intake Manifolds
Garrett GT35R Turbo

Greddy FMIC
Greddy Intercooler piping
Flexalite Direct fit electric cooling fans

ACT 2600 clutch kit

Bian Crower DSM Stroker kit (BC rods and pistons)
Unorthodox ultra T cam gears
HKS camshafts

Walbro 255 fuel pump
new turbo gauge
aeromotive fuel pressure regulator
AEM fuel rail
Venom Super Flow injectors

Brembro cross drilled rotors
Ebachi Springs
Tein struts
Front and rear sway bars, don't know what kind yet

Super AFC
Greddy Boost Controller
Greddy Turbo Timer
AEM EMS

I think thats about it. I just want to get other people opinions and any suggestions would be great. thanks

No need for afc with AEM EMS like stated.
Venom is crap IMO. Get some 1250cc or bigger FIC blue max injectors.
Stock fuel rail can support gobs of power, recently seen a car put down over 800hp on a STOCK fuel rail with SS fuel lines.
Front sway bar is not needed IMO.
Hallman or Joep are the ONLY two boost controllers I would ever use.
You will need some good brake pads, like hawk pads.
Injen does NOT make a cold air intake and their intake pipe is only 2.25" opening when your gt35R will have a 4" inlet. So with that being said you can get an FP intake pipe OR run no intake pipe at all since you will be on speed density with AEM EMS.
HKS bov FTL. If your going AEM or even not Tial bov is the ONLY way to go.
A stroker kit is not needed for the HP you want to go.
By turbo gauge, do you mean boost gauge? I would also recommend a wideband. Those are the minimal 2 gauges you need to run.
Greddy FMIC is junk. ETS makes some really really nice fmic kits.
Also might want to look into a SMIM since it might be hard making that much power on a stock intake manifold.
Unless your going to have your cams degreed adjustable cam gears are a waste of money. Lots of people buy them but never use them.
On a gt35r, you will be external gate so you will want a nice o2 housing, 38mm tial wastegate.
I don't know, to me this sounds like a wish list that you just slapped together and think will work.
Before you do ANYTHING you need to do maintenance FIRST. Checking your transfer case for leaks, checking your balljoints or having the dealer replace them under warranty, timing belt, tensioner, etc etc.
People just start doing mods w/o fixing whats wrong with the car first and that is the first sign you have no idea what your doing.
Also you will want a lightweight flywheel as well.
So good luck to you.

 

[DWR-DSM]

Why would you get the Super AFC if you are getting the AEM EMS?

I said the samething in my head

 

[bling5tatus]

, there's nothing wrong with 7bolt motors, you guys need to stop spreading misinformation.

Crankwalk is like so 2001.

 

[SkylinesSuck]

the eclipse is alot lighter so you would not have to go that that of an extreme to get stock r34 skyline would you??

Completly agree. I don't know how much Eclipses weigh, but most of the early Evo's here on the island that have most of the bolt ons and a tune wouldn't have too aweful much trouble with a stock R34, GTR or not.

R34's are kind of like 'vettes or Vipers in the fact that they are pretty expensive to begin with and most people who can afford them aren't wanting to dump a bunch of money into them either because they don't have anymore $ left to spend, or they just want the car due to mid-life crisis any ways.

 

[lacroixdp]

, there's nothing wrong with 7bolt motors, you guys need to stop spreading misinformation.

Crankwalk is like so 2001.

Your statement that there's nothing wrong with 7bolt motors is incorrect. Even though the likelihood of you getting crankwalk is pretty low, it does exist and it is something you need to keep in the back of your head when working with 7bolts. It is something I would check for if I were to buy a 2G - I've seen people get screwed over too many times thinking crankwalk won't happen to them.

As for the OP, I'm not sure if you're expecting your Eclipse to out-handle a Skyline or not. Is that one of your goals?

 

[GS-T_Newboost]

SEARCH MAN. That is one heck of a FIRST post. Just because its a big time name brand and cost way more then other stuff doesnt mean its good. Greddy Fmic like 800 dollars and is junk in my opinion. Thats just my 0.02

 

[Gamble97]

SEARCH MAN. That is one heck of a FIRST post. Just because its a big time name brand and cost way more then other stuff doesnt mean its good. Greddy Fmic like 800 dollars and is junk in my opinion. Thats just my 0.02

Your the 5th person that is telling him to search, I think he gets the idea.

 

[rick_dsm90]

Heres another idea for you to wrap your mind around.

check out VFAQ Site - Visual Frequently Answered Questions and Road///Race Engineering Mitsubishi Eclipse Parts and Performance

they have great "how to's" on modding your car for whatever the app your looking for.

 

[UnsafeAtAnySpd]

I too came into this thread and thought the main subject was going to be handling. Disappointing.

 

[erald01]

the E3 O2 housing will route your downpipe right into your transfer case, so realize that you will chew through your flex section if you don't get a downpipe specifically designed for use with the E3 O2 housing. The only one I know of is the RRE downpipe. Finally, the Apex'i exhausts are not true 3 inch exhausts, they have internal resonators and bottlenecks in them. Look into the Thermal R&D, which only has one minor section that is less than 3 inches, or VRS, or make your own.


Not necessarily i have an apexi dp with the evo3 o2 housing, but everything else said about the set up does make sense, we all have made those mistakes before.

 

[dsm-onster]

, there's nothing wrong with 7bolt motors, you guys need to stop spreading misinformation.

Crankwalk is like so 2001.

Your statement that there's nothing wrong with 7bolt motors is incorrect. Even though the likelihood of you getting crankwalk is pretty low, it does exist and it is something you need to keep in the back of your head when working with 7bolts. It is something I would check for if I were to buy a 2G - I've seen people get screwed over too many times thinking crankwalk won't happen to them.

Amen. And no one mentioned crankwalk in the first place. The 7bolt motor has weaker rods, smaller head fasteners, weaker gears in the oil pump (straight cut 6bolt gears seam to do alot better with the BS elemination), thinner rod bolts, less desirable stock cam profiles, . . .speaking of which

OP, you have suggested runnign a gt35r and a stroker but no mention of cams.

Running the stroker kit, you do have the advantage of the girdle, which is of no concern for anything under about 650whp, way over your goal. You will have all forged internals, so no issue with weak 7bolt internals. But you still have those pesky small headbolt holes. I'd machine them out for 6bolt arps or run $200 L19 head fasteners.

 

[kahl23]

you must've missed it, he talked about HKS cams, but failed to mention which HKS cams.

 

[dsm-onster]

Sure did.

Definately don't install 264s.

 

[DWR-DSM]

I like the BC 272s cams. I feel they aren't too much or too little for the streets