Final Manual Conversion Thread

[92Laser-T]

Yea one of my cables was runnin short so they just made something ??? dont really know what but its great now Everythig shifts nice and all. I do still have couple things to work out though. Maybe somebody can help. 1. When I launch in 1st (normal drivin) I seem to get like a vibration but its only in 1st at Low RPMS. all the other gears are perfect in all RPMS any ideas? 2. I can start up my car no prob it turns over Great. but after lil while of drivin (15-30 min) when I push in the clutch and let off the car dies. I no the car was sittin for awhile so I'm guessin the fuel filter might be bad so i'm changin tht ASAP. When it does stall I have to like pump the gas to get it going but once its going no hesitation at all 3. When the car gets to normal Temp I get some smoke comin from right where the radiator cap is and you can see where the fluid has sprayed on near parts. I've been told that the Cap is not holding pressure, i'm hoping. Also for question #2 could this have anything to do with runnin on a N/A ECU I dont get on it and the guy lost the Turbo ECU but he had the N/A and he said to come in 2 days and he'll drive it to see if its cool. Guy knows alot about cars so i'm not doubting anything he says U can find him on Supra/Viper/Nsx forums under TTBADBOY. I would GREATLY appreciate some advice on these. Thanks

 

[Crazy29187]

Yeah, I dunno about the cables, I think I was confused.

I would say the turbo ECU would be a great help. Dunno if it will fix it, but it probably will.

The only things I'm not sure about now are the rear axles and the wiring. I'm not a mechanic, so I don't know much about these things. I'm kinda learning as I go along, and when I do the swap, I'm gonna have my friend help me do it. But, from what I've looked at, I think electrically, there's only two things that need to be done. Someone chime in and correct me or tell me if I'm right.

1. Starter
According to the circuit diagram I have on my computer, the A/T uses pins 8 & 9 on the inhibitor switch. Instead of just connecting these two wires as per the VFAQ, I was thinking you could just get the clutch pedal position switch and hook that up to the 2 wires on the inhibitor switch. It would look something like this:

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2. Reverse Lights
This one should be pretty easy, just hook the M/T reverse sensor up to 2 other wires on the inhibitor switch:

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I chopped the hell out of those pictures in MS Paint, so they're not 100% accurate circuit diagrams. I just took out the unimportant stuff to save space. But, if those diagrams are correct, I think that's the only wiring you have to do. Someone check the clutch switch part though.

BTW: Hey , since when do you spell starter motor "starter moter"?

 

[92TsiTalon]

i wouldnt think that the N/A ecu could support all the sensors and parts differences between the two motors. for one, the n/a ecu doesnt have boost support (if you're not using an aftermarket boost controller) and the n/a cars dont use a knock sensor. other differences that are going to directly effect what you're experiencing are the fuel system support. im pretty sure that the vacuum lines that control the fuel pressure regulator are going to give it different readings from the ecu. i just cant see how they would even get close to working the same. just my .02.

 

[92TsiTalon]

so, if im reading these diagrams right, you basically bypass the inhibitor switches on both, and on the reverse lights you have to use the reverse sensor as well. ill search my service manual and see what i can come up with.

 

[Crazy29187]

Originally posted by 92TsiTalon
so, if im reading these diagrams right, you basically bypass the inhibitor switches on both, and on the reverse lights you have to use the reverse sensor as well. ill search my service manual and see what i can come up with.

Yeah, I was thinking that you'd bypass the inhibitor switch on both. Even on the VFAQ that guy bypasses the inhibitor, but he just hardwires the 2 wires together so that you could start the car even with the clutch pedal not pushed down. My idea was to get the clutch switch from the parts car or new, $12.36 from Conicelli (MB605790) and just run the 2 wires from the switch to the inhibitor switch connector.

As far as the reverse sensor, it should be right in the transmission, so the only obstacle would be to get the wire connector, but I'm sure you could make one if you needed to.

 

[92TsiTalon]

...ive got it all figured out....i just cant figure out how to post pictures....

 

[92TsiTalon]

on the clutch switch part of your diagram, you wouldnt be able to just splice in the switch because there is an inpur and an output on the switch harness (pin #1 and pin #2). the input will definitely have to come from a relay (the starter relay), and the output is a ground which you show and plugging into the A-10 connector which i dont believe accepts a (-) polarity. i have a diagram coming as soon as i get the images posted on my yahoo id.

 

[92TsiTalon]

THIS IS VERY, VERY THOROUGH. READ EVERYTHING.

Alright, I got the pics to load up on another site so hopefully this works. I dont know how that guy in the VFAQ came up with the idea of just connecting the two black wires, but apparently it works for him. I have found a way to use the major M/T wiring components with the A/T wiring that should keep you from being able to start the car without the clutch pedal in. This info is for a 1G, so e-mail me if you need help with a 2G. First off, here are the pics from the service manual and the pic that I modified to show how the final wiring diagram should look.

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There is the pics from the service manual. As you can see by the key off to the side, those symbols indicate the corresponding types of connectors just so you know what you're looking for.

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That is my "hacked" picture. Its really hard to tell the difference between this one and the original M/T diagram, but it will all be explained as to how to make your A/T wiring look like this.

First things first, how do you read this friggin diagram? The main things you'll want to take notice of are:

1) Wire Thickness and Color - denoted by the letter/number combination to the side of each solid line. For example, in the original pics, you'll notice a "3-BY" next to the vertical line. This means that the wire is 3mm thick, and it is a Black wire with a Yellow stripe.

2) Connectors - take notice of these connectors: starter relay (C-35X), inhibitor switch (B-25), clutch pedal switch (C-28), the C-59 connector, and the A-10 connector (which as you will notice is different between the the A/T and the M/T)


Now, just look at the diagrams and try to figure out what they mean (this might take a while...it did for me)

The parts you will need to acquire for the wiring will be the starter relay and the clutch pedal switch. Im still working on the part numbers for these parts from conicelli, and I will post some pics of where to find these components in relation to the car.

Now for the fun part...

With the steering wheel off and the plastic around the column off as well as any underdash pieces, you can see the ignition switch...you know...the part that you stick your key into. By looking at the diagram, the wire you need will be 3mm thick and black with a yellow stripe. This wire will run straight to the C-59 intermediate harness.

What we need to do is splice in the starter relay BEFORE the C-59 harness. If you look at the M/T diagram, you'll notice that the wire splits into two wires, the second being 2mm thick and black with a white stripe.

The wire you use doesnt HAVE to be that color, but if you can find the right wire, it will make installation easier in that wire colors won't confuse you when you refer back to the diagrams.

Notice that these wire both plug into the starter relay. If you look on the right side of the diagram, you will see a picture of the connector to the relay and which pin is which. You will also see numbers to the side of the wire. These numbers indicate which pin the wire should run to. Im not sure if there will be short wires already installed into a brand new relay, or if they will have to set in when you get it, so be prepared to go to an automotive shop to have this done if you dont know how.

Do you see that little twisty line inside the starter relay? Thats a "coil" according to the dsm backup manual. This is what will keep us from simply cutting out the inhibitor switch and splicing in the clutch pedal switch. Whatever signal the relay is recieving, it is changed when it goes through the coil so that the clutch pedal switch know whether to kick it on, or off.

How does the clutch pedal switch work? Well, you'll notice that the clutch pedal switch output goes to a chassis ground. This simply closes the relay circuit allowing the relay to send a signal to the starter motor.

Alright, now direct your attention to the output of the starter relay, which is the #3 pin. You'll notice that on the original M/T diagram, the output wire is 3mm thick and black with a red stripe. You do not have this wire on your A/T. Of course, when you spliced in the the starter relay, you have the other side of the 3mm, black with yellow stripe not connected to anything. That wire will connect to the C-59 intermediate harness just the same way it did before, we just have to connect the output of the starter relay. I dont know how long these wires are in between connectors, but I would recommend just using a 3mm wire that's black with a yellow stripe as this would denote the wire going to the starter. The picture shows that pin #2 is used on the C-59 intermediate harness, but you may want to check you factory wiring before splicing any wires. Im thinking that it just uses the #2 pin on either side of the intermediate harness, which makes this part really easy.

Here is were you'll want to look at the factory output wiring for the inhibitor switch. This wire is 2mm thick and black with a yellow stripe. My advice would be to run this kind of wire (if the existing one is long enough use it) from the #2 pin on the female side of the C-59 intermediate harness to where the 2-BY splits for the A-10 intermediate harness.

From there the wiring should be intact, just connect the very end of the 2-BY wire to the "S" connector on the starter motor. This is the very top connector on the starter motor.

Anywho, the main difference that im going out on a ledge for is the A-10 intermediate harness. The one from a M/T is a 4-pin harness and the one from an A/T is a 2-pin harness. However, only two pins are used on either of them for the starter motor connections, so I think this will work.

I will get some pics up to show you where to find each of these harnesses and connectors if I can find them in the back-up manuals.

Geez...this could be a VFAQ all in itself, but I'll wait until I pics from doing this in my car.

 

[92TsiTalon]

geez...how'd you get those pictures to work. mine won't. here's the urls:

http://www.geocities.com/jcnevins85/pics/ignition2.jpg

and

http://www.geocities.com/jcnevins85/pics/ignition1.jpg

in respective order to the ones that didnt show up.....friggin...site....

 

[92TsiTalon]

okay, this really sucks. now the links dont even work.

try this:

http://www.geocities.com/jcnevins85/pics

then click on any one of the pics and they will come up

 

[Crazy29187]

Yeah, I really wasn't sure about my suggestion for the clutch switch, thanks for clarifying. But, I have a suggestion for your diagram. You suggest to "run this kind of wire (if the existing one is long enough use it) from the #2 pin on the female side of the C-59 intermediate harness to where the 2-BY splits for the A-10 intermediate harness." Basically, you're just bypassing the inhibitor switch. Now, I don't know where all the connectors are, and since they might be some distance away, I think it would be easier to just connect pins 8 & 9 on the inhibitor switch connector like the guy did on the VFAQ. That way the wires are already run and you don't need to worry about running more. I believe it would have the same effect too. Other than that, that explaination was great, you're the man!

Oh, and the part number for the clutch switch is MB605790, $12.36 from Conicelli. I can't find the relay, but I'd imagine it'd be expensive and you'd just want to pull it from the parts car, along with the clutch switch if you can.

 

[92TsiTalon]

hey, i got a simple website coming that will show you all the pictures and where the connectors are. they're all really easy to get to from what i can tell so it might be worth it to make it work like its supposed to.

the relay shouldnt be anymore that the clutch switch if its like a simple relay.

 

[92TsiTalon]

just to give an idea of where the connectors are before i can get the site up

1. The inhibitor switch is among two other harness/relay lookin things that under the intake pipe. They are mounted on a bracket that is connected to the side wall of the engine and sit above the front side of the transmission.

2. The A-10 connector is back by the starter.

3. The Starter Relay on a factory M/T is under the dash and part of a junction block, but the pic that will be on the website will give the exact location. The clutch switch on a factory M/T is also under the dash, and near the clutch (go figure).

4. The C-59 intermediate harness is behinde the glovebox. Again, the picture will be more explanatory when i get it going.

It does look like it would be helpful to have a bit of 3-BY wire laying around, but it might work with the factory wiring.

 

[92TsiTalon]

hey crazy29187, do have the diagram for the M/T on the back up light switch? i couldnt seem to find one in the manuals, but im probably just overlooking it.

 

[Crazy29187]

Originally posted by 92TsiTalon
hey crazy29187, do have the diagram for the M/T on the back up light switch? i couldnt seem to find one in the manuals, but im probably just overlooking it.

I don't have one on my computer, but there is one in my Haynes manual on page 12-20 if you got one. Its basically the same as the A/T, but the backup light switch is in there instead of the inhibitor switch, and also, the other two pins of the M/T A-10 connector are involved. If I get some time later I'll try to hack up the A/T diagram I have on my computer to make it look like the M/T.

 

[92TsiTalon]

alright, my site is now up. go check out my wiring diagrams and give me some feedback on this thread as to whether they look like they'll work or not.

http://www.geocities.com/jcnevins/index.html

 

[Crazy29187]

Damn, I hacked up the new diagram the other night but the site was down and wouldn't let me post and I forgot about it. Here's that backup circuit you asked for:

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[zac83]

wow, i forget to look at this thread and it grows crazy: i still cant get over that that shop had to remove the dash to swap the pedals in...

 

[92Laser-T]

yea I dont no either but its all good everything is great with it. I will post pics probably Tuesday of where the cables where located and the hydro system

 

[daltah]

Does anyone know a site that has a walk through for removing a auto tranny and installing a manual tranny on a n/a 2g eclipse.

 

[3clipseGst]

I wanna do a complete 4g63 swap in my 2nd gen eclipse...its an automatic so i wanna do a manual conversion 2..shouldnt it be easier when im doing the motor 2? and cheaper cuz im gettin tranny with motor for like 300 xtra? if anyone has done a motor with tranny swap im me i have lots of questions

 

[92TsiTalon]

i just got done with the swap and mine works great....definitely didnt have to pull the dash to swap the pedal assembly and on a 2g it should be even easier. just make sure you know of a parts car in a junk yard somewhere to go get parts from. unfortunately, i leave for boot camp in a few hours so i cannot continue to help...which sucks. the swap isnt as hard as it sounds....its just time consuming and you absolutely HAVE to make sure you have ALL the parts if you wanna get it done in a timely manner.

 

[Lordpaxin]

I am getting ready to do this.
i ordered the GVR4 JDM clip and i have all the pieces i need except the clutch hard line.

i have the engine, tranny and xcase, from the gvr4 and I am going to have the rear differnetial sent to me soon,
I have a q. since thhis forum claims the a/t axles no work, can i use the axles from the galant? its a 1991 awd turbo just like my car.