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big 16G V.S 14B

Venom55

Proven Member
142
0
May 3, 2003
QuebecCanada
I got a JDM 6 bolt with a Big 16G right now, nut the spooling time is taking forever to come, I start to boost at around 4000 and get full boost a 6k+. My question is: Is the B16G to big for an automatic and is taking to much time to spool.

I was considering buying a 14B with a 7cm housing, so the spool up time would be better qith the 14b.

Am I right or..

P.S: I dont have any boost leak, made the test and it leak free :thumb:
 

98TalonTSi

Proven Member
404
2
Aug 27, 2003
Readington, New_Jersey
I don't think the AT woud be that dramatic of difference in spool time. Check the wastegate arm and make sure it is closed completley and stays closed.
Mike
 

slow_talon

Proven Member
145
0
Jul 8, 2004
Brownsville, Texas
yup had the same problem with my 14b but i checked the arm and it was a little open i closed it and it made a huge difference like 600rpms :talon: :thumb:
 

Eclipsei95cl

Proven Member
980
4
Feb 26, 2003
Grand Rapids, Michigan
When i used to run the 16g i would get plenty of boost by a little below 3k.. Yeah it has nothing to do with ur tranny definitley something else.
 

Awoler

Proven Member
116
0
May 11, 2003
montgomery, Alabama
gees you guys need to get converters and quit bitchin'.i'm sorry if i sound like a ass! but you guys need to realize that with out m\t cams or aftermarket cams that these bigger turbos are going to spool slower! I'm simply atesting to a good high stall converter, i have a 60-1 that spools all most like a 13g did on my car even with the dinky a/t cams in it! if your are going to buy a bigger turbo put a good high stall converter on you wish/want list right after it! :thumb:
 

Tom N

Supporting Member
427
32
Sep 27, 2002
Sarasota, Florida
You could always put a 6cm housing on that 16g. It would spool faster. I dont know what all mods you have but if you add in some timing it will also help spool up.
 

Venom55

Proven Member
142
0
May 3, 2003
QuebecCanada
Mods I have are

JDM 6Bolts
Big 16G
510CC
2.5" turbo back
Dynomax super turbo muffler
UICP 2.5" piping
2.5" turbo intake pipe
A/F,EGT,Boost gauge
turbosmart MBC at 14 psi

Thats about it for now.

I'll look for my wastegate arm and see if its the problem
 

RuBiCaNT5X

Proven Member
1,248
0
Sep 21, 2002
Buffalo, New_York
Awoler said:
i have a 60-1 that spools all most like a 13g did on my car even with the dinky a/t cams in it!

I think that is quite an exaggeration. A 60-1 is a HUGE turbo. It's going to spool faster on less aggressive cams because of the increased air velocity due to less duration and lift.


A 16G is perfectly streetable on a stock TC.. Anything larger and you are asking for lag...
 

98TalonTSi

Proven Member
404
2
Aug 27, 2003
Readington, New_Jersey
Awoler said:
gees you guys need to get converters and quit bitchin'.i'm sorry if i sound like a ass!
Are you serious!! I never get on peoples' cases, but this bugs me man. If you don't know, don't post.
Your comments are way off topic and you do sound like an ass. :rolleyes:

Awoler said:
but you guys need to realize that with out m\t cams or aftermarket cams that these bigger turbos are going to spool slower!
First off, cams push the powerband "higher". It will help spool a larger turbo (btw, a B16g large?) but only once the rpms have even reached that particular turbo's threshold. so it won't say a 60-1 spools at 4000 rpms, cams (i.e. 272s) won't decrease spool, it will push it 2-400 rpms higher, but say once you hit 4000 it took till 4400 to get to 20 psi, now with cams you could go from say 4200 (new threshold) to 4600 and be at 25 psi+. Oh and I think that was a little internet exaggeration there as well. :shhh:

Awoler said:
I'm simply atesting to a good high stall converter, i have a 60-1 that spools all most like a 13g did on my car even with the dinky a/t cams in it! if your are going to buy a bigger turbo put a good high stall converter on you wish/want list right after it! :thumb:
I will agree there about the converter. TCs work off of peak torque, and an AT car needs to be modded with a slightly different thought process.
Oh and the reason you think a 60-1 spools similar to your 13g is BECAUSE of your AT cams. Put some larger cams in there and see what that does to you. Look at my mods, I hit 18 psi by 3200 rpms and begin to spool somewhere in the 24-2500 range.
I'm sorry if I sound a little strong, but read the thread before you post something unrelated. This guys turbo spooling at 4000 and hitting full at 6000 is absurd, not trans related. :)
Mike
 

98TalonTSi

Proven Member
404
2
Aug 27, 2003
Readington, New_Jersey
Venom55 said:
Mods I have are

JDM 6Bolts
Big 16G
510CC
2.5" turbo back
Dynomax super turbo muffler
UICP 2.5" piping
2.5" turbo intake pipe
A/F,EGT,Boost gauge
turbosmart MBC at 14 psi

Thats about it for now.

I'll look for my wastegate arm and see if its the problem
Let's get this BACK ON TOPIC!! :rolleyes:
I hope you have some type of fuel control with those mods, otherwise that could be a beginnig source of your problems. If you don't have any fuel control, through the stock injectors back in.
But, yeah, definitely check that wg arm to be seated properly, check for intake leaks, as well as exhaust leaks pre-turbine housing. I can almost guarantee you'll find something.
Mike
 

Venom55

Proven Member
142
0
May 3, 2003
QuebecCanada
I know for the fuel management, my S-AFC should be here this week hopefully. I knwo im running pig rich cuz at 100mph cruising my EGT only shows 1400 degree max, so this could be one problem.

Im going right now to check my wastegate to see if it seat properly.I'll give you detail later today.

thanks :thumb:
 

98TalonTSi

Proven Member
404
2
Aug 27, 2003
Readington, New_Jersey
Venom55 said:
I know for the fuel management, my S-AFC should be here this week hopefully. I knwo im running pig rich cuz at 100mph cruising my EGT only shows 1400 degree max, so this could be one problem.

Im going right now to check my wastegate to see if it seat properly.I'll give you detail later today.

thanks :thumb:
IMHO, don't rely soley on EGTs. I would seriously put the stock injectors back in, at least until the AFC gets in, as running too rich can hurt. If you're going to keep the injectors, then at least hack you're MAF (even if you haven't already). I know a hacked MAF 2G MAF, and 550 injectors will sort of even out at idle. At least it did for me when I was in between an AFC and DSMLink.
 

Venom55

Proven Member
142
0
May 3, 2003
QuebecCanada
98TalonTSi said:
IMHO, don't rely soley on EGTs. I would seriously put the stock injectors back in, at least until the AFC gets in, as running too rich can hurt. If you're going to keep the injectors, then at least hack you're MAF (even if you haven't already). I know a hacked MAF 2G MAF, and 550 injectors will sort of even out at idle. At least it did for me when I was in between an AFC and DSMLink.

Thanks for the info but like I said its a matter of days before i get me AFC. On the other hand I sorted out my problem , It was the wastegate not closing like its suppose to. I had to put 3 washer on each bolt the wastegate to the turbo to shorten the arm and now its boosting like a charm.

It start spooling at 2800 and get full boost (14psi) under 4500RPM. So im very happy that it was only that ;)
 

doug

Proven Member
3,122
16
Mar 9, 2002
SoFla
Glad to see you got your spool problem fixed, but I'm still wondering if it's totally solved. It shouldn't take to 4500 to get full boost, I wouldn't think. My B16G starts spooling around 2800 like yours, but has full boost (19 PSI) by like 3600 or so-- it spools quite fast. Maybe it's just the difference in compression ratio, and the lack of fuel control. Keep us updated after the S-AFC install.
 

Venom55

Proven Member
142
0
May 3, 2003
QuebecCanada
New Update , S-AFC is installed and it was my bad, it get full boost before 4000RPM wich is now normal. Also manage a [email protected] at 14psi. And I leaned the thing a bit with the SAFC now.
 

98TalonTSi

Proven Member
404
2
Aug 27, 2003
Readington, New_Jersey
I'm FWD as well, [email protected] with an exhaust and B16g, before all my other mods, so we'll see how I fair up now. I like the MAF-T, but it's a little tricky to tune with, especially with DSMlink.
Mike
 

Venom55

Proven Member
142
0
May 3, 2003
QuebecCanada
Umm tricky to tune, how come, Im planning on setting the maft to the 510CC for my injectors and tune the rest with my SAFC, is this a good idea or im completely lost??
 

98TalonTSi

Proven Member
404
2
Aug 27, 2003
Readington, New_Jersey
No you're right on target with tuning ideas, but remember......DSMLink compensates for injectors, so when I tune the MAF-T, I need to tune it in a fashion that I can emulate the stock MAF signal..and then fine tune with DSMLink.
Since you have an AFC, you can't compensate for injectors, unless you go with a keydriver. But yes, I would start to get 'base' tuning done with the MAF-T, then fine tune with the AFC.
Mike
 

vaboys2ndgen

Proven Member
1,126
0
Jan 5, 2005
Fredericksburg, Virginia
this is an old thread i know but didnt want to start another one.


im looking for some information on using a 14b turbo with my 96 AT gsx? thanks for the help everyone
 

vaboys2ndgen

Proven Member
1,126
0
Jan 5, 2005
Fredericksburg, Virginia
any pros and cons would be appreciated. .


since i want to get rid of my shaft playin t25 and i got a friend with a good 14b im curious. i'd like know the details on adding this.
 

Billios996

Proven Member
62
0
Jun 4, 2002
Union, New_Jersey
Baby step upgrade. You should be OK with the stock tuning and intercooler, but don't push it without the basic tuning upgrades.
You need a 16g style install kit. All the vendors have them, ~$200.
 

vaboys2ndgen

Proven Member
1,126
0
Jan 5, 2005
Fredericksburg, Virginia
Billios996 said:
Baby step upgrade. You should be OK with the stock tuning and intercooler, but don't push it without the basic tuning upgrades.
You need a 16g style install kit. All the vendors have them, ~$200.

yeah i know that much thanks. not to helpful though. im looking toward knowin if the 14b is going to hurt my DD with the spool lag. cause of the tw converter....


i have everything needed to install the 14b just not sure how good/bad it'll be on the car. w/out a tw converter
 
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