The Top DSM Community on the Web

For 1990-1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse, Eagle Talon, Plymouth Laser, and Galant VR-4 Owners. Log in to remove most ads.

Please Support JNZ Tuning
Please Support STM Tuned

2G Ostrich, including other aspects

This site may earn a commission from merchant
affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

XiKeiyaZI

15+ Year Contributor
6,967
55
Dec 28, 2008
Goldsboro, North_Carolina
Okay, as many people here know I like to gather as many points of information as I can while researching potential prospects of keeping a healthier, better running DSM under my belt.

Recently I've been weighing all options of tuning and have come to the conclusion that DSMlink is not for me, at least not with my GST. As I'm not looking to make 'epic' power, especially considering wheelhop/spin, I've settled with the fact that I need to shoot for something lower, between the 300-350 range and keep things dialed in nicely but still be able to have control over most aspects.

DSMlink is out of my price range for this effort, at the time, but will certainly be used on my AWD 1G in the future. Just to note, this is NOT to discuss the prices' of Link or any of it's competition, only to discuss the potential usefulness of other routes.

What my eyes have settled on, finally, is Ostrich. I've done a small bit of research and also had a helping hand in guidance, though I'll keep them un-named in the event that I sound like a complete moron. Can't drag anyone else down with me. From my understand, the process of installing, utilizing, and successfully expanding upon a combination of Ostrich and TunerPro in a 2G EPROM was not available....until now. So after finding that it is now possible, I want to confirm that it is, infact, possible with the 2G EPROM ECU.

To my understanding, the Ostrich Unit takes the place of the EPROM Chip. It has a Data ribbon that runs from the unit and fits into a 28 Pin socket that you put in place of the EPROM Chip. Until recently, I really didn't understand that the EPROM was basically a primitive Flash drive/storage drive. When I realized this, the Ostrich unit made much more sense. Back on track, from the Unit you can hook it up to either a Computer or a Laptop. Once this is done, you can create your own tune using TunerPro, upload it to the Unit, and this it basically becomes a modified EPROM replacement that your ECU will function off of, providing a successful tune modification for your vehicle.

Now that I've explained what I understand about the unit, what I want to ask are the following questions. And do feel free to call me out if I was wrong on anything, but please provide a link or something to the correct information so that I can soak it up.

1 : Has anyone successfully done this?
2 : Why is this method not as popular, considering it's simplicity and cost?
3 : What are the Pros?
4 : What are the Cons?

Thank you for your time in reading, and hopefully I can get some valid feedback. Also, I understand that DSMlink is a GREAT tool, however this is NOT what I'm looking for at the current. Any and all posts related to "stop b!tching and get LINK" or "Just get Link" or anything of that sort I will completely ignore. I don't want this to turn into a negative post, just something informational that others in my position can refer to.

Thank you.

::Related Links::

dsm-ecu : DSM-ECU

Ostrich 2.0 : The New Breed [OSTRICH_2] - $175.00 : Moates.Net

Any one still burning their own eprom chips? - DSM Forums: Mitsubishi Eclipse, Plymouth Laser, and Eagle Talon Forum: DSMtalk.com

Mods : If there are any possible infractions in what has been posted, please inform me so that I can modify it in lieu of simply closing/deleting the thread. Thank you.
 
The big drawback to a 2G Ostrich is that there isn't much open source/free support as there is for the 1Gs.

Another draw back is the logging on the 95-96 is very slow. The best option is using EvoScan and the MUTOverOBD2/Hybrid option, but sample rate is still limited to less then 10 samples per second.

I think I'm the only one who has made info for the 95s public.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-tuning-ecu/258831-2g-eprom-tuning.html#post151172573
http://ceddy.us/?page_id=19

If all you want to do is edit Injector Size and the Fuel and Timing maps the above links are a good start.



Flashing the 98/99 ecus is another low cost option, that has a lot more options like Launch Control, edit 50+ maps, etc. But the 98/99 ecus are not compatible with the 95-96 CAS, but are with the 1G or 97-99 CAS.
 
I've thought about swapping to a flashable ECU, however, I believe that makes the total projected outcome well over $300 for everything?

I currently have Evoscan on the way. What I'm looking to do is really just dial everything in. As I said above I'm not looking for phenomenal amounts of power or anything, just being able to set the injector sizes and help dial in the AFRs would be a GREAT thing to have available to alone.

I'm checking out the above posted links at this very moment as well, so I can't really sit here and comment on how helpful they are just yet. But thanks for posting them. I'm looking for each and every shred of information that I can.

Update : I read through them. Very informative.

Feel free to toss ideas my way. I know that the logging and such will be relatively slow, but I'm fine with that for now. The Ostrich setup seems pretty beneficial so far, though.

By the way. When looking for a VAG Cable, are any of them in the 409.1 category compatible? Such as this one?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/KKL-409-1-Interface-Cable-vag-com-VW-AUDI-OBD-II-2-W42-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem2a07f0f109QQitemZ180521857289QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

If so, I need to go ahead and order one so I can log. Lol.
 
I've a 95 GST, so most of them came with an EPROM. I've taken the ECU out and confirmed that it is, infact, eprom.
 
Alright so I'm going to update this thread.

I made a little side cash and decided to give Ostrich + Tunerpro a try and see how I like it. I've done a bit of reading, in general, about people using it with their 2Gs and so far I've read a lot more positive then negatives.

What my initial concerns are, are socketing it and starting. I know that I'll have to create a tune, stock of course, before I begin my soldering adventures... but I just want to obtain a small explanation. I've been reading over Ceddy's site today and I came across the stock 2G ECU images "EB23C.BIN EB23E.BIN and was just curious what the difference is between the C and the E. I've been reading through the DSM-ECU group as well and they have them simply separated as such. If the difference could simply be clarified for me that would help me tremendously.

Anyway, Ostrich will be in tomorrow and I have TunerPro installed and ready to go. Just wanna see what advice I can get before I get too anxious.

Thanks.
 
There is no important difference between the different 95 roms. Mitsu continually updates the rom, so there are a couple version for every year.


Use the version you have an .xdf for.

I mostly looked at the EB23C, old school TMO chips also used this.

DSMChips uses the EB23E, I believe.

And I think DSMLink was originally based on the EB23D.



Edit: If you never did it before, have some one socket it for you. My first attempt at socketing was a disaster, and I'm fairly good at soldering. "Steve" on this board has a very good reputation for ecu work.
 
I've never actually used an ostrich on a 2g, but I have been using it for 2 years on my 1g, and it has been a godsend. I have been pretty involved in modding the 1g code for extra features, just last week I went 11.85@121 with an ostrich and a speed density bin I have been working on. Its a very powerful tool.

The only true con to dsmlink is that the logging capabilities are limited. However a big plus is that an ostrich is not limited to just a 1g or 2g dsm. It can be used on many different platforms.

If you get to a point where your satisfied you could have someone with a burner burn your bin to a chip, and install that instead of the ostrich, and then have the ostrich free for your 1g!
 
There is no important difference between the different 95 roms. Mitsu continually updates the rom, so there are a couple version for every year.


Use the version you have an .xdf for.

I mostly looked at the EB23C, old school TMO chips also used this.

DSMChips uses the EB23E, I believe.

And I think DSMLink was originally based on the EB23D.



Edit: If you never did it before, have some one socket it for you. My first attempt at socketing was a disaster, and I'm fairly good at soldering. "Steve" on this board has a very good reputation for ecu work.

I found a stock one that loads up in TunerPro. I've been looking at all of the different options and I can already tell that this is going to be pretty fun. It's just going to take some research and tweaking to get this down to an understanding level.

As for socketing...I don't see where I can really go wrong. If anything, I'll just remove the Eprom, order a Burner and a few spare chips, and keep a backup around. It's just removing solder that I've always had the issue with because no one around my area carries those nifty vacuum pens, only the vacuum bulbs and those just barely work.

I've got to time this correctly, though, because I can't go about without a vehicle as this is my DD. =/ So when I do it I'll be sure to be extra safe and cautious. If I wasn't confident in my abilities, I would in NO way chance it.


I've never actually used an ostrich on a 2g, but I have been using it for 2 years on my 1g, and it has been a godsend. I have been pretty involved in modding the 1g code for extra features, just last week I went 11.85@121 with an ostrich and a speed density bin I have been working on. Its a very powerful tool.

The only true con to dsmlink is that the logging capabilities are limited. However a big plus is that an ostrich is not limited to just a 1g or 2g dsm. It can be used on many different platforms.

If you get to a point where your satisfied you could have someone with a burner burn your bin to a chip, and install that instead of the ostrich, and then have the ostrich free for your 1g!

It's great to hear that someone can give feedback with success on this setup. This is going into a car that is a level above stock, so there's not much I want to do besides level the fuel maps to not be quite as rich as they are. I want to use this to dial things in, for now. My next upgrades will be Evo Injectors and 272 Cams and then tune from there.

I completely forgot about the burning chips aspect up until you said that. I'll be ordering the stuff for that soon and making a stock chip for just in case something ever goes bad and I need it. Does anyone on this board still burn chips? I know the chips are pretty cheap.. I wonder if I could have someone burn me a stock one for safety precautions.
 
Two words: solder wick. :) I should buy stock in that stuff.

Solder Wick...-youtubes-

That's the Copper-Braided...wick isn't it?

I suppose I could check if anyone around here had that.
 
solder wick looks like a wick from a candle, you heat your solder point up, touch it with the wick, and it soaks up the solder. The vacume solder pens are good, but I prefer to use solder wick, and can be found at Radio Shack. It is a solder absorbing material, and the stuff I get comes in little rolls.
 
solder wick looks like a wick from a candle, you heat your solder point up, touch it with the wick, and it soaks up the solder. The vacume solder pens are good, but I prefer to use solder wick, and can be found at Radio Shack. It is a solder absorbing material, and the stuff I get comes in little rolls.

Yeah, I just looked it up.

Also called my local radio shack and they apparently have never heard of the stuff. -facepalm- Wonderful, living in Arkansas...
 
Yeah, I usually get it at the local Frys, but they aren't everywhere, and Radio Shack seems to only be good for the most common components. You might try Sparkfun, but if you're even moderately into electronics, your paycheck will end up significantly lighter after browsing their site. ;)
 
As for socketing...I don't see where I can really go wrong. If anything, I'll just remove the Eprom, order a Burner and a few spare chips, and keep a backup around. It's just removing solder that I've always had the issue with because no one around my area carries those nifty vacuum pens, only the vacuum bulbs and those just barely work.

If you don't have a temp controlled soldering iron, please don't try and do this yourself.

The 2G ECUs are very easy to damage because the traces and pads are pretty fine (small) when compared to the 1G ECUs. Too much heat will crack the traces or burn them off the board. You have to get all the solder out of the holes before you can remove the factory EPROM. If it doesn't come out easily don't force it, the eyelets will just rip out of the board. You should use a machine pin socket and not a cheap wiper type socket like you'll find at Radio Shack.

I've seen major damage to the 2G EPROMs caused by novices trying to desolder them. If your not a pro at it, do yourself a favor, and let ECMTuning do it. They are inexpensive, quick, and you can be sure it's done right.
 
If you don't have a temp controlled soldering iron, please don't try and do this yourself.

The 2G ECUs are very easy to damage because the traces and pads are pretty fine (small) when compared to the 1G ECUs. Too much heat will crack the traces or burn them off the board. You have to get all the solder out of the holes before you can remove the factory EPROM. If it doesn't come out easily don't force it, the eyelets will just rip out of the board. You should use a machine pin socket and not a cheap wiper type socket like you'll find at Radio Shack.

I've seen major damage to the 2G EPROMs caused by novices trying to desolder them. If your not a pro at it, do yourself a favor, and let ECMTuning do it. They are inexpensive, quick, and you can be sure it's done right.

I appreciate the input. Truly. As I said above I've done plenty of soldering in my time, just not particularly with an ECU as it's all been with computer hardware like replacing caps, resistors and other small components. As far as the socket goes, I'm using a socket that's coming with the Ostrich unit package, so it's nothing from a local radioshack or anything.

Of course I'm going to pull the ECU and eye it today, just making sure that it's something that I feel comfortable doing. If I get the slightest hint that I'm going to screw it up, I won't be doing it. The thing about sending it in to ECUtuning is that I'll never have the time to send it in, wait for them to socket it, and then wait for them to send it back. I've got to have a vehicle, daily.
 
The thing about sending it in to ECUtuning is that I'll never have the time to send it in, wait for them to socket it, and then wait for them to send it back. I've got to have a vehicle, daily.

Remember that if you mess it up you'll likely be down far longer than it will take to have it sent out. Needless to say I've done many of these in the past and my point is that it's really easy to damage the PCB even if you have the right tools.

Get a copy of the EPROM connection list so you can check the continuity of each pin in case you have a problem from the DSMLink wiki. buzzingout2gsocket [ECMTuning - wiki]
 
Remember that if you mess it up you'll likely be down far longer than it will take to have it sent out. Needless to say I've done many of these in the past and my point is that it's really easy to damage the PCB even if you have the right tools.

Get a copy of the EPROM connection list so you can check the continuity of each pin in case you have a problem from the DSMLink wiki. buzzingout2gsocket [ECMTuning - wiki]

I hear ya'. You'd be the last person I'd doubt when it comes to this. Thing is I know where I can get an ECU for little to nothing nearby. So it's like.. if I mess this up, I have a backup. If I send it off, I'm down for weeks.

I'm still waiting for the package to come in before I even really take the ECU back out to look it over. I'm pretty sure I can do it without any faults. I found the tools I need to get it done so that's a plus.

I'll also check this link out and retain the helpful data. Thanks!
 
I had a few motherboards laying around and I found 1 with a couple of chips and a socketed chip that were the same size and everything. I experimented a few different ways of removing the chips. I attempted using a vacuum bulb which wasn't really all too great. I then tried using an air compressor and a fine tipped spray to blow the solder out when it was heated up. This worked great. It was quick, clean, and it only splattered on my hand...ouch.

Anyway.. I was able to remove the chips without any damage, put them back in, solder them, and the MB still works. Needless to say that's a good thing... but I'm still a bit iffy. I'm going to call a few local IT departments and see if anyone can do a socketing job.
 
Desoldering braid is what it is called at Radio Shack. Soldering irons with a vacuum bulb can only do so much, and so can the wick. Once either devices fails to hit a good amount of solder to keep the ENTIRE joint heated up and molten they both fail. It's so easy to mess up a socketing job because when they build a PCB they don't take into account that someone might ever want to remove a through-hole component. The best way would be to get a die that heats up all 28 holes and pull the chip at once, and then you have holes with no pins in them to clean out the solder easily. I would have gone megasquirt.
 
The best way would be to get a die that heats up all 28 holes and pull the chip at once.

Thats what are micro-bench does. Trying to do one at a time sucks, and very difficult to do properly.

There is a big difference between a motherboard, and our ECU boards. If I am not mistaken a motherboard for computers are thicker, their tracers are harder to mess up, so soldering chips/diodes/resistors, is a lot easier than on our ECU's. I think our first try on the bench with the ECU it heated up, but not enough and when we went to pull the chip it pulled the traces off the board, and thats it, no more worky worky.
The worst part about the ECU bit is you might not realize you messed something up, install it int he car and it appears everything is working, but then you run into phantom gripes hours/days/weeks later.... Then your really down, and your scratching your head like why do my turn signals come on when I go WOT, or something stupid and crazy like that.

If you can pick up another ECU for cheap, run that one, ship yours out, then your not down....:aha:
 
By cheap I mean $100. -_- And I'm not really all to content with the idea of paying $100 just to ship mine off and pay $30 + another week or two of waiting. My entire point in going this route was to bypass the $400 cost of ECMlink with a lot of the same results. Now that I see that Socketing, itself, is a damned issue.. that brings me to realize that not only would you have to order ECMlink, you'd have to send them your ECU, and wait another 2 forevers to even BEGIN. -facepalm- Ridiculous.

Maybe I'll just scope it out, see what I can do, and if anything else I'll just send it the hell back and get my money back and spend it on bills or something. Kind of discouraging.

And about the 'die' to heat up all 28 pins at once... I wonder if I could get creative and create something where I could heat it up with the iron, melt the solder, and pull the chip. I'll see what I have laying around here.

Update : Package just arrived. I'm now able to interface the Ostrich Device with Tuner Pro. I've uploaded the Stock BIN file for a 2G. EB23C and EB23C_v1.xdf are both uploaded into tuner-pro. I uploaded, and then verifed what I have in Tuner pro against the moates device and Viola.. done.

Now To get this damned thing socketed.
 
Okay, I'm not doing it.

I pulled the ECU out, looked at it.... and EVERY possibility of it going wrong played through my head...

Turns out, though, that an IT tech at my job does this kind of sh!t on a regular basis and said he'd call me tomorrow to see about setting up a time when he can do it. He's the type of guy who recovers data from burnt up HDDs and is currently, in all truth, building a laser for fun. So I'm sure he can do this. Funny thing is he's Middle-Eastern. ;P

Anyway.. I'll update accordingly. I'm sort of depressed I can't use Ostrich just yet.
 
So I took a weekend trip to Tennessee and was able to pick up a desoldering iron. With some time, patience, and a whole lot of cursing under my breath I was able to safely remove the eprom chip, put my socket in place, put the eprom chip back into that, and VIOLA.. car runs. So I hooked up my Ostrich unit, uploaded the stock 2G code and again, awesome.. car starts.

What I'm looking at now is getting to learn how to use Ostrich hands on. I know you can use it for logging? I'd like to figure out how to do that. Also, if anyone has any information regarding handling the ostrich and tuning with Tuner Pro I'd appreciate any and all input. Thank you!
 
Support Vendors who Support the DSM Community
Boosted Fabrication ECM Tuning ExtremePSI Fuel Injector Clinic Innovation Products Jacks Transmissions JNZ Tuning Kiggly Racing Morrison Fabrications MyMitsubishiStore.com RixRacing RockAuto RTM Racing STM Tuned

Latest posts

Build Thread Updates

Vendor Updates

Latest Classifieds

Back
Top