Resolved 2G 1995 R12 or R134a refrigerant from factory?

[1greyawdtsi]

I’ve read through a lot of threads and didn’t see a similar situation. Backstory: I have a 95 Talon Tsi AWD it was originally a Vancouver/Canadian car. I purchased it in Oregon and it lived in Seattle since 2017 (no real need for AC). This year I moved to Charleston SC and would like to get the AC working before summer & I’m diagnosing the non-operational problem now. I‘ve read that the 95 and up cars are R134a equipped.
However my car’s under hood stickers have faded & the system has the old R12 (not R134a) fittings. Does anyone have any experience with this situation? Is it possible some of the 1995s used old style R12 fittings but also used R134a refrigerant? I appreciate any thoughts or input, thank you.

 

[IHeartMyHonda]

95 was a transition year for a lot of manufacturers. If your car was made in 94, there is a solid chance it has R12 in it. If it has R12 fittings, you can pretty much bet it has R12. Go ahead and convert it and you won't have to worry about it again

 

[1greyawdtsi]

95 was a transition year for a lot of manufacturers. If your car was made in 94, there is a solid chance it has R12 in it. If it has R12 fittings, you can pretty much bet it has R12. Go ahead and convert it and you won't have to worry about it again

Interesting, thank you.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

FLUSH that old R12 and PAG oil out before you convert it to R134a. The oil isn't the correct oil to use with 134 refrigerant. I have flushed my other cars systems with some type of A/C flush. I am pretty sure it was this:

https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/c/certified-a-c-pro/interdynamics-certified-a-c-pro-a-c-system-flush/int5/ca1/v/a/2175/automotive-car-1990-eagle-talon?q=ac+flush&pos=0

It smelled like orange peel and got all of the old oil/R12 out. I did use new lines and condensor so I wasn't worried about those but I was worried about the evaporator and when I got finished with the job, the ac was ICE COLD!
Just blow out the system with DRY compressed air and seal it up in prep for the new refrigerant. A tip that always worked good for me.

 

[steve]

I think it's very likely all 2g's used R134a. They call it out in the 2G Tech Manual. R134a was in use earlier in other models.

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[steve]

I know my 91 Eclipse is R12. I was pretty sure my 92 Stealth was R134a and the US EPA backs that up.

"Automobile manufacturers began to transition to the non-ozone depleting refrigerant, HFC-134a, with 1992 model year vehicles. By the 1995 model year, all new vehicles sold in the United States with air conditioners used HFC-134a refrigerant."

Refrigerant Transition & Environmental Impacts | US EPA

Explains the environmental impacts of past, present, and future motor vehicle air-conditioning system refrigerants.

www.epa.gov

 

[MacMarty15221]

FLUSH that old R12 and PAG oil out before you convert it to R134a. The oil isn't the correct oil to use with 134 refrigerant. I have flushed my other cars systems with some type of A/C flush. I am pretty sure it was this:

https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/c/certified-a-c-pro/interdynamics-certified-a-c-pro-a-c-system-flush/int5/ca1/v/a/2175/automotive-car-1990-eagle-talon?q=ac+flush&pos=0

It smelled like orange peel and got all of the old oil/R12 out. I did use new lines and condensor so I wasn't worried about those but I was worried about the evaporator and when I got finished with the job, the ac was ICE COLD!
Just blow out the system with DRY compressed air and seal it up in prep for the new refrigerant. A tip that always worked good for me.

I have a 1G Laser and am interested in doing this conversion. If I am reading this correctly, the only mechanical mods needed are for the connectors? O-rings, piping, compressor etc are OK to use if the proper purging of old oil and gas are taken care of?

 

[1greyawdtsi]

FLUSH that old R12 and PAG oil out before you convert it to R134a. The oil isn't the correct oil to use with 134 refrigerant. I have flushed my other cars systems with some type of A/C flush. I am pretty sure it was this:

https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/c/certified-a-c-pro/interdynamics-certified-a-c-pro-a-c-system-flush/int5/ca1/v/a/2175/automotive-car-1990-eagle-talon?q=ac+flush&pos=0

It smelled like orange peel and got all of the old oil/R12 out. I did use new lines and condensor so I wasn't worried about those but I was worried about the evaporator and when I got finished with the job, the ac was ICE COLD!

Appreciate that, thanks!

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Nope. Replace every line and oring and make sure you flush your condenser if you are re-using it, not replacing it. That and the hoses hold quite a bit of refrigerant/oil.
Flush the complete system if not replacing easy 30 year old components if you want it to work like new.

 

[Druid74]

Canada had different regulations and didn’t start changing over until around 94 or 95. If you have R12 fittings, then you definitely have R12 gas. If someone converted it to R134a and didn’t change out the fittings, who is to say what else they didn’t do for the conversion. As a certified Freon tech, I would definitely change out all the hoses, orings, and flush the evaporator and condenser. The pump would be fine to use, but I would recommend changing it as well.

After changing everything, pull a vacuum on the system to verify you have no hodden leaks in those 30 year old evaporator and condenser coils. Then fill the system with nitrogen to dry everything out. Once that is done, you can pull a vacuum on the system again and be confident to go ahead and put your freon in.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Good info, thank you @Druid74 !!!
I do my own work, so I can't talk much about this subject (laws, you know), but the instructions you gave are almost identical to what I do with my own stuff.

 

[Dericsh]

Canada had different regulations and didn’t start changing over until around 94 or 95. If you have R12 fittings, then you definitely have R12 gas. If someone converted it to R134a and didn’t change out the fittings, who is to say what else they didn’t do for the conversion. As a certified Freon tech, I would definitely change out all the hoses, orings, and flush the evaporator and condenser. The pump would be fine to use, but I would recommend changing it as well.

After changing everything, pull a vacuum on the system to verify you have no hodden leaks in those 30 year old evaporator and condenser coils. Then fill the system with nitrogen to dry everything out. Once that is done, you can pull a vacuum on the system again and be confident to go ahead and put your freon in.

Where does someone get test nitrogen from?

 

[1greyawdtsi]

I think it's very likely all 2g's used R134a. They call it out in the 2G Tech Manual. R134a was in use earlier in other models.

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Resolved. Turns out with A/C Low port buried down & near the firewall driver side (which is/was hard to see). And while my car was assembled in ‘94 for the 95 model year, turns out it does in fact have R134a and associated fittings. I just wasn’t getting the AC fill line fitting squared up properly. So with a little more effort and patience it clipped right on.
Now to see if a simple charge with some dye brings the AC back to life. Thank you again for the assistance!

 

[pauleyman]

For what it's worth r12 fittings I've seen don't take clip on fittings. They have external threads. It's easy to spot.

 

[steve]

Where does someone get test nitrogen from?

Usually from the same industrial gas suppliers that you get Oxygen, Argon, Helium, CO2 and other welding gases from. Be careful with it, in high concentrations it can lead to death, so don't go huffing it.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Make sure to pull a vacuum on the system, take a picture of the gauge, let it sit for 15-30 mins and compare to make sure it isn''t leaking so you don't waste refrigerant.

 

[Druid74]

Yeah, nitrogen can be purchased at any welding supply center or if you have a medical gas supply center, they usually carry it as well because it is used in a lot of medical equipment.