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2g 18psi only 198 whp? Why?

Chris_Sag

Proven Member
102
0
Sep 8, 2010
Bergen, Florida
Hi.
First off all, Im from Norway so sorry for bad english. I try asking here since the knowage about Dsm and Eclipse in Norway is very poor.

I have a 98 Eclipse Gst with a brand new 4g63t engine, driven 1500miles.
The engine is as good as stock but the fuel and boost is cranked up to 18psi.
But in the dyno all i was pulling were 198hp? I have seen movies and heard from other people that i should manage a lot more. I am looking for around 300HP, my turbo is stock T25. The compression was around 10 on all 4cyl.

Can somebody explain me what could be wrong?
 

ramsack

Banned Member
3,286
19
Dec 27, 2007
West Lawn, Pennsylvania
Sounds about right. The t-25 is small. What do you mean by 10 for compression?
 

dawid4444

Proven Member
234
2
Feb 16, 2009
Chicago, Illinois
t25 turbo is too smal for 18psi

anything over 15psi on t25 turbo is not good cause the t25 turbo will blow very hot air anything over 15psi

do u have some aftermarket intercooler ??

how big injector do u have and what u use for tuning ??

and what do you mean about that compresion # ??
good stock engine should has 180psi each cylinder bro
 

Chris_Sag

Proven Member
102
0
Sep 8, 2010
Bergen, Florida
Sorry around 10bar each cyl i ment. The intercooler is stock. Im not sure about the injectors it all was there when i bought the car. All i see is a manually fuel pressure controller and a bleed valve for the boost.
 

Focus boy

Probationary Member
6
0
Apr 19, 2010
Ponca, Nebraska
Yea I would also guess that your out of your compressors effiecincy map. Hotter air means less power. T25 shouldn't go over 15 psi. Your compression sounds like it is also too low 145 psi per cyl is low should be around 185 for your 1500 mile engine.
 

LiquidX

DSM Wiseman
8,291
111
Sep 19, 2008
Anywhere, Pennsylvania
Turn the boost back down to 14 or 15 psi as per what everyone else said, you are out of the efficency range of the T-25 and are only blowing hot air. You will also shorten the life of the T-25 running it that hard.

210hp is at the crank for ratings, not at the wheel. Can you upload any pictures of the fuel system and what are you using to tune the fuel?
 

Chris_Sag

Proven Member
102
0
Sep 8, 2010
Bergen, Florida
Thank you for good answers. I have read about compressor maps and stuff. I tought 18 psi was 18 psi so when i watch videos on you tube from dynopulls with 18psi and 360hp i tought something were wrong.

Would a new intercooler be a good investment?
A bigger turbo sounds a bit scary to me on the stock internal parts?
But when they upper the boost even more around 21psi whitch was the most we could squeeze out the power increased even more, but those boostlevels sound way to high to that poor turbo and engine.

So more psi is not the same as more power?

The compression in my engine is proberly lowered when rebuid, but no parts is stronger than the orginal when this was just a cheap rebuild payed by the insurance company. Rebuild kit camed from rockauto.com
 

AK Maniak

Proven Member
2,074
17
Jul 9, 2009
Butte, Montana
Well for starters your engine can easily handle 300hp on stock internals and as far as a new intercooler goes it would be pointless unless you went with a bigger turbo. A front mount would only make your t 25 spool later, you could do hard piping on your SMIC if you don't plan on going with a bigger turbo.
PSI doesn't directly translate into hp btw
 

97-gst

Proven Member
1,234
1
May 16, 2010
Radford, Virginia
Thank you for good answers. I have read about compressor maps and stuff. I tought 18 psi was 18 psi so when i watch videos on you tube from dynopulls with 18psi and 360hp i tought something were wrong.

Would a new intercooler be a good investment?
A bigger turbo sounds a bit scary to me on the stock internal parts?
But when they upper the boost even more around 21psi whitch was the most we could squeeze out the power increased even more, but those boostlevels sound way to high to that poor turbo and engine.

So more psi is not the same as more power?

The compression in my engine is proberly lowered when rebuid, but no parts is stronger than the orginal when this was just a cheap rebuild payed by the insurance company. Rebuild kit camed from rockauto.com

Get a fmic only if you plan on upgrading your turbo. if your wanting 300+ horsepower then get atleast a 14b or a 16g, injectors, fpr and fuel pump and you'l' see alot higher horsepower. You'll feel it too. T25 is an ok turbo but it doesnt do a thing past 15 psi.
 

Chris_Sag

Proven Member
102
0
Sep 8, 2010
Bergen, Florida
What is the smartest thing to buy? Turbo or intercooler? If i go for a bigger turbo I also have to invest in new injectors ect, I am looking for a small and cheap tuning.
With a front mounted intercooler how much more boost or power can i do with the t25? Remember its cold i Norway:p

What its done to my fuel system in the past is unknown to me, but on the dyno with a wideband lamda hooked to the computer it went way to rich in all speed areas. So we mounted a manually fuelboost regulator and turned the fuel pressure down.

And how do you explain that the power increased at higher psi than 18psi when all the turbo should do is blowing hot air?
I now have a peak boost at 20psi but only for a split second, is this dangerous?

My engine as it looks today, fuel pressure unit up to the right.

Also is it normal that the oilpressure is dropping to 0,4kg when idling when the engine is hot? Running on 5-40w oil. Scares me a bit..
 

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97-gst

Proven Member
1,234
1
May 16, 2010
Radford, Virginia
What is the smartest thing to buy? Turbo or intercooler? If i go for a bigger turbo I also have to invest in new injectors ect, I am looking for a small and cheap tuning.
With a front mounted intercooler how much more boost or power can i do with the t25? Remember its cold i Norway:p

What its done to my fuel system in the past is unknown to me, but on the dyno with a wideband lamda hooked to the computer it went way to rich in all speed areas. So we mounted a manually fuelboost regulator and turned the fuel pressure down.

And how do you explain that the power increased at higher psi than 18psi when all the turbo should do is blowing hot air?
I now have a peak boost at 20psi but only for a split second, is this dangerous?

My engine as it looks today, fuel pressure unit up to the right.

Also is it normal that the oilpressure is dropping to 0,4kg when idling when the engine is hot? Running on 5-40w oil. Scares me a bit..


Get atleast a 14b, do NOT get a fmic for your t25 with the intention of gaining horsepower. Because i know for a fact itll slow your car down. Just save up for a turbo and a fmic
 

Chris_Sag

Proven Member
102
0
Sep 8, 2010
Bergen, Florida
What does 14b and 16g stands for? "newbie" Can i change turbo without changing injectors ect? Bolt on, then run at the same boostlevel 18psi, and get more power? But until i buy a new turbine is it safe to run as i do now with the T25?
Have looked on some cheap china turbos at Ebay, are they not to recommend?
Think that changing turbo sounds like a big procedure to make it run properly.
 

Bluefire16

15+ Year Contributor
1,490
9
Mar 30, 2007
Grand Rapids, Michigan
Bloody hell, have you even looked at the website here?

First--- Look at the top left tab on this website. See the link for Tech? Click it. Then select upgrade paths. Click that. Now you will want to click the link that say "BASIC H/P Upgrades". Once you have done this, READ.

Now second, You see a couple tabs over on the top of the page where it says "Search"? This will become your NEW BEST FRIEND. Use that for any more questions you have.

Last- Find out what was done to the car, if you have no experience on working on cars, find someone to help you. Also.....China turbos on ebay are shit. You want MHI turbos. Those are real Mitsubishi turbos, do not buy ebay turbos.

And changing a turbo is nothing, i do one myself in a couple hours. Its not hard if you no how a bolt screws in and how to clamp some hose to pipes.

Oh and 14b is a turbo and so is 16g. It is the name of the turbo referring to size.....these are the most common upgraded turbo for our cars.
 
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Chris_Sag

Proven Member
102
0
Sep 8, 2010
Bergen, Florida
Thank you for helping, i will use the serch function here after. I just find it easy to ask all my question about my car since every car in here seems diffrent.
I dont have so much experience with turbo cars, and workshop and mechanics costs a lot of money, im just a student at the moment.
To change the turbo seems easy but to make it run properly (air fuel, ect) is for the people at the dyno. In norway it costs around 300dollar each hour at the dyno.
 

FLASH1970

Proven Member
1,267
9
Aug 22, 2005
Lake Geneva, Wisconsin
The turbo and intercooler are some of the last things you should upgrade. Get an exhaust, intake, datalogger, boost gauge, and manual boost controller. Learn how to datalog and watch your counts of knock and your Injector Duty Cycles. Slowly turn up the boost and datalog. Once the IDC gets above 80-85%, get bigger injectors and a 190 walbro pump or a 255 walbro pump. With a 255 pump, you'll also need an Adjustable Fuel Pressure Regulator. Then you'll need a wideband oxygen sensor and an SAFC (fuel controller) for tuning. Or get a tactrix cable and ECUflash with EVOScan & Ceddymods (search for "ceddymods") if you have the black plastic cased ECU. Seeing that you have a 98, you might have that ECU. EVOScan would be used for datalogging through your laptop and the ECUflash & Ceddymods for flashing the ECU. Get familiar with all these things and then upgrade your turbo and intercooler.

Just slapping a bigger turbo on and turning up the boost will result in a broken car. Bluefire16 also had some good suggestions. Read, read, read... and when you're sick of reading, read some more.
 

Bluefire16

15+ Year Contributor
1,490
9
Mar 30, 2007
Grand Rapids, Michigan
^^ I typed it out liquid instead of giving him the link. Like, actually TYPED it out. Click. Arrow down. Click.....rofl
 

Karnag3_0kc

Proven Member
59
0
Apr 26, 2009
wildomar, California
Depending on your pocket's I'd grab a 16g and never look bacl. They are awesome for 400bhp.
 

98blackeclipse

Proven Member
98
1
Jul 6, 2010
Broken Arrow, Oklahoma
Hey if your looking to get 300bhp you might get away with a 14b, but a evo3 16g would be a lot better. As for fuel pump and injectors, some 550's would be good for your goals. For a fuel pump i would get a wally 190. As for your stock smic it should be ok if your not going to go over that 300bhp goal. This site has so much information for you to use. What ever you go with good luck
 

Chris_Sag

Proven Member
102
0
Sep 8, 2010
Bergen, Florida
Do i need a extern wastegate or something when swapping to a 16g? I think i buy one, bolts on and run with minimum of boost..
 
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