2G 1999 GST Eclipse - Clutch likely failing. What to replace/upgrade?

[ipWitan]

TLDR - 99 GST Eclipse with 87k. Completely stock. Replacing clutch - what should I replace it with? Aftermarket brands, names, models, specifics? Are there other things that should be checked/replaced while he is there? I am no mechanic and need to fake it until I learn. I need help with my conversation with the mechanic to make sure things are replace/upgraded correctly. If I can replace with better parts for a little more money, then I will do it. I am still auditioning the mechanic as I don't have a lot of experience here. They will need to order something - anything to help with that dialog is appreciated.

The short story is that this was my daily driver before I moved up north 10 years ago. I gave it to my parents where it was garage kept in FLA, and they added only 3k over 10 years. I just took it back since they didn't drive it and can't get in and out. Last summer I added about 500 miles, tops. It was checked out last summer - fluids, new plugs, and they said everything looks good. My dad said he replaced the clutch about 7 years ago, but have likely added less than 1500 miles since. But maybe it wasn't done correctly, or the records are inaccurate, or something else is failing.

I think the clutch is failing as the petal has been sticking...essentially doesn't come up right away when I release it, but comes up with a very brief delay. Yesterday, while in first, the car seemed to rev but not really move forward (up a slight hill). Bad sign. It drives, I think, and I should be able to drive it to the shop. Yes, I smell stuff, but that car always has a slight clutch smell. I have been teaching my daughter to drive a stick, and it isn't going well. Smells were horrible. Probably burned out clutch from repeated attempts to start in 3rd. Sounds and smells just awful. In my defense, she has trouble with the Honda Pilot (auto) too. Adding in shift isn't helping. I have stopped the lessons.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

 

[97egl]

This sounds more like a sticking slave cylinder or master cylinder. Could also be a sticking throw out bearing or the pressure plate. Whatever it is it is not the clutch friction disk itself being too worn. That wouldn't cause the clutch to come up slowly.

Slave/master cylinders should be a lot less labor than the clutch replacement would be so you may be in luck

 

[ipWitan]

Thanks for the heads up.

 

[Mello]

I would agree that this sounds more like a hydraulic issue rather than the physical clutch parts. Is the clutch fluid still clean or is it black & dirty? If it's turned all black the rubber cups are deteriorating & getting ready to fail completely.

 

[ipWitan]

I checked the cap last night (driver side back, confirmed by videos on bleeding system). It had fluid but it was dark. But it would make sense if my dad replaced the clutch but not the master slave pumps. Hopefully that is it as those are much cheaper to replace than the clutch.

 

[ipWitan]

Mechanic says that the sticking is caused by a bad clutch and the master/slave cylinders are not the issue. He is set to replace the entire clutch assemble and the fork. He said he was going to replace something else, either the rod or fork as it was $95. Total for parts and labor is $1800.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Boy, the mechanic is PROUD of his work. Thats a lot of money.

 

[ipWitan]

I don't mind supporting our local businesses, but yes, that is a lot of money for a car worth only a little more than that.

 

[SixBolt_16G]

$1800??? Hope thats not for a stock clutch. Maybe Im out of the loop in '23 but that seems really high

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

I can say that SouthBend makes a nice clutch that is stronger than a stock unit yet retains a pretty close to stock pedal feel. @twicks69 sold me mine and it was a nice unit until I started to make TOO much power for it.

 

[SixBolt_16G]

I can say that SouthBend makes a nice clutch that is stronger than a stock unit yet retains a pretty close to stock pedal feel. @twicks69 sold me mine and it was a nice unit until I started to make TOO much power for it.

South Bend is great... Im on my second Spec stage 2.. Also retains the stock pedal feel. Really made a difference when I was use to sit in rush hour traffic for 2 hours.

 

[ipWitan]

I can stop by there in 30 minutes and get more information.
q1 - what again is being replace? Clutch assembly, flywheel, fork, ball - is there something else I missed?
q2 - are these eom or which brand if aftermarket?
q3 - ?

 

[SixBolt_16G]

I can stop by there in 30 minutes and get more information.
q1 - what again is being replace? Clutch assembly, flywheel, fork, ball - is there something else I missed?
q2 - are these eom or which brand if aftermarket?
q3 - ?

South Bend, Spec, Competition, Exedy, ACT are all examples of aftermarket clutches. Depending on the power goals that you have for the car would determine which one of the pressure plates/materials you would choose under one of these companies(some companies refer to this as stages, some refer to it in series, some have specific names or other designation for the differences.). If youre planning on increasing the power, then youll want a pressure plate designed to hold power in that range. If you want to keep the pedal feel close to stock for daily driving then a clutch that has a lighter pedal pressure might be for you, but soft pedal pressure doesnt mean that its not capable of holding more power. i think my stage 2 has a torque capacity up to 400. Since i dont launch, dont make a ton of power, or have the ambitions to do so in the near future, it was a good clutch at the price at the time. Someone who has a specific goal like drag or road racing might need something hard because they are going to be beating the shit out of it, frequently.

Some of the clutches such as South bend and Spec have a clutch pedal feel that is closer to stock. The ACT 2600s that i had in the past were a bit of a workout when i daily drove. THe pedal takes more of a direct application of pressure to it to push it down and feels like its spring loaded to kick your foot off of it when you disengage. You get use to it, but 2 hours of that wasnt great sitting in traffic so I opted for a clutch that was more manageable for daily driver. Left leg was jello by the time i got home. The older I got the more i just wanted to get away from it.

Theres nothing wrong with going with an oem clutch if youre planning on staying stock or close to it. Im not a mechanic so I dont know for sure, but I just found that price to be super high compared to what i paid a speedshop to do my clutch a few years ago.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

No matter what, if the flywheel is getting replaced, the "step height" must be verified to be in spec at .612". I am pulling that from my old head so double check that measurement and it has to be correct or you will have constant clutch issues. Just one of those "must do's" that should be brought up.
@SixBolt_16G , you would not like my QM Twin

 

[dwb]

It also might be possible you have the master cylinder rod extended too far preventing the bleeder valve from opening when the clutch is released. That causes constant pressure on the clutch/hydraulics and leads to it slipping like you described. This is an old video but explains it pretty well:

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[SixBolt_16G]

@SixBolt_16G , you would not like my QM Twin

I drove some heavily modified Porsche at one of the Manheim auctions when no one was there on a Saturday. If the dash wouldnt have been there to stop my foot, i have no doubt that i wouldve kicked myself in the face with how hard that pedal kicked me off. So, no thanks Marty .

 

[ipWitan]

The mechanic here said that the clutch isn't OEM, since those don't exist. I thought he said AOI, but it could have been ACT. After 10 years I still don't fully understand a strong Boston accent. We did discuss the balancing of performance v comfort in traffic of a clutch. This isn't a racing car, so OEM feel is fine.

As to costs, this also includes an oil change, the flywheel, resurfacing, basically all clutch parts, and the ball something. He will also change the slave as that is attached and is easy to do and could be worn out. Fluids will be changed too. I asked him to look over the car for the equivalent of the 75k service.

He also said that the timing belt looks fine and change it at 90k, but to ease my concerns it should be fine for 110k...when you can be nervous. The belt doesn't look cracked or show signs of obvious where. White lettering on the back still looks fine. I don't know if my father did this or not.

It is hard for me to know whether this is alot for the result or not. Prices for all labor is very high in Massachusetts. I am pleased that I actually found someone who will do the work - as that is not a given either!