2G 1996 Cam angle sensor?

[chowda633]

I have done some searching on this and haven't come up with what im looking for.

I just got done redoing all my valves with SS 1mm oversized due to jumping time and I got it all back together on my 96 GS-T and when I went to install it I noticed that the sensor was broken in half but the pins were intact still so I bent it back strait and put it in.

Now when I started up the car it ran extremely rough and only for a few revolutions before dying. It would run for a few secs and shut off then give me a code for the sensor. I would then clear it out via DSM Link and the car would start and no code. Is the sensor still bad?

Also while it was idling hard like this I put it into gear and reved it to over 3 grand and tryed to move it slowly and it shuddered hard and stopped. I tryed again and the same thing it moved a few feet lost power and stopped. Something to do with putting a load on the motor.

And is it called the cam angle sensor? Its the one behind the intake cam.

And also would it cause the car to run extremely rough?

Thanks,
Josh

 

[ECLIPSE4x4]

Are you sure you put it in correctly and not 180 out?

 

[chowda633]

I didn't know it can go in the other way. Are we talking about the same thing? Its on a 96 and its behind the intake cam gear. Looked like there was some type of eye there. And its held on by to bolts.

Thanks,
Josh

 

[ECLIPSE4x4]

post pics

 

[9!'clipseDOHC]

Yes it is called a camshaft angle sensor. It is also called a camshaft position sensor. It senses both the position of the camshafts and the crankshaft. By loosening the bolts and twisting it you advance or retard your timing.

 

[chowda633]

Ok I just got off the phone with auto zone and they carry it. Its the cam position sensor. Not the Cam angle sensor. The 95-96 cars don't have them. I belive it only applys to 95-96 there is to many dam sensors with the same or simillar name . Someone needs to write an article on these. I think what DOHC is talking about is on the left side? this is on the right side under the intake cam. Its a small black square sensor.

And 4x4 the camera is down.

 

[ddavisaf]

Call it oatmeal if you want. As long as you remember that it monitors camshaft position.
It's known as CPS and CAS.
http://members.shaw.ca/dsm.1000q/Engineprimer/2G/cas.htm
Link posted just as an FYI. The position of the sensor does not apply to 95 & 96 DSM's.

 

[ECLIPSE4x4]

By loosening the bolts and twisting it you advance or retard your timing.

Wrong, not with a 2G CAS.

Chowda, have you even checked it before you go buying one? it could either be loose inside or 180 out.

 

[chowda633]

There is no way to acess it with out pulling the valve cover and the intake cam gear off. When I went to autozone and ordered it they called it a crank position sensor.

 

[ADrewzki]

Wrong, not with a 2G CAS.

Chowda, have you even checked it before you go buying one? it could either be loose inside or 180 out.

It's not really possible for it to be 180 out unless your entire intake cam is 180 out. I'm assuming it was timed correctly so it should be ok.

 

[1gnasty]

coud be still 180 off it will go 2 ways

 

[ADrewzki]

coud be still 180 off it will go 2 ways

How? Explain.

 

[ECLIPSE4x4]

a CAS and CPS are two different things. I forget at times that 95/96 have the CPS.

Here is a camshaft position sensor.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

 

[chowda633]

Yes thats exactly what it is! What would be the symtoms if this was broken or how does it work?

I looked in the chiltions manual and couldn't find anything.

 

[ADrewzki]

There are "fins" behind your intake came that rotate through a small magnetic sensor. Each time it goes through, it sends a signal to fire injectors and then send a spark. If your sensor isn't working, you wouldn't get fuel and/or spark.

 

[shredder]

Hi guys,

I'm trying to diagnose my problem and stumbled across your posts. I noticed they are recent so thought I should try and get some help. My car won't start and I have been wondering if the problem might be my CAS. I didn't know about the CPS? Does this exist on 1992 Talons? My car died the other day and I've been having a tough time troubleshooting. My fuel pump works, I have spark at the spark plug, my timing marks line up. Sorry if this should be for a new post. This is my first time on this forum. I guess my original question is about the camshaft position sensor. I noticed your pic of the intake camshaft sprocket and the arrow seems to be pointing to somewhere behind the sprocket. Is this correct? Thanks in advance for any reply.

 

[chowda633]

There are "fins" behind your intake came that rotate through a small magnetic sensor. Each time it goes through, it sends a signal to fire injectors and then send a spark. If your sensor isn't working, you wouldn't get fuel and/or spark.

Thanks for the post on the topic. Do you know where I can get one of these sensors? It kind of works I have to clear it out everytime using dsm link to get the car to run. If the code is on it will run about 5 secs then shut off. And when I clear the code it runs all messed up but timing and everything else is good.

 

[ADrewzki]

Hi guys,

I'm trying to diagnose my problem and stumbled across your posts. I noticed they are recent so thought I should try and get some help. My car won't start and I have been wondering if the problem might be my CAS. I didn't know about the CPS? Does this exist on 1992 Talons? My car died the other day and I've been having a tough time troubleshooting. My fuel pump works, I have spark at the spark plug, my timing marks line up. Sorry if this should be for a new post. This is my first time on this forum. I guess my original question is about the camshaft position sensor. I noticed your pic of the intake camshaft sprocket and the arrow seems to be pointing to somewhere behind the sprocket. Is this correct? Thanks in advance for any reply.

A 92 will have a CAS mounted on the passenger side of the head instead of the sensor/fin combo of the 95-96. It provides both the cam and crank signals to the ecu. If you have fuel and spark, the only other things to check are air and compression. Do a compression test and make sure you didn't blow off piping or something.

Thanks for the post on the topic. Do you know where I can get one of these sensors? It kind of works I have to clear it out everytime using dsm link to get the car to run. If the code is on it will run about 5 secs then shut off. And when I clear the code it runs all messed up but timing and everything else is good.

I thought you mentioned that autozone carried them in an earlier post. If not, check the classified. Maybe someone with a 2g head will take it off and sell it to you. Otherwise, you can always wire a 1g cas into your engine.

 

[shredder]

First off, Sorry Chowda633 for butting in on your topic. I'm new to these boards. Just wanna say thanks to ADrewski for responding. I'll start my own post because I've got some major problems.

 

[ADrewzki]

Just trying to do my part. I know how much of a pita these cars are and I know how much boost is addicting. *cough cough* Feel free to leave rep points *cough cough*

 

[chowda633]

I fixed it! Ok here is the deal on these sensors.

It was the cam sensor that was bad on my 96 eclipse. It has the fin/wheel combo. If you need one of these when you go to auto zone and ask for a cam angle sensor 5 different ones will come up in there computer all under crank sensor just look at the pictures that they have of the product and you will find it. It was the last one out of the 5 for me.

Now it looks almost Identical to the crank sensor its just a bit bigger in size. It took a day to get in because they didn't carry it.

The only way this sensor should be damaged is if you disassemble the head for some reason. Its protected by the intake cam.

These are DSM's we are talking about so anything could happen.

Now for sytoms of a bad cam sensor on a 95/96 The sytoms will be:

-The car will start and run for about 1-3 secs and then mysterously shut off like someone turning the car off.
-The ecu should throw a code for it. I need to look at my dsm link when I get off ship to get the code number.
-If you do get it to run it will run like its out of time and extreamly rich.
-If you put it into gear and try to move it even reving it to 3 grand or so and slowly releasing the clutch the car will stall very hard.

I hope this helps a bit with diagnosing a bad cam sensor on a 95/96 I went through hell and back on this problem and did alot of research.

Once I swapped the sensor it works perfect now it just needs a tune and fix some minor bugs.

Doc

 

[chowda633]

Thanks to all who helped me solve this problem also.