Terry's Talon Troubleshooting Tips #3 - Fast Idle (aka. Idle Surge)

1. You need to clip the log to only the part you are wanting people to look at 2. You're running pig rich 3. You're running hot 4. You're losing air somewhere...quite a bit of it if you are on an 18G and airflow is even close to calibrated. 5. Your pull is in second gear instead of third, and...

Although running the AFR a few points leaner should (in theory) give better MPG, the reality is that you will probably never be able to notice it unless you do a LOT of flat highway cruising at low loads. And since the whole point of running E85 is to get more power, well.... you see where I'm...

Also, on the MAFComp tab in ECMLink... click the little yellow question mark at the lower right. It will bring up a page that shows the complete MAF signal chain (and other useful info).

I'm going to lock this, as I think everything that needs to be said has been.OP, please start another thread with a completed checklist once you have the mechanical stuff sorted out and a WB installed.

If I was going to use it, I would just cut ignition or fuel in the case of a very lean condition....and not mess around with boost controllers and all that.The best failsafe system is the wiring between your head and your right foot. :)

I already gave you the answer:The only thing you can do within ECMLink is use the programmed condition windows to control the EGT or FPS outputs, and then use those to drive an external relay....but they don't have an AFR condition that you can test. You may be able to tap into the idle...

I'm not familiar with the AEM Failsafe, but you aren't going to shut the car down within ECMLink. My guess is you would use the Failsafe separately to control the MPI or ignition circuit through a separate relay. If it has a 0-5v wideband output, you could feed that into ECMLink to monitor...

Want log advice? Follow this Template!

A couple of suggestions:1. Rename your wideband input/display to "Wideband" 2. Check out this article on optimizing the ECMLink display.

Not sure how the rest of it looks (idle, steady cruise, etc)...but at a quick glance that pull actually doesn't look bad at all.

Nice job on the fuel testing and troubleshooting. Good to see someone going about it properly for a change. ;)FWIW, I fought with bad coils for a long time. I went through set after set of "good" used coils, COP setups, CDI boxes, etc. I finally bought all new coils from Rock Auto for like...

At least part of your boost spike issue is due to a 3" exhaust on a T25.BoostEst will only match actual boost at peak engine VE, and only when the airflow is properly calibrated. It may be very close at other points as well, but it can only be trusted at peak VE.With that said, don't worry...

You need a good boost gauge; preferably one that reads vac and up to about 30 psi.Even better, since you have ECMLink... hook a MAP sensor up to an unused input and log it. Makes it much easier to study logs, etc.

I haven't seen a log that shows exactly what you are referring to (haven't looked for one), but MAFComp is a simple linear adjustment. By that I mean, it allows you to compensate for airflow (and therefore AFR) at certain amounts of airflow...but it doesn't allow you to compensate for different...

They will never be equal unless you aren't doing any MAF calibration of any type.Go to the "MAF Comp" tab in any link log, and then click the little yellow question mark at the lower right. The chain of events shown there explains in detail where each of those signals come from and how they...

Which makes perfect sense. Knock increases with engine load (or timing advance), and unless you are cruising at a nice even speed on perfectly flat ground (and not counting launches, passes, etc)...overdrive puts the most load on the engine, especially when it first shifts into it.Once you get...

A good tuning pull is 3rd gear only, WOT from about 2300 rpms to red line on level ground.Your logs above start at too high an RPM and have shifts.

Even if it's been running like that for 20 years, it doesn't change the fact that it's a vac leak.Please see this: http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/want-log-file-advice-follow-this-template.487240/You aren't going to get much help with a log unless you address all mechanical issues...

That's part of your problem. That is a big vac leak and will cause idle issues.

He's not running SD, so this box is irrelevant.

After reading through this, a few thoughts....First, kuddos to Brett for all the help and advice he's given the OP; it's spot on. :thumb:Second, this thread is a good example of what happens when people confuse calibration with tuning. See below:To recap:1). Get the car mechanically...

What turbo are you running?We need a couple more logs to be sure, but I'm with Corey; that knock looks real enough to me. Based on the low amount of airflow, reasonable AFR (11:1), and fairly conservative timing, my bet is that you are pushing hot air. Try Corey's advise and lower timing a...

That is your best bet. Pressure is a measurement of restriction to flow (inversely proportional to it in fact). The only true way to know how much fuel you are actually flowing is to measure the volume of fuel delivered to the rail.If you get bored, try the same flow test after bypassing the...

OP, Here is some more info that may help illustrate/explain the point bastarddsm is making.http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/linkv3-boostest-and-boost-gauge-not-equal-attached-log.436795/page-5#post-152992985

Based on that idle log, there is no reason that your long term fuel trims would be anything other than 0. The FrontO2 and CombinedFT appears to be normal and is averaging around 0.

I haven't looked at the log yet, but it's more likely that the timing jumping around is a result of idle issues; not the cause of them....especially if you can disable ECU timing adjustments and see a steady 5* at idle.(Assuming you have DA timing values that aren't out in left field).

If you are in closed loop, the ECU is targeting 14.7:1 AFR. The only exception is if you are using simulated NB and have the switch point set to something other than the stoich (14.7) crossover point of your wideband, and in some specific situations where additional minor adjustments are made...

The throttle body is a usual place for a boost leak. If you are testing it properly, it will show up there (usually around the shaft seals) as easily as it will anywhere else.

OP - I'm not familiar with your particular wideband, but most of them have separate outputs for NB (0-1v) or WB (0-5v), or one output that can be programmed to be either NB or WB.Ideally, you should run a stock O2 sensor and let the ECU use that for closed-loop, and run the 0-5v signal from...

For one thing, there isn't a good closed loop O2 signal. He's running the wideband on the Front O2 input, but isn't simulating narrowband O2. So, there isn't a good signal for the ECU to use in closed loop. My guess is that the ECU is attempting to use a 0-5v linear signal on the front o2 and is...

Ahhhh.... gotcha.

Actually, it does.... but it's not voodoo. :)(look for "Adjust for global fuel change" in the right-click menu on the VE sheet.)I even made a video for it Corey. LOL

Close. :)Because I include a catch can with the purchase of a catch can.

All of the videos are now on YouTube and will remain public.https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLi5o1UcwOc_JPlJ-m2LQXkFZIdQGo23TQ

I'm not convinced of the benefits of the plug mod, but that was damn close to a good Kenny Wayne Shepherd reference. :DI heard about this way back in the day, but never thought much about it. I have a ton of plugs... I may play around with it if I have some time.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/please-read-before-you-ask-for-ecmlink-dsmlink-log-advice.443297/

Since everyone is asking, I'll try to explain this just once, as honestly and tactfully as I can.Recently I've had people with the nerve to contact me and ask for updates so "they can more easily tune peoples cars with it". So called "expert tuners" are using my software to calibrate people's...

I'm sure some asshole will start selling bootleg copies of it and make even more money off my work. ;)

Until further notice, LinkTools is no longer available for download.

Something's wrong with the MAP sensor connection. With the car off, it should read 0psi. You need to get that resolved before you can do anything at all.

After doing a lot of testing for some upcoming LT functionality, I was reminded of how important it is to compensate for the weight of fuel (and anything else for that matter) in any logs that you want to use for HP and/or torque comparisons. I found several cases where peak and average HP...

Cool deal. Put it through it's paces Robert. ;)

Latest version (5.4) has been uploaded. Download link in first post.Change Log:Fixed some over-lapping labels and a couple of minor internal issues, and added one GUI enhancement.In certain situations, the cursor position in the log chart would not be selected properly when the mouse was...

Read the post above yours and notice the forum name. He's not using ECMLink.

That's a HUGE improvement, and it looks pretty normal now. As long as there isn't some weird intermittent issue, that should be good enough to let you get it dialed in and drive-able until the SD switch.

Tony... try rotating the MAF 90* like I mentioned. That can make a huge difference (or none at all) depending where the MAF is in the piping.

As we talked about (just for the record), the WB signal looks identical in open loop as it does in closed loop, rather than smoothing out...so I'm leaning toward it being an issue with your WB.Keep us posted on your testing and/or the stock O2 results!

What fuel are you running and what is your base pressure?

Lock the ECU in open loop after it's warmed up, and do a short cruise, 2-3k rpms. Watch the WB to make sure it doesn't go crazy lean or rich, and get a log. I'm curious to see what it looks like when the ECU isn't cycling around a simulated O2 signal.The stock coolant temp gauge is...