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Turbo Newbie

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Horizon

Hey everyone.

My name is Josh and I’m 18 years old. I have been saving money non-strop throughout the year, and hopefully I will have a new job soon. (I’m putting in an application on Wednesday) If all goes well, in a couple of months I will be looking into purchasing my dream car a 1997-99 Eclipse GSX :thumb:. I’ve dreamed about this car since I was 10 years old when saw the commercial on TV in 1995. The one with the GST that is speeding across the horizon (Name inspiration) with the big dust trail behind it, that’s slowly covering the sun in the background, like a solar eclipse. I remember every second of that commercial :laugh:.

Anyway, I’ve been a lurker here for a year. I know almost all of you, even though you don’t know me. I come here every day, hell it’s my homepage. I even own the DSM tuners sweater, hat, and t-shirt, which is a little sad considering I don’t even have a DSM yet :laugh:. My friend calls me a poser, but I’m getting closer and closer to my goal, and I’ll soon show him who’s a poser when I park my GSX next to his riced out Neon.

Now that the introduction is over, I do have a few questions. I’m sure they’re newbie questions so please go easy.

Before I came here I knew next to nothing about DSMs, but I now know quite a bit thanks to searching this form everyday. I’ve always had a good understanding of how car’s work, so that’s not an issue. My brother owns a 97 Z28 Camaro and I’ve helped/watched him do a lot of work on it, so I’m not clueless. However, I’ve never seen a turbocharged car up close.

This is the main focus of my questions. I’ve searched this forum for a long time, and I now understand how turbochargers work. I understand PSI, I understand how boost controllers work, and I understand how some turbochargers can complicate air/fuel management. I understand the basics and the physics behind turbochargers. My main question is about the actual turbocharger itself. I get the idea that the bigger turbo you have, the longer it takes to spool up but gives higher top end performance, and smaller ones give low end performance due to faster spool up. All this makes perfect sense and is a pretty easy concept to grasp. However, my main question is about the turbocharger itself, not the physics behind it.

This will be my first car, and after a while I will be looking into upgrading the turbo, but I don’t feel I know enough to be messing with this car’s turbo right now. Here is my problem, I don’t know how to recognize the differences between most turbochargers I see out there. I’ve been looking at turbochargers from Mach V, Greddy, HKS, and Garrett. How do I know what kind of performance I’m going to get out of them? A lot of the sites don’t even have any information, just part numbers. At the moment it feels like a guessing game, where can I find out how to recognize the differences? Basically, I have nothing whatsoever to help me make an educated decision on what turbo best suits me.

Ideally I’m looking for happy medium. I want the GSX because of its ability to launch off the line like a bat out of hell, so that means I don’t want a really big turbo because of turbo lag. I just want something slightly bigger that will give me a little higher end performance, even if it gives me a little lag.

Also, what is an AFC? I’m guessing it stands for Air and Fuel Controller.

I ride a CBR 600 F4i as my main form of transportation. This car will be rarely driven, and babied. One of the first things I will look into will be dropping in a 6 bolt from a 1g turbo. I’d prefer to do this before I upgrade anything because I am scared of crank-walk, and I want to modify an engine with very low miles. I’m hoping to modify this car to around 300-350whp, which I think is realistic but will take a lot of time and research. I’m not looking to obtain this goal cheaply or quickly, I understand it will probably cost a lot of money to do it right and effectively, and I’m prepared to spend the money and time that is needed to obtain this goal. I’ve dreamed about this car for 8 years, so I’m taking this very seriously. This car will be for ¼ mile runs and weekend cruising only. I’d like to think I won’t street race, but I probably will some times. I’ll honestly say I’ll try not to. I’ve seen nothing but bad things come out of street racing.

Sorry if I made this too long, I’ll try and summarize.

How do I find out what turbocharger best suits me?

What is an AFC, an Air Fuel Controller?

What are the main components that should be upgraded with a slightly bigger turbocharger? I could guess quite a few, but I would like to hear it from you guys.

How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a would chuck could chuck wood?

Thanks

P.S Dont tell me to get a 1g. It was love at first sight, and the first sight was a 2g :laugh:
 
Find a peice of shit 99 with a blown engine. cheap. and drop a 7 bolt 1g engine in you new bi***.
 
man, WTF kind of post was that? And I think you mean 6 bolt there Malefic bi***. Who's the newbie?
 
Dont listen to these assholes, their just some of the few who pick on newbs and dont reflect the rest of us at all.

:dsm:
 
I hope I just took some of those comments wrong. If you by any stretch of the imagination ment to call an individual a bad name......lets just not go there.

As far a modifying your car goes you will have to do it slow and run through it. There really isn't an easy way to just explain it all to you and equate it to a turbo.

IMHO you can just modify your car based on the 7 bolt in it. If it blows it blows...then swap to a 6 bolt. Don't worry about doing it before you have some fun. This will also give you a little leeway as you will have an exit strategy if you mess something up or just get unlucky and the engine blows. The bolt block should be ok at the power numbers you are speaking of.

Do some reading on "supporting mods" "fuel system tuning" "turbo choice" "16g" etc.
 
Try working on the 7-bolt engine before jumping into a large project such as an engine swap. If you go by the staged upgrades on this site, you'll learn as you go, so by the time you get to the turbo/FMIC/Clutch/etc, you'll know your way around the car enough that by the time you're ready to go for a 6bolt swap, things will be much easier. In other words, if you get a car with a stock engine, stock T25, have a little fun with it before going all out. You could realistically get your hp goals on the 7-bolt with very little money invested in parts and never have a problem with it, so don't jump to the conclusion that you must have a 6-bolt immediately. The staged upgrade guide will help you go slowly and allow you to enjoy your car before things start going wrong. (Which they will... it's a DSM :) ) Good luck finding a car and come back with any questions. Check www.vfaq.com for some great information on differentiating turbos.

AFC is an Air Fuel Controller, and the one DSM'ers most commonly talk about is made by Apex'i, the S-AFC.
 
Keeping your car stock for a little while is a good idea. When I first purchased my 95gsx it had minimal mods and the t25 was still intact. I remember being in awe of how fun it was to drive when I first got it. Of, course a few months later when the new wore off I quicky became in awe of how badly LS1's could stomp my stock GSX a## and decided to mod the hell out of it. I almost wish now (12k in mods later) that I would have kept it stock. If you do decide to mod your eclipse (and im sure you will) make sure you have a reliable second vehicle that you can drive when it breaks (and im sure it will). I don't mean to make it sound like eclipses are junk, they are actually very reliable cars IN STOCK FORM, but as soon as you start applying moderate to major modifications plan on having at least a few occasional problems. Good luck with your goals, I hope you get the GSX you've always wanted. Just be prepared for the consequenses (addiction, poverty, and mountains of speeding tickets) and have fun. :thumb:
 
listen to what MrBoxx says ^^^

Learn to tune on your car with stock motor and turbo, follow the upgrade path on this site. Get yourself a boost controller and an AFC, Apexi makes one that is easy to learn on and will carry you through your 300-350 whp goals. Get the appropriate gauges to help monitor things and get a logger. A logger is critical in tuning properly. www.pocketlogger.com is very popular and works well. :thumb:

Good luck!
 
You can find out exactly what turbo you need by charting out compressor maps. If you need the CUI of the 4g63 its 122. You get this by multiplying your displacement by 61. This is a good read from a saturn website. It describes how to plot your numbers on a compressor chart.

http://www.turbosaturns.net/articles/compressor maps_3.htm

just do a webcrawler search to find more detailed information about plotting these maps.

The only way to get the specs for the turbo is through the turbo dealer. Most turbo sites have compressor maps you can just click on and print out. You can decide what turbo you want after plotting the maps.
 
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