Oil Stick Shooting Up

alain · Oct 28, 2005

I have a new 91 cyclone engine with less than 10k miles. I am using an AFC II with 680cc injectors, t3/t4 boosting 14psi max. Recently, and mostly after boosting, the oil meter stick is poping out about 4 inches. The meter head is kinda loose, not that tight on the tube. My friends told me that eventhough it is loose, it shouldnt come out. I already changed the PVC valve and hose and the problem persist.
Is this a normal behavior and I should make the oil meter stick tight on the tube. Notice that it does spills out oil. Also, I am not using a exhaust, I have a straight thru empty exhaust...
Can anyone help me with this please... I would appreciate any answer

alex99gst · Oct 28, 2005

This would work: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=163026&highlight=oil+dipstick

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=176604&highlight=dipstick

DSMcrazy3 · Oct 28, 2005

I've read in many posts that the rubber ring that holds it down, after getting old, becomes useless. Just try and replace that if possible and you should be good to go. :thumb:

ImportWarrior · Oct 28, 2005

there is a vacuum problem. is the vacuum system all stock? was anything removed. if it has too much pressure in the crank case it will try to vent through the dip stick throwing oil every where creating a big mess. some where there is a vacuum problem. some of the vacuum system lines are designed to suck the pressure out when the car revs high. i bet if you just drive the car and use as little as possible or no boost at all it will not pop out. also keep the revs down until you get it fixed. something is not hooked up or plugged or blocked off.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y276/cyberquest/professor/PC-22.jpg

now with sparkplug boot on
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y276/cyberquest/professor/PC-23.jpg

alain · Oct 28, 2005

ImportWarrior said:
there is a vacuum problem. is the vacuum system all stock? was anything removed. if it has too much pressure in the crank case it will try to vent through the dip stick throwing oil every where creating a big mess. some where there is a vacuum problem. some of the vacuum system lines are designed to suck the pressure out when the car revs high. i bet if you just drive the car and use as little as possible or no boost at all it will not pop out. also keep the revs down until you get it fixed. something is not hooked up or plugged or blocked off.

So this behavior is not normal, eventhough the head of the dip stick is worn out and old and therefore loose. I will recheck the lines with a mechanic. I already check everything, replace the VPC, I have no clue what line or valve or connection could be the problem.

alain · Oct 28, 2005

ImportWarrior said:
there is a vacuum problem. is the vacuum system all stock?.

Sorry, I missed this. Well, this is an engine swap, I have a 95 TSI, the engine is 91. I only replaced the PVC. The rest is stock.

alain · Oct 28, 2005

DSMcrazy3 said:
I've read in many posts that the rubber ring that holds it down, after getting old, becomes useless. Just try and replace that if possible and you should be good to go.

Even if the rubber ring is old, should it do that? You think that amount of pressure is normal in there. I am getting oil spill everywhere (missing 1/2 a quart) and the dip stick is 4-6 inches up after racing.

ImportWarrior · Oct 28, 2005

i drive an 18 year old starion and do not have any issues with it popping out. may be apples to oranges. but i have yet to replace anything on the dip stick.

my previous post states a good fix.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y276/cyberquest/professor/PC-22.jpg

now with sparkplug boot on
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y276/cyberquest/professor/PC-23.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y276/cyberquest/professor/PC-24.jpg

alain · Oct 28, 2005

ImportWarrior said:
i drive an 18 year old starion and do not have any issues with it popping out. may be apples to oranges. but i have yet to replace anything on the dip stick.

my previous post states a good fix.

thanks for the fix idea and thank you for the reply. very helpful. thanks to all the dsmers that replied!

ImportWarrior · Oct 28, 2005

added one more pic

oldman · Oct 28, 2005

I know it's bad to quote yourself

, just hate typing the same thing all the time. For the record, I do not agree with any solutions which requires physical restrain of the dipstick itself like some of the links above.

Originally Posted by oldman
Dipstick popping out is a sign of excessive crankcase pressure, this can happen in several ways.

1. Excessive blowby from the cylinders as defiant has mentioned, a dry and wet compression test will give you some clue but a leakdown will probably be needed to confirm.

2. Pressure air leaking into the crankcase, pcv valve and valves seals are usually the culprit, a boost leak test will help pin point this.

3. Crankcase ventilation issues, mostly caused by a clogged or stuck closed pcv valve or full fuel filter/catch can waiting to be emtied.

Obviously, one can also have combinations of all three. It's also my oppinion that the dipstick tube should never be pinched as a solution even if the problem is a simple worn out dipstick which is rarely the case, a $15 new dipstick from the dealer should be the solution. Dipstick popping acts as a last venting insurance for the crankcase and a great warning sign as well incase of serious problems, pinching it will force the excessive pressure to seek exit else where, usually valve seals, turbo seal and gaskets. I would rather have a dipstick pop out than smoke out of my tail pipes as warning signs any day.

9!'clipseDOHC · Oct 29, 2005

I had the same problem with my dipstick popping out at normal boost levels. The rubber seal on the top of the dipstick was so worn that it wouldn't stick in the tube, it would just slide up with no effort. I replaced the dipstick with one from an extra engine and it stays in and hasn't popped out since. I beleive your dipstick is the problem but if its not Dejon Powerhouse sells crankcase vents which "Crank Vents solve the problem of pressure buildup in the engine during boost due to pressure entering thru the PVC valve. These devices are one-way valves that can stop 1000psi. The big one goes between the manifold and PVC valve (shown on left) to stop boost from entering the engine. The small one goes on the valve cover vent to pump air out (not in), building a vacuum in the crankcase. This results in more horsepower (stop pumping air below the piston). If your dip stick pops out under boost, this problem will be cured also"

alain · Oct 31, 2005

oldman said:
I know it's bad to quote yourself , just hate typing the same thing all the time. For the record, I do not agree with any solutions which requires physical restrain of the dipstick itself like some of the links above.

Thanks a lot for the reply. The dip stick is in fact wore off, it is kinda loose on the tube. I replaced the PCV valve on it and change the hose.

alain · Oct 31, 2005

9!'clipseDOHC said:
I had the same problem with my dipstick popping out at normal boost levels. The rubber seal on the top of the dipstick was so worn that it wouldn't stick in the tube, it would just slide up with no effort. I replaced the dipstick with one from an extra engine and it stays in and hasn't popped out since. I beleive your dipstick is the problem but if its not Dejon Powerhouse sells crankcase vents which "Crank Vents solve the problem of pressure buildup in the engine during boost due to pressure entering thru the PVC valve. These devices are one-way valves that can stop 1000psi. The big one goes between the manifold and PVC valve (shown on left) to stop boost from entering the engine. The small one goes on the valve cover vent to pump air out (not in), building a vacuum in the crankcase. This results in more horsepower (stop pumping air below the piston). If your dip stick pops out under boost, this problem will be cured also"

Thanks a lot ... will keep this in mind. Dont have the $$$ but I will consider later on!.. thanks

selmerguy · Nov 1, 2005

sorry but i am going to think out loud here. when a car ir turbo charged air/exhaust is forced into the cylinders. unless your piston rings dont seal pressure should not go in the oil pan (crank case) where the dip stick goes. if i am wrong will someone tell me how. thanks

Deadly BlaZe · Nov 1, 2005

is it possible for boost to enter the oil pan?

ddavisaf · Nov 1, 2005

Yes, through your piston rings or valve seals. Both are bad and both cause excessive crankcase pressure. Oldman and I have tag-teamed countless excessive crankcase pressure problems. And never once have we seen the correct way of fixing the problem by crimping the dipstick tube. A Good motor will pop out a bad dipstick, and a bad motor will pop out a good dipstick.
There are four things to do. Period.
1) Replace the pcv -Completed
2) Replace the o-rings on the dipstick, or the entire dipstick
3) Run a compression test to test the piston rings
4) Run a leakdown test to test the valve seals

www.vfaq.com has links on how to run a compression and leakdown test if you're unsure of how. It's under the Engine Section. Good luck, post back your results. :thumb:

crankbender · Nov 1, 2005

Deadly BlaZe said:
is it possible for boost to enter the oil pan?

Yes past the rings as others have mentioned.

I have found that the problem, if only seen under boost, is caused by inadequate crankcase ventilation. This is caused by 2 things.

The relief on the left side of your head is clogged. Make sure it is piped up correctly.

The rings are letting more air into the crankcase than the stock ventilation system is capable of handling.

Walla figure out which one of these is happening and fix it.

nightstocker99 · Nov 1, 2005

why don't you just buy crank vents you can get them just about any where online like dejon tools, slowboy racing and it should stop you from poping the dip stick :thumb:

oldman · Nov 1, 2005

alain said:
Thanks a lot for the reply. The dip stick is in fact wore off, it is kinda loose on the tube.

And the solution for that as I posted should be a new dipstick, do not pinch or restrain the dipstick in anyway as it may cause you a lot of grief in the future.

ddavisaf said:
4) Run a leakdown test to test the valve seals

Valve seals are not part of the leakdown test as they're not part of the combustion chamber.

nightstocker99 said:
why don't you just buy crank vents you can get them just about any where online like dejon tools, slowboy racing and it should stop you from poping the dip stick

That would be a good idea if ventilation can be confirmed as the cause of the problem. If problem turns out to be others like rings or valve seals, you're simply covering up the problem, not fixing it. It would be like hitting fuel cut due to boost leaks, instead of fixing the leaks, you install an safc to delay fuel cut and continue to drive with massive boost leaks.

Like bender said, most important thing is find the cause(s) and fix it.

steve · Nov 1, 2005

I guess I need to pop in and remind people that you must test your new PCV valve before installing it because so many of them leak rather than seal under boost. Most of the cars that use these PCV valves are NA cars so them sealing doesn't matter.

Make sure that the valve seals when air pressure (your max boost pressure or more) is applied to the barbed end and nothing comes out the threaded end.

Steve

ddavisaf · Nov 1, 2005

oldman said:
Valve seals are not part of the leakdown test as they're not part of the combustion chamber.

If you can hear air escaping through your exhaust, then your exhaust valve seals are bad. If you can hear air escaping through your intake manifold/throttle body, your intake valve seals are bad. Right?

oldman · Nov 1, 2005

ddavisaf said:
If you can hear air escaping through your exhaust, then your exhaust valve seals are bad. If you can hear air escaping through your intake manifold/throttle body, your intake valve seals are bad. Right?

You're talking about valves themselves (bent valves or valves not seated properly), not the valve seals. Valves seal leaks happens at the intake and exhaust ports of the head where the valve guides are located.

ddavisaf · Nov 1, 2005

oldman said:
You're talking about valves themselves (bent valves or valves not seated properly), not the valve seals. Valves seal leaks happens at the intake and exhaust ports of the head where the valve guides are located.

Ah ha.. My mistake. Thank you.

oldman · Nov 1, 2005

ddavisaf said:
Ah ha.. My mistake. Thank you.

I'll let this one slide.

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