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Ordered SBC Stage 2 DD clutch kit, got Exedy clutch?

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XC92

Proven Member
1,573
358
Jul 22, 2020
Queens, New_York
Based on the advice of several folks here and some research, I ordered a South Bend Clutch Stage 2 Daily Driver clutch kit. It sells for around $335 on a bunch of sites, and with a 5% coupon and tax it came out to a bit under $350. I just got it today. Opening it up, it consists of a pressure plate, clutch disc, release bearing, alignment tool, brief manual and a warranty card.

Looking at the disc, it says that it's made by Exedy, model # MBD081U. A quick check online revealed it to be selling for between $40-$45. Given that the tool goes for around $5 and the release bearing is a cheap metal sleeve NSK that sells for around $10 (I separately bought a different NSK that's an OEM part, with a resin sleeve), am I to assume that the pressure plate is what I'm mostly paying for, around $280?

Thing is, when I spoke to SBC a few weeks ago, they told me that the only difference between the Stage 1 and Stage 2 kits was the disc, which they said was organic and more durable, and the pressure plate was the same between the two. Given that the Stage 1 sells for around $100 less than the Stage 2, I could have gotten the Stage 1 with a lesser disc and had enough left over to buy 2 additional Stage 2 discs.

Or am I misunderstanding something?

Btw, the manual referred to a step value that the flywheel is supposed to be resurfaced to, but didn't give the actual step value. It was also somewhat poorly written and hard to follow. I'm sure that these are good parts, but if I'd known all this I would have gone the Stage 1 route and gotten the organic Exedy when it was time to replace the clutch disc. I might actually do that if return shipping isn't too expensive.
 
SouthBend kits usually or always use Exedy discs.

Which is fine by me, but according to their own tech they're basically selling an upgraded clutch disc for way more than I can get it myself. If the difference between the S1 & S2 DDs is only the disc, I'm better off returning the S2, saving $100 and using it to buy 2 extra S2 discs.

Oddly, on Exedy's own site they're selling the same disc for WAY more than I can get it online, $372, which is nearly $40 more than the entire SBC S2 DD kit goes for:

https://shop.exedyusa.com/exedy-oem/exedy-oem-clutch-disc/mbd081u/i-394134.aspx

Are the Exedy discs I'm finding online for around $40 counterfeit ripoffs? Here's one:

https://autoplicity.com/2725788-exedy-clutch-exedy-oem-clutch-disc

In any case, so SBC is basically a pressure plate maker?
 
Wow I never put that together. It sounds like you can piece together your own kit for a lot less.

I'm not sure of that autoplicity site though.... Can you find the Exedy disc on any other sites? Like autozone, mapperformance, extremepsi etc??
 
Well there's eBay, but who knows what you're getting. But I think I saw it earlier on other sites for around $40, but can't find them now. Perhaps these really are knockoffs.

Then again, you can get this full kit at RockAuto for $125, and it includes this Exedy disc:

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=2392834&cc=1103094&jsn=591&jsn=591

Figure $10 for the cheap release bearing and $5 for the tool, and that's a pressure plate and disc for $110, so $40-$50 for just the disc seems plausible. Scratching my head here.

I have to call them tomorrow anyway to get the step value they didn't include with the kit, and I'll ask them about this. My sense is that these aren't real Exedys, or perhaps are used or reman.

Btw, the kit instructions said that during the break-in period I shouldn't downshift. But then how do I slow down without lugging and stalling the engine?

Do they mean I can downshift, but only by double-clutching? Or, no engine braking?
 
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Southbend takes Exedy clutches and modifies them from what I know, that being said Im not sure that you would be able to buy the same parts outside of Southbend Clutch.
 
I think I just got a little nervous when I opened the box and saw another company's clutch disc. That plus the sketchy instructions that referred to a step value "below" that wasn't actually below or anywhere (as far as I could tell), and instructions to not downshift during break-in, made me do wonder what was going on.
 
Btw, the kit instructions said that during the break-in period I shouldn't downshift. But then how do I slow down without lugging and stalling the engine?
?

You push the clutch in, shift to neutral, let the clutch out. Use the brakes to come to a stop. Not sure if you have the definitely of lugging correct. Lugging would be high load at low engine RPM. I don't think the transmission or clutch really cares if you lug them. Lugging is very hard on the engine.
In general drive like a sane person normally normally would. Avoid WOT pulls, do lots of in town driving with lots of up shifting, avoid excessive slipping of the clutch. I've never heard the "no down shifting bit. When you buy a new corvette I'm pretty sure it doesn't say avoid downshifting on the invoice.

I also recently installed a SBC in a customers car and noticed the Exedy warranty card. And that was for the disk rated for 525 tq.
Contemplated seeing what that disk goes for direct because I figured SBC was just rebadging another product. Wonder how it would pair with ACT lightweight flywheel and 2600 pressure plate??
 
You push the clutch in, shift to neutral, let the clutch out. Use the brakes to come to a stop. Not sure if you have the definitely of lugging correct. Lugging would be high load at low engine RPM. I don't think the transmission or clutch really cares if you lug them. Lugging is very hard on the engine.
In general drive like a sane person normally normally would. Avoid WOT pulls, do lots of in town driving with lots of up shifting, avoid excessive slipping of the clutch. I've never heard the "no down shifting bit. When you buy a new corvette I'm pretty sure it doesn't say avoid downshifting on the invoice.

I also recently installed a SBC in a customers car and noticed the Exedy warranty card. And that was for the disk rated for 525 tq.
Contemplated seeing what that disk goes for direct because I figured SBC was just rebadging another product. Wonder how it would pair with ACT lightweight flywheel and 2600 pressure plate??

I meant that if I can't downshift, meaning I have to stay in whatever gear I'm in (unless I'm at a complete stop, which is kind of impossible on the highway, say), then as I slow down using the brakes or letting off the gas pedal, the engine will eventually lug. Downshifting avoids that, but if it's not allowed during break-in, kind of hard to avoid it.

I'll call them today to clarify this, but I assume that they mean that instead of directly and immediately shifting to a lower gear before releasing the clutch pedal, stay in neutral briefly with the clutch pedal out, press the pedal in again, then shift to the lower gear. I.e. double-clutch, which I understand is generally good practice anyway. Nothing else makes sense for real-world driving conditions.
 
No as he said not downshifting is just not going to a lower gear and engine braking. You don't have to stay in the gear your in that would not be possible. When you want to slow down they want you to pull out of gear and leave it in neutral and just use the brakes only to slow down to a stop. Not complicated

When you engine brake even with double clutching the clutch has to pull the engine to the speed of the transmission which is harder on the clutch and trans. I never engine brake even normal driving. Brake pads are cheaper than trannys and clutches to replace
 
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No as he said not downshifting is just not going to a lower gear and engine braking. You don't have to stay in the gear your in that would not be possible. When you want to slow down they want you to pull out of gear and leave it in neutral and just use the brakes only to slow down to a stop. Not complicated

When you engine brake even with double clutching the clutch has to pull the engine to the speed of the transmission which is harder on the clutch and trans. I never engine brake even normal driving. Brake pads are cheaper than trannys and clutches to replace

Thanks, now I understand. I actually just spoke to an SBC tech and he said the same thing, and added that if I do downshift to first rev-match. So, if I have to slow down, neutral, foot off gas, brake, then when at speed I need to beat, shift into suitable gear and proceed as normal?

Btw I need to get the flywheel resurfaced. The tech said that whatever the current step value is, it should be the same after both surfaces are machined. So if they take off 0.001 from one, they need to take off exactly the same from the other. I don't have a dial gauge but is it possible to use a micrometer or caliper to measure each surface's height from the other side of the flywheel, before and after resurfacing, to confirm that the shop did it right? This probably won't get me the actual step value, because there probably isn't a common baseline surface height on the other side, but it could confirm that whatever the step was before, it's the same after.
 
It is my understanding that many clutch shops use an existing disk or pressure plate and modify them. So i doubt anything we are buying from sbc is "off the shelf" from another manufacturer.
Concerning step height sbc should include a recommendation. Follow the guidlelines. Any competent machine shop can tell you what it currently is, how much they have to remove and show you what it is after. If they can't produce a depth mic if asked find another shop.
 
It is my understanding that many clutch shops use an existing disk or pressure plate and modify them. So i doubt anything we are buying from sbc is "off the shelf" from another manufacturer.
Concerning step height sbc should include a recommendation. Follow the guidlelines. Any competent machine shop can tell you what it currently is, how much they have to remove and show you what it is after. If they can't produce a depth mic if asked find another shop.

I think I've found a shop that can do it but I forgot to ask them about all this. Thing is that techs sometimes take offense to being asked to back up their work so I've got to be tactful about it so they don't give me some "What, you don't trust me or think I'm incompetent?" attitude. I'll be nice.
 
Thing is that techs sometimes take offense to being asked to back up their work
If they have a problem with answering questions (bad customer service) leave & find another better helpful shop. My experience is they only take offense when they are not competent. All qualified machinist I have worked with will like to explain & show their knowledge, skills, & what you're paying for.
 
True, but having made a bunch of calls there don't seem to be many shops that still resurface flywheels around here, at least for walk-in customers as opposed to service stations, which I assume is largely due to most new cars being automatics and not needing this procedure. Even brake rotor resurfacing isn't as common as it used to be as buying a new set is usually not much more expensive.

But, of course, better not to have it done than have it done wrong or not provably right.
 
I think I've found a shop that can do it but I forgot to ask them about all this. Thing is that techs sometimes take offense to being asked to back up their work so I've got to be tactful about it so they don't give me some "What, you don't trust me or think I'm incompetent?" attitude. I'll be nice.
I kindly explain to them the only way I know for sure is if I look myself. That removes all doubt. Measure twice, cut once. I've never had a shop make a mistake but kindly tell them everybody is human. These particular cars are intolerant of too much variance in step height when you start putting in aftermarket clutches.
See this thread.
https://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/clutch-basic-101-a-clutch-basics-thread-for-everybody.459908/
I did 8 trans drops in one long weekend chasing disengagement issues. Never again. I make sure my systems are working, my measurements are objective. If there is anything substandard it gets addressed.
 
Where are you calling? While flywheel resurfacing itself may not be as common as it once was, general industrial machine work has never changed. If you can find a machine shop with a decent size lathe (i.e. any industrial machine shop) they can resurface a flywheel at the proper step as if it were any other part. Now they won't understand the specifics of clutches or DSM's but if you provide a decent machinist the part and tell them this surface needs to be 0.XXX" from this surface and kept parallel to the crank bolt surface they will be able to handle it.

And of course ask them to double check it like Paul said
 
FYI - If you use a resurfaced flywheel you will need to shim the pivot ball to restore the OEM designed leverage geometry & clutch fork position. The shim thickness will be equal to the amount of material machined of the friction surface face. Make the shop tells you how much was machined off so you know how much to shim or you will be doing the clutch fork position by trial & error & may have to drop the tranny multiple times to get it right. Only way not shimming is by using new flywheel, fork & pivot ball.
 
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FYI - If you use a resurfaced flywheel you will need to shim the pivot ball to restore the OEM designed leverage geometry & clutch fork position. The shim thickness will be equal to the amount of material machined of the friction surface face. Make the shop tells you how much was machined off so you know how much to shim or you will be doing the clutch fork position by trial & error & may have to drop the tranny multiple times to get it right. Only way not shimming is by using new flywheel, fork & pivot ball.

Thanks for the reminder. If I can't find the right-sized shim, does the old coke can cutout trick work?
 
Thanks for the reminder. If I can't find the right-sized shim, does the old coke can cutout trick work?
Yes that would work. Personally I don't shim. I might consider it if the flywheel were cut severely. I talk about shimming in the thread I posted. The statement above is correct. You've moved the flywheel away from trans by a few thousandths. Does it matter? I'd like to see some measurement on it. Basically it's a trig problem. How far does the bearing go linearly when moved along an arc of increasing angle.
 
It is my understanding that many clutch shops use an existing disk or pressure plate and modify them. So i doubt anything we are buying from sbc is "off the shelf" from another manufacturer.
.

The card that comes with the south end kit is literally for clutch disk replacement and warranty and it is direct from Exedy. The bright red pressure plate I'm not sure of. But but the way the card made it seem, you would go through Exedy for replacement or warranty band wouldn't even deal with south bend at that point, not that I don't think the owner would back you up and either of those because I've hear nothing but good things, but you know what I mean I'm sure. I literally just put a south bend in a customer car mated to a ACT lightweight street duty flywheel.

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The card that comes with the south end kit is literally for clutch disk replacement and warranty and it is direct from Exedy. The bright red pressure plate I'm not sure of. But but the way the card made it seem, you would go through Exedy for replacement or warranty band wouldn't even deal with south bend at that point, not that I don't think the owner would back you up and either of those because I've hear nothing but good things, but you know what I mean I'm sure. I literally just put a south bend in a customer car mated to a ACT lightweight street duty flywheel.

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I cant speak for this unit bit i have warrantied an SBC unit and SBC took care of it.
 
The S2 DD kit I got had an SBC warranty card. But I'm not worried about that. I'm sure they stand behind their products. When I spoke to an SBC tech he told me they take Exedy discs and modify them. Not sure how but I have no reason to doubt it. I was surprised at how light and thin it was, just the disc that is. The PP's pretty heavy. I'm amazed that it can last for tens of thousands of miles if installed properly and treated well.

I'm getting the flywheel resurfaced next week. I took it out last week and stupidly left it outside where it rained for several days, so of course it got all rusty. After it dried I manually brushed it off with a handheld wire brush. I hope this didn't take off too much surface or complicates resurfacing. Do you know what the proper OEM flywheel step is? The SBC tech said to keep it to that number. I've read that 0.610" +/- 0.002" is good.
 
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