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1G TUBULAR EXHAUST MANIFOLD

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turbakias

Probationary Member
26
2
Nov 1, 2019
Nea Artaki Greece, Europe
Hi guys,

i am upgrading my 1g. I bought a GTX3076 turbo fmic injectors and other parts.

i will make a new tubular exhaust manifold. I want your opionion.

i am thinking to turn the turbo so the intake will face the front of the car in order to face loads of fresh air.
My concern is that to make such manifold i will need to have very long manifold pipes.

in term of performance which position and design is the best? My car will not used for daily use just for street racing and back to garage.

another thought but i dont know if it can be done is to buy a resdy aftermarket tubular exhaust manifold from Evo 8 because there are available many designs but i dont know if it fits my car.

please share your opinion and if you have any photo of suggested exhaust manifold will be much appreciated.

regards and thanks in advance

dimitris
 
The small 30r turbine wheel in that turbo is a mismatch for the compressor. I'd switch to a 3576 gen 2. What turbine housing do you plan to run? Forward facing adds a lot of complications with regard to radiator placement, downpipe, etc. For a street car I'd stick to a standard bottom mount. I'd do the 1.01 divided T3 with the Morrison hot parts kit. http://morrisonfabrications.com/product/dsm-twin-scroll-t3-hot-parts-kit/
 
My mechanic advised me gt3076 or gtx3076 as for now i am stock engine and my plans is for 450hp. I made a research in forums about turbo sizes and i read that 3076 is ideal as there isnt so much lag comparing with bigger turbos such as 3582 and 3576 that why i chose this turbo.

i think the housing is 0.63 but not quite sure. I am planning to run it with 38mm tial external.

regarding the manifold i was thinking to turn it around 45 degrees so that will face in angle the front of the car.

radiator will not be a problem as i replace it with half size civic 3 row and slim fan. Have you ever seen a design like this? Also what diameter do you advise for the exhaust manifold Pipes and also for intercooler pipes?

exhaust will be without cat and will be 76mm downpipe and the rest pipe 76mm as well.
 
Because i am located in Greece in order to buy from us i will have to pay excessive shipping cost plus custom costs... but this manifold seems awesome!!

do you know if this can fit 1g eclipse? As i think the engine bay is a bit different and the healights are totally different .

in order to install this you definitely have to install civic rad right?
 
My mechanic advised me gt3076 or gtx3076 as for now i am stock engine and my plans is for 450hp. I made a research in forums about turbo sizes and i read that 3076 is ideal as there isnt so much lag comparing with bigger turbos such as 3582 and 3576 that why i chose this turbo.

i think the housing is 0.63 but not quite sure. I am planning to run it with 38mm tial external.

regarding the manifold i was thinking to turn it around 45 degrees so that will face in angle the front of the car.

radiator will not be a problem as i replace it with half size civic 3 row and slim fan. Have you ever seen a design like this? Also what diameter do you advise for the exhaust manifold Pipes and also for intercooler pipes?

exhaust will be without cat and will be 76mm downpipe and the rest pipe 76mm as well.

forward facing will also suck in everything and eat up the comp wheel. I'd only do it on a dedicated track car.

Testing on the 3076 vs 3576 showed no change in spool with power gains. The comp is 65+ lb/min and is much better suited to the 35r turbine. For your goals, maybe stick to the GTX3071. The .63 housing is also on the small side for the 76.

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/e...602163-gtx-showdown-gtx3076r-vs-gtx3576r.html
 
As i have already bought the turbo i will try it and if its not good for me then i will switch it. 3076 is very popular and i think it will go off really quick.

i read in the forums that my engine can handle up to 500ps stock motor. My plans are around there and as i stated before it will only be used some times just for fun or for a race.

I have already installed a stand alone ecu plug n play to be safe from problems.

fuel pump and injectors are the next purchases.

can you suggest me intercooler pipe diameter to use with my intercooler which is 60X30X10 cm with 76mm inlets.

Diameter of manifold pipes and diameter of exhaust?
 
The exhaust shop suggest me 76mm diameter all way exhaust and told it can handle up to 600-700 ps... any thoughts?
 
The GTX3076R is a nice match. I don’t disagree with the compressor being slightly oversized vs turbine. But as is Garrett’s way. Most of their lineup has been that way. For YEARS.
The 3076 is a VERY NICE piece of hardware. I recommend the 63 or 82 turbine housing. If you have or can get the twin scroll housings, I recommend that. Especially for the street.

Look up archer fabrications, full race, JMFab, and Morrison. That should give you an idea on what diameter runners to use. They all also follow good principles and have great techniques.
I wouldn’t recommend a 3576 ever. Rather see a 3582 at lower boost. If you’re gonna go 35, get the compressor to back it up.
The 35 is just far too much of a jump up and give up too much spool.
 
1.5" sch 40 is the standard size for manifolds for our cars. 1.25" sch 40 is better for sub 600whp, spool wise, however you'd need to use a reducer at the manifold flange. With 1.5" you don't have to.

For intercooler pipe, you don't need anything larger than 64mm.
 
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That what i was thinking. Thank you for confirming my thoughts.

ecu wise i was thinking for Link G4+ plug n play ecu do you have any better alternative?

and exhaust 76 mm is ok?
 
No experience with link g4+ but I hear it's great. Ecmlink is the standard here in the USA. You can get one used, w/ ecu, for around $550 USD, but if you're looking to buy new, you might as well go with the link g4+. It's only a little bit more money but has more functionality being a full stand alone ecu.

As for exhaust. 76mm is perfectly fine.
 
The majority in the forum uses the ecmlink. In the begining i was about to buy ecmlink but in Greece there isnt support from a local dealer and none of the programmers uses this ecu. That's why i decided to chose link along with the map feature so i get rid of the maf.

have you ever seen any eclipse 1g the one with the pop up headlights with front facing turbo manifold? Because i am searching and i only can find 1g with normal headlights and i am wondering maybe its not going to work in mine.
 
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Here is a photo of my eclipse
 

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The GTX3076R is a nice match. I don’t disagree with the compressor being slightly oversized vs turbine. But as is Garrett’s way. Most of their lineup has been that way. For YEARS.
I wouldn’t recommend a 3576 ever. Rather see a 3582 at lower boost. If you’re gonna go 35, get the compressor to back it up.
The 35 is just far too much of a jump up and give up too much spool.

Please stop. The 3076 functions just fine, but it is absolutely a mismatch, which is why the 3576 spools identically and makes more power through less emap. Just because it's always been done one way does not mean that it's the correct way. You're spreading misinformation and you should feel bad.

That what i was thinking. Thank you for confirming my thoughts.

ecu wise i was thinking for Link G4+ plug n play ecu do you have any better alternative?

and exhaust 76 mm is ok?

Link G4+ is great! 76mm exhaust should work well. I'd advise you to keep reading on this forum. Pretty much every question you have can be answered by just searching the threads here.
 
Please stop. The 3076 functions just fine, but it is absolutely a mismatch, which is why the 3576 spools identically and makes more power through less emap. Just because it's always been done one way does not mean that it's the correct way. You're spreading misinformation and you should feel bad.



Link G4+ is great! 76mm exhaust should work well. I'd advise you to keep reading on this forum. Pretty much every question you have can be answered by just searching the threads here.
That was a little mean. It seems like a lot of people repeat this talking point that originated on the evo forums that the 3076 is a mismatch. Maybe previous users of the 3076 have been expecting an outcome that Garrett didn’t intend for it? I don’t know. I’ve seen a lot of examples of really fast and powerful 3076 cars but you have to push them. I think a lot of people get confused and think every turbo should get you 650hp at 30psi. I often see this free-lunch theory that the 3576 spools the same as the 3076. I don’t see how a turbo with a much larger turbine could spool exactly the same as a 30r, but I guess one guy on the evo forums did claim that. Anyways, I’m not a turbo expert. Just sharing my thoughts.
 
That was a little mean. It seems like a lot of people repeat this talking point that originated on the evo forums that the 3076 is a mismatch. Maybe previous users of the 3076 have been expecting an outcome that Garrett didn’t intend for it? I don’t know. I’ve seen a lot of examples of really fast and powerful 3076 cars but you have to push them. I think a lot of people get confused and think every turbo should get you 650hp at 30psi. I often see this free-lunch theory that the 3576 spools the same as the 3076. I don’t see how a turbo with a much larger turbine could spool exactly the same as a 30r, but I guess one guy on the evo forums did claim that. Anyways, I’m not a turbo expert. Just sharing my thoughts.

It was intentionally mean. I very much dislike misinformation, and people shouldn't pass off conjecture and assumptions as facts. The physical science says the 3076 is a mismatch. All this means is that it spools slow and has poor transient response for it's flow capability. While it's not necessarily intuitive, if you dig into the science you'll discover how a larger turbine helps the 3076 compressor wheel. To simplify it, the turbine has to do a certain amount of work to get the compressor up to speed. Think of it like two waterwheels connected by a shaft. If you have one large waterwheel and one small one, you'd have to put a lot of effort into the small one to get the big one to spin. If you replace the small water wheel with one of similar size to the big one, the increased leverage allows you to spin the whole assembly easier. It's the same with compressors and turbines. If the turbine is a lot smaller than the compressor, it has very little leverage and has to do a lot of work to get the compressor up to speed. With a larger turbine, despite increased rotational mass, the turbine has to do less work to get the compressor up to speed and can maintain that speed much easier.

The link was provided above where the user on EvoM doesn't claim it, he proves it.
 
Thanks everyone for taking time to reply me.

i am reading forum the past three months and although it seems easy for a newbie to find answers to most common questions at the same time its so difficult and confusing as search engine comes with many results and due to the fact that many have answered and questioned the same is too difficult to find out the answer.

By my experience with other evos 35 turbo is a lot more laggy you cant expect a bigger turbo to spool faster this cant happen. 3076 and especially gtx series are more capable of producing power with minimum lag.

other factors play role for lag as well but the general rule says that bigger turbo more lag.

i started to build the exhaust manifold for front facing so i can take full advantage of loads of fresh cold air.

next step is to find injectors fuel pump . Looking for your suggestions.

the max safe power that 6bolt engine can produce is it 450ps?
 
It was intentionally mean. I very much dislike misinformation, and people shouldn't pass off conjecture and assumptions as facts. The physical science says the 3076 is a mismatch. All this means is that it spools slow and has poor transient response for it's flow capability. While it's not necessarily intuitive, if you dig into the science you'll discover how a larger turbine helps the 3076 compressor wheel. To simplify it, the turbine has to do a certain amount of work to get the compressor up to speed. Think of it like two waterwheels connected by a shaft. If you have one large waterwheel and one small one, you'd have to put a lot of effort into the small one to get the big one to spin. If you replace the small water wheel with one of similar size to the big one, the increased leverage allows you to spin the whole assembly easier. It's the same with compressors and turbines. If the turbine is a lot smaller than the compressor, it has very little leverage and has to do a lot of work to get the compressor up to speed. With a larger turbine, despite increased rotational mass, the turbine has to do less work to get the compressor up to speed and can maintain that speed much easier.

The link was provided above where the user on EvoM doesn't claim it, he proves it.
In your opinion, why does Garrett offer the 3076 then? Is it because they are incompetent? Serious question.
 
In your opinion, why does Garrett offer the 3076 then? Is it because they are incompetent? Serious question.

Because they have offered it for 15+ years now and a lot of people are under the impression that it's a good option (as seen in this thread). They used to offer an even worse turbo, the 3082, which was a 35r compressor wheel with a 30r turbine wheel. The thing was an absolute dog, but they sold them. The T3/T04E hybrid turbos are what started all the big compressor/small turbine hype, back when nobody thought it was even possible to spool a 42r with a four cylinder.

To be fair, it's gotten better with the GTX and GTX Gen II updates, as a more efficient compressor means the turbine has to do less work. Still not a good option when the 3576 is available.

They've continued the trend with the new G30-900.
 
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Mis match or not. It is still a viable and extremely potent turbo on our cars. It's spools quick for it's size and can still flow out the ass on the too end.

You are getting carried away in thinking it's inefficient. 20gs are obsolete but effective and can be build in many different sizes. Everybody's applications and goals are different.
 
*snip*
I’ve actually been in I4’s (sr20det’s) in the passenger seat for ridearounds.
Great turbo.

zilvia is littered with info on the 3076 and Garrett’s lineup. I’m well versed.. If you disagree, I don’t care. Lol. Doesn’t change facts. Everything I said was true. No misinformation.

*snip*

Edit: Couldn’t help myself. Read some of it. Idk where you’re getting the idea a 3576 and a 3076 spool the same. (The answer is no - they do not.) Only way I can think of that legit is a shift in the turbine housings. Small on 35. Large on 30. Then I would ask ? Why bother.

Did you like misread where I agreed with you on mismatch w/ turbine to compressor sizes.

Again. If going 35 frame (excluding the new g series), run the 82 compressor at a lower boost or something. Why the f*** would you run the 76 compressor on a 35 when the 30 turbine has been PROVEN (beat to death —> murdered) to handle the flow.

I totally get science. I also recognize real world results.
 
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Not reading all your bullsh*t dude. LOL.
I’ve actually been in I4’s (sr20det’s) in the passenger seat for ridearounds.
Great turbo.

zilvia is littered with info on the 3076 and Garrett’s lineup. I’m well versed.. If you disagree, I don’t care. Lol. Doesn’t change facts. Everything I said was true. No misinformation.

stop being a weiner dude.

Exit: Couldn’t help myself. Read some of it. Idk where you’re getting the idea a 3576 and a 3076 spool the same. (The answer is no - they do not.) Only way I can think of that legit is a shift in the turbine housings. Small on 35. Large on 30. Then I would ask ? Why bother.

Again. If going 35 frame (excluding the new g series), run the 82 compressor at a lower boost or something. Why the t*** would you run the 76 compressor on a 35 when the 30 turbine has been PROVEN (beat to death —> murdered) to handle the flow.

I totally get science. I also recognize real world results.

Click the link and get educated so you don't look like this big of an asshole again. Same car, same turbine housing, etc, etc, etc...

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/e...602163-gtx-showdown-gtx3076r-vs-gtx3576r.html
 
Read the first sentence. He stated he compensated with psig (boost pressure).
That is exactly what I was saying man. To a T. Lol.
What’s the disconnect?
 
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