19gsx91 said:

I'm running almost that exact setup, I think 950s+ would be more appropriate for me since I'm running 80% IDC on 850s when it was at 26psi.

Other then that yeah, FIC 850s, 1g BOV, Ebay MBC and no SD for me, otherwise that's my setup.

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What psi is it at currently? Out of curiosity, got a dyno sheet? (pump or e85? e85 I assume based off the IDC)

pump 93, I hit that IDC (high70s) when I was trying to tune it around 27psi with no knock since then I've turned it down to 24-25, let me look through and see if I have any recent WOT pulls lately, I have a boost leak I'm trying to get fixed so I haven't been tuning the past few days.

No dyno sheet, I gotta get it squared away then I'll talk to the guys over at STM to get my heart broken on the mustang dyno. I'm aiming for 350-375whp on an EvoIII/V168hta/bastard20g setup. 25ish PSI, quick spool, decent punch, decent gas mileage. Daily driven.

I'm actually about to start my car for the first time tomorrow and it currently has a 16g, bc 272, SBR FMIC, and SD. I have an HX35 with t3 housing and tubular manifold waiting. I've been thinking about just trading for an hta68. Thoughts?

Check some of the other 68hta threads about my opinons on it, I'm guessing you mean the v2 68hta.. It's gonna be a big step up from a 16g. Basically like going to a FP green, except it'll run a j pipe. The lag difference between the 16 - v2 68hta is immense.

19gsx91 said:

Check some of the other 68hta threads about my opinons on it, I'm guessing you mean the v2 68hta.. It's gonna be a big step up from a 16g. Basically like going to a FP green, except it'll run a j pipe. The lag difference between the 16 - v2 68hta is immense.

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Really? I wouldnt have thought that the lag would be much different.

800-1000RPM difference in my case. I do miss the 68hta on the highway or getting on it at higher speeds, but the 16g with cams in it right now is pretty unbelievable, 1.6-1.7 70-90 times.. I'm just kind of mad I'm not spinning the wheels as much in first since I installed the cams. I will be selling my v2 68hta shortly though, searching for a v1 or attempting to build a bastard 20g.

Vegas: There are 2 versions (v1 and v2 as they have been called here on tuners). V1 is literally an EVO III 16g with an upgraded billet compressor wheel (7cm2 turbine housing, standard td05h turbine wheel). V2 is a complete FP creation, using NO MHI parts. It has a larger turbine wheel and 8cm2 turbine housing. Spool difference is approx. 700 - 1000rpm later with the v2.

v1 was rated at 47 lbs / min
v2 is currently rated at 51 lbs / min

90laserRSfwd said:

Vegas: There are 2 versions (v1 and v2 as they have been called here on tuners). V1 is literally an EVO III 16g with an upgraded billet compressor wheel (7cm2 turbine housing, standard td05h turbine wheel). V2 is a complete FP creation, using NO MHI parts. It has a larger turbine wheel and 8cm2 turbine housing. Spool difference is approx. 700 - 1000rpm later with the v2.

v1 was rated at 47 lbs / min
v2 is currently rated at 51 lbs / min

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Wow, that'a a big difference. I'm reading the 500hp 16g thread, and I'm getting excited.

m_0ney_pit said:

Folks drive way more aggressively when I'm in the DSM. They must be thinking " woooo I see racecar I'm racecar too (2015 Honda Civic) must speed past this DSM". While your in your car driving safely and all you can do is sit back and say .

And remember what it was like to be like these people before the DSM and 16g days turned you into an ASE certified mechanic? We paid for our freedom with ticking lifters, crispy ISC motors, leaking everything and hard work. I'd do it all again going back in time.

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This...... My mitsubishi made me a better mechanic. My mazdaspeed miata made me a better driver. I will probably get another miata, and when I do it will be made a mazdaspeed clone (visually) but probably get a j35a4 swap. Honestly, you can't have a nice car and not have to put with idiots trying to race you.

But yeah, my DSMs made me a mechanic. Had I never owned a DSM, I may never have gotten quite as good with turning wrenches.

Not gonna lie, I don't miss my 16g at all
I have never been in a 16g car that impressed me, including my own. I ran it (on pump gas mind you) way past its limits 28-33+ psi, and the spool was great but the overall power was not impressive.

I'll take a "laggy" setup with a .55 a/r bullseye housing with a holset or borg warner s200 any day. I didn't buy and mod my dsms to make them into their "evo" equivalents, but that's my .02 cents. Yet, I still don't see myself ever getting a bigger turbo than 62-65 pounds per minute airflow, to me that is crazy fast for a street car.

You'll miss the 16g days when your $20K plus into your setup and still need another $5k - $10K just to finish the build, assuming nothing you already purchased breaks..

I'm not saying I miss the 400hp of a 16g, but being on a 42r / built motor and at the point of needed a built t case ($2,000) and PPG or other dogbox trans, LSD, and twin disc ($10,000). I miss the SIMPLICITY of the 16g days..

I always try to encourage people to stay close to stock and keep their set ups simple. They usually don't listen, fine by me.. I'd rather have a strong running 16g car than a 9 second car parted out on jack stands.

I can't say I miss the 16g days. I miss my early HX35 days. 25psi, 122mph traps, pound on it day in day out. It was really hard on tires with the open center diff. Mostly because it spend more time at WOT than just driving it.

As of right now my car is over 600whp and I drive it a lot still. It still drives good, and its not a pain. It doesn't over heat, the clutch isn't over the top, and it runs on cheap fuel. I only have barely plan ahead for fuel as it's on e85, but 2 seconds on the laptop and its ok. I don't drive it as much as I did, just because it doesn't make sense to waist it just running errands. Part of it is finding that balance between being able to drive it and going fast. It's a lot more work to keep a car driving like stock but run mid 10's than it is to run 10's in a gutted race car. My only complaints is that its loud, and the suspension sucks. I'm finishing up a new setup for the suspension so it will be much better soon.

My GGSX has a basically stock turbo setup on it minus a FMIC and a exhaust, I don't think its anymore driveable than my talon. It is quieter though, which I will be fixing.

^^^ And that. @90laserRSfwd is why I won't upgrade much beyond where I'm currently at. For a street car.. It just isn't necessary. Some people want more. need more. some people are doing that level of modification without a backup vehicle

More power = more breakage. I'll stay at the happy medium where I'm at.. Fast enough to walk away from SS Camaros and 5.0 mustangs (Remember when they used to be slow?) but not so much so that I'm worried about twisting axles or blowing transfer cases. I'll leave the high HP stuff to the guys that chase the 1/4 mile time and the dyno queens. What power I do have is usable where it matters.

Trying to hang with litre bikes (GSXR1000, r1, CBR1000RR, etc.) is where the fun is!! Of course, Joe B's (project goodwill, trapping over 140mph), could almost hang with a litre bike at half the money that's into my car. Getting that car inspected could be a challenge though

90laserRSfwd said:

You'll miss the 16g days when your $20K plus into your setup and still need another $5k - $10K just to finish the build, assuming nothing you already purchased breaks..

I'm not saying I miss the 400hp of a 16g, but being on a 42r / built motor and at the point of needed a built t case ($2,000) and PPG or other dogbox trans, LSD, and twin disc ($10,000). I miss the SIMPLICITY of the 16g days..

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Agreed. I had an 11-second 16g car... and it was damn near bulletproof. Beat the snot out of it for about 5 years. Got the itch for more, and put a GreenXL on it..... started breaking axles. then blew the headgasket. That wasn't because of the turbo, though. However, now I'm in the middle of a full out re-build, and I am now missing the simplicity that was the 16g.

I don't miss the old 16G days, and if I did, I'd simply slap one on my car.

People used simple setups back then because that's all there was. I'm grateful for the old bastards who figured out what worked and what didn't, and also for the advancement of parts and support for our platform.

That being said, I don't have any desire to be back in the good ole Evo 3 16g days. The recipe for a simple 16G car hasn't changed much. However, that recipe is much more potent present day thanks to better parts, greater support, and increased knowledge of the platform.

We can all reminisce about the good ole days, but lets be honest, ain't nobody trying to build a 20G drag car tuned on a MAF-T and SAFC just because they are about the good ole simple life

GST with PSI said:

I don't miss the old 16G days, and if I did, I'd simply slap one on my car.

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In all reality you aren't too terribly far away from a 16g as both 1837 (68hta) and 820 (that bastard 20g I covet quite a lot) aren't that far away in the family tree at all, both utilize the tdo5 housings and j-pipe setup.

I'm glad I'm too new to the DSM game to be familiar with the SAFC and MAFT setups, It's like trump supporters. I know they're out there but I never see them and I don't quite understand how they work(it's a joke gentlemen..). Back in the day I was all about tuning carburetors, didn't want to touch anything fuel injected.. oh how DSMs have tainted me.

6 of one, half a dozen of the other kinda thing .. It would be cool to see someone best Curt's EVO III 16g accomplishments, but I don't think that will 1) ever happen or 2) it'll be many years away.

For those who don't know who or what I'm reffering too, Curt (as in Curt Brown). Accomplishments, as in 499awhp and 10.3's at 133+mph. I don't know the exact quarter mile figures. I suppose that's off topic though, as that is the complete opposite of the "simple" 16g realm.

19gsx91 said:

In all reality you aren't too terribly far away from a 16g as both 1837 (68hta) and 820 (that bastard 20g I covet quite a lot) aren't that far away in the family tree at all, both utilize the tdo5 housings and j-pipe setup.

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Yep, MHI "type" stock frame turbos still get the job done even today. That's why I run them on my personal cars. These turbos were capable back then, and still are now. The only difference, is now we have much better options available to get the most out of these little snails.

I have no idea why I can't like your post. but in any event, That's exactly why I see no reason to deviate from the MHI "stock" frame setups.

Funny you mention Curt Brown, He was just posting on the ECMlink forums wanting to buy a legit 16g... So what he has planned I have no idea.

If anyone is interested, I emailed him a few days ago about his 500hp 16g setup and replied that he was using parts:

"JMF street (SMIM) and fp4r's
Gsc s2's work better
Used a ported evo3 O2"

Just in case anyone is interested. I may consider copying his setup for the hell of it. Although, I have no plans to get anywhere near his results...unless I have a 100 shot.

Can't wait to get this on my 14b car.

maft ain't that bad if you get it calibrated right, and using the 450cc base setting that everyone recommends will definitly make your car run like a pile of old smelly bloody fart garbage. Wrote a little article on it I need to post up to the how to section...

Maft definitly 'felt faster' but the mitsu mafs seem 'smoother' and less ' knocky'.

90laserRSfwd said:

I know this topic has been beat to death, but with all the experience we all have NOW (some 10 years later), IF you guys could go back and build a 16g setup all over again (let's just say starting with a decent stock car for this example), what mods would you chose using today's available parts..

I'll start...
ARP head studs with MLS gasket

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I won't claim to know everything, I will fill you in on my research. 1 don't use arp head studs on a 7bolt because they can cause the block to distort and the thrust bearing surface to become out of round. (some guys did a study I read that the block can have imperfections in the casting material causing this) 2 avoid light weight flywheels unless your goals are insane hp, I've read lots of feedback on the matter and it lends to potential harmonic imbalances as well as your car feeling gutless because of the lost inertia when you drop the clutch. 3 harmonic imbalance won't always kill an engine but the fact it could be ringing your block like a bell over and over and actually causing real damage over time makes me cringe stay away from under drive main pulley and if you understand harmonics run a fluidamper.

19gsx91 said:

WRXs are turbos. Just not horribly fast unless it's built like my cousins car, and even then, its not fast for long (bcuz subaru)

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Wrx's aren't turbos, the wrx sti is turbo, but many a Wrx's are just the subaru boxer sans turbo. And I don't even register a wrx non turbo as a competitor to a turbo dsm.

It's not that the guy driving a jacked up truck and the girl driving a civic wanting to race me that frustrates me, it's that they want to do it in the stupidest places. I mean call me out, let's take it down to the track sometime and make a night of it.. But don't mash on my dsm in the middle of town and then flash your hazards pumped up you beat my dsm when you can't comprehend how childish I see those actions.

I have to wonder, why getting track access is so difficult.. Where I live there's literally like 5weekends a year you can legally drag race.