Just from the playing I've done I really feel that you should have felt that thing lay over hard before it came apart if it was leaning out.

I don't know where your timing falls on your setup but 10* seems way conservative, like something would have to have been really wrong to cause that failure. If you were on stock parts and this happened it would be pretty easy to believe a rattle or two caused it. Man the abuse I but my first motor through with eagle rods, I had an intermittent msd failed that eventually put the hg out on all 4 at once. Didn't hurt the rods or bearings.

Anyway sorry for the story telling. 2 more questions?
1 what bearings were in this?
2 what did the other 3 egts do?
3 are the remains of the big end all blue?
4 what oil?

Damn mike sorry to hear that. I know your feeling all too well, which is one of the major reasons why I stopped with my evo and pursued my other vehicles.. over 4 years, chasing oiling issues, broken engines, exploded transmissions and stripped ring gears. Take a break, I have no doubt that you will be consumed by your greatest creation- Your Son. There is no greater feeling. If you need anything at all , I am but a meer phone call away.

My thoughts on this, there isn't significant "bluing " on the rods, to indicated loss of film strength at the bearing. Dare I say it, but it almost looks like a rod bolt failure caused by an undue spike in cylinder pressure.

Though I have no doubt that the fuel pressure had some effect in the failure, if possible it would be interesting to see what the shear point was on the rod bolts, prior to the carnage. Might not be the easiest thing to see given the level of sharpenel in the pan .

best of luck on the car and wishes for the holidays to your family.

+1 keep the car and never give up
-DSMreviver

Congrats on the baby.

Yeah im with bastarddsm on this one. it couldnt have been fuel or timing issues. Timing is low. E85 is very forgivable in low timing situations. High timing, lack of fuel, and big boost is one thing.

Sad to see the destruction. ONE thing I specifically like about ProEFI is the fuel calculations use fuel pressure. If pressure starts to drop, the ecu compensates IPW for the drop. Winter time will hopefully respark the fire for ya and you will be back at it next year. Good luck.

Detonation is a real possibility too at that much boost. I am surprise Haltech pletinum dont come with any kind of knock control considering how much they cost. So the ecu really cant retard the timing?

bastarddsm said:

Just from the playing I've done I really feel that you should have felt that thing lay over hard before it came apart if it was leaning out.

I don't know where your timing falls on your setup but 10* seems way conservative, like something would have to have been really wrong to cause that failure. If you were on stock parts and this happened it would be pretty easy to believe a rattle or two caused it. Man the abuse I but my first motor through with eagle rods, I had an intermittent msd failed that eventually put the hg out on all 4 at once. Didn't hurt the rods or bearings.

Anyway sorry for the story telling. 2 more questions?
1 what bearings were in this?
2 what did the other 3 egts do?
3 are the remains of the big end all blue?
4 what oil?

Click to expand...

When we had the car on the dyno, we had the car running up to 43psi and 10* timing. That definitely seems low, especially on E98 fuel. However, we made multiple pulls to test how much power would be gained with additional timing. At 12*, we made ONE more horsepower compared to 10*. Trust me, I couldn't believe it myself. So we left the timing at 10* to keep things happy.

Now, to answer your questions.

1. The bearings were ACL Race bearings.
2. I don't know what the other 3 were as the on-board log only had the #1. The Platinum ECUs only have 10 channels of logging without the laptop in the car. The new Elite boxes have 40.
3. I haven't pulled the pan to check the other three rods and pistons.
4. Valvoline VR-1 20W-50

antilag_200 said:

Damn mike sorry to hear that. I know your feeling all too well, which is one of the major reasons why I stopped with my evo and pursued my other vehicles.. over 4 years, chasing oiling issues, broken engines, exploded transmissions and stripped ring gears. Take a break, I have no doubt that you will be consumed by your greatest creation- Your Son. There is no greater feeling. If you need anything at all , I am but a meer phone call away.

My thoughts on this, there isn't significant "bluing " on the rods, to indicated loss of film strength at the bearing. Dare I say it, but it almost looks like a rod bolt failure caused by an undue spike in cylinder pressure.

Though I have no doubt that the fuel pressure had some effect in the failure, if possible it would be interesting to see what the shear point was on the rod bolts, prior to the carnage. Might not be the easiest thing to see given the level of sharpenel in the pan .

best of luck on the car and wishes for the holidays to your family.

Click to expand...

I didn't show it in the picture but the rods bolts snapped in the rod. The threads are still in the rod, sheared off. I haven't pulled the pan to find the cap yet, if it's even in there. A rod bolt could very well have failed due to the cylinder pressure increase after the fuel pressure dropped due to detonation or whatever. The AFR dropping to 14.0, like bastard said, may have only caused an increase in cylinder pressure and not caused the actual failure itself. These are all good hypotheses. They were ARP 2000 rod bolts and custom R&R 153mm steel I-beam rods.

DSMReviver said:

Detonation is a real possibility too at that much boost. I am surprise Haltech pletinum dont come with any kind of knock control considering how much they cost. So the ecu really cant retard the timing?

Click to expand...

This is the initial hypothesis we all came to at the track based on the data we had. It detonated and beat the bearing out of the rod. The idea with not have a knock sensor is that you have many other data types to log such as individual EGT, fuel pressure, oil pressure, oil temperature, individual widebands, etc. The assumption is that you have enough other data that knock sensing isn't necessary since reading plugs works very well also. So you tune based on all of that data, then you use the failsafes to catch issues with those data points and compensate somehow, i.e. pull timing, pull boost, kill the ignition, etc. In this case, the failsafes weren't activated so when the fuel pressure dropped, the ECU just kept everything as it was.

Man it just so weird not having a knock sensor when tuning or pull timing when shit hit the fans. I'm not sure if i like that. You pretty much have to be a tuning expert all the time to just drive your car and look at all the data and compensate it base on what you know. You will practically have to be a physicist almost and then set up the fail sales system. Ill probably blow the car up using Haltech for the first time . I wounder if ProEfi is the same thing.

When your kid comes why not just make it a street car, tone it down a little and occasionally hit the track. You'd probably get more pleasure out of it anyway's and give you time to really see if moving on is what you want.
But that's just my opinion, I've never really understood the whole dedicated drag car thing.

buhay6 said:

When your kid comes why not just make it a street car, tone it down a little and occasionally hit the track. You'd probably get more pleasure out of it anyway's and give you time to really see if moving on is what you want.
But that's just my opinion, I've never really understood the whole dedicated drag car thing.

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There's too much done to the chassis to go back to street car. There isn't a single piece of factory wiring anywhere in the car. Everything under the dash is gutted. There's more as well. This chassis is either a race car or scrap metal at this point. I have definitely considered leaving the car a dedicated race car but toning the setup down to a bracket or 10.50 index car and entering a local competitive series at my local tracks. Maybe a 2.3L with an HTA68 or FP3052 and my built automatic. The car would likely run mid-10s all day long. We'll see. The car can sit for now while I decide.

SonySlave said:

There's too much done to the chassis to go back to street car. There isn't a single piece of factory wiring anywhere in the car. Everything under the dash is gutted. There's more as well. This chassis is either a race car or scrap metal at this point. I have definitely considered leaving the car a dedicated race car but toning the setup down to a bracket or 10.50 index car and entering a local competitive series at my local tracks. Maybe a 2.3L with an HTA68 or FP3052 and my built automatic. The car would likely run mid-10s all day long. We'll see. The car can sit for now while I decide.

Click to expand...

That does sound like a pretty good plan thus far. I assume its a pretty nitch market which would make a hard sell.

I have that FP3582R you sold me for sale, you would have a consistent low 10/high 9 sec with that setup.

So, everyone, it has come time to let go of the DSM after 11 years. I have lost the motivation and passion that racing a DSM used to bring me. I just enjoy driving way too much to continue to spend $10k+ every single year and be left disappointed again and again. I am not a mechanic by trade; I am a computer nerd. I do not have the knowledge or tools to build my own engines/transmissions, etc. I have always just put the parts into the car or paid shops to do all of the work for me. It really just started becoming a hassle trying to rely on others to help me out. I even had issues with big shops not finishing stuff on-time and not really performing the work to the same standard as I had seen from them in the past, despite paying big money. I will always miss my 1G and the feeling I had when the car actually worked well. I haven't been able to enjoy driving in years and my DSM wasn't helping that being broken constantly. I just can't keep being left disappointed. I'll still be around the community forums and the Shootout, helping however I can. I'll just be driving a new car...

This is the new car... a 1997 Toyota Supra TT, 6-speed, Targa. I have fallen in love with this car since buying it last week. It is near stock and far slower than my 1G but I can enjoy it every single day. I just wanted a car I could enjoy all the time and I found it. Again, this isn't the last of me in the DSM community, I'll be around!

Sorry to hear this i was looking forward to watching you at the shootout this year, thats a very nice looking supra I'm sure you will enjoy it just as much they are a blast.

Only a matter of time before it becomes a race car

SonySlave said:

This is the new car... a 1997 Toyota Supra TT, 6-speed, Targa. I have fallen in love with this car since buying it last week. It is near stock and far slower than my 1G but I can enjoy it every single day

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Buddy of mine bought the identical car two summers ago right down to the color. His has a 67mm T04S Garrett on it and dynoed 508whp at 18psi on pump gas....it's a blast for sure.

Cant say I am happy hearing another DSM guy leaving, but I wont complain about the car, ( always gotta have love for a Supra ) maybe you could just build a simple 11 sec 2g and make the rounds like the Shootout , MOD etc etc .... I am also glad to hear that the Supra has brought back some auto passion, it never good to lose any of that passion, it is like family. Cars can come and go ( friends can come and go ) but the auto passion is most important ( Family is most important ) ....
Hope to see you around here .... was glad to meet you the Shootout,and always enjoyed watching your car make a pass " even thought it was a "junkomatic" ....

Nothing wrong with building multiple platforms.

You could always detune the dsm a bit and keep a fun 10 second street car as well.

Beautiful car, enjoy.

SomeGoFast said:

Sorry to hear this i was looking forward to watching you at the shootout this year, thats a very nice looking supra I'm sure you will enjoy it just as much they are a blast.

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Yeah, I'll miss the DSM. I'll always still be around to keep up with the great friendships I've made with people in the community. Plus, I still enjoy the Shootout and other events. The car has been a blast so far!

C'LO said:

Only a matter of time before it becomes a race car

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I am actually really not considering that for quite a while, if at all. I really want to enjoy a solid car that I don't have to worry about. I can just do maintenance and drive it. Maybe in a few years... Haha!

JusMX141 said:

Buddy of mine bought the identical car two summers ago right down to the color. His has a 67mm T04S Garrett on it and dynoed 508whp at 18psi on pump gas....it's a blast for sure.

Click to expand...

I really pondered keeping my BW 62mm from my 1G and putting that on there but I've decided against it for the time being. Like I said above, maybe in a few years.

OGDSM1989 said:

Cant say I am happy hearing another DSM guy leaving, but I wont complain about the car, ( always gotta have love for a Supra ) maybe you could just build a simple 11 sec 2g and make the rounds like the Shootout , MOD etc etc .... I am also glad to hear that the Supra has brought back some auto passion, it never good to lose any of that passion, it is like family. Cars can come and go ( friends can come and go ) but the auto passion is most important ( Family is most important ) ....
Hope to see you around here .... was glad to meet you the Shootout,and always enjoyed watching your car make a pass " even thought it was a "junkomatic" ....

Click to expand...

I appreciate the fact that you value our meeting. I really want to keep up the friendships I've made in the DSM community. I'll still be around the Shootout and other events. That won't change. We'll meet again, I'll just be driving a Supra instead!

91stocker said:

Nothing wrong with building multiple platforms.

You could always detune the dsm a bit and keep a fun 10 second street car as well.

Beautiful car, enjoy.

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There isn't anything wrong with it; that's true. It just isn't what I want to do for the foreseeable future. I've really been enjoying the car so far. To be honest, if my DSM wasn't so far gone toward race car and could be made streetable again, I would likely have done it, but it wasn't possible.

Sad news, nice Supra though. What do you plan on doing with the dsm?

Nice purchase...good luck with your new ride.

weasel1G said:

Sad news, nice Supra though. What do you plan on doing with the dsm?

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I have someone local that is interested in the whole car as-is. However, if that deal falls through then there will be a part out. I'd much rather sell it whole but that's tough to do as many aren't willing to spend that kind of money.

If you end up parting it out, I'm in the market for an AWD shell.

Ive always wanted a 94 turbo supra with t tops still want one, after my 70 charger restoration.

Yeah a Supra would be nice in a collection .... but I would still be after 2002 BMW M5 that has always been my "Unicorn" of a daily driver, but it cant be just a average M5, I spent around 2+ years looking for this 92 Talon and I will spend as long as it takes looking for the right M5.

iugrad92turbo said:

Ive always wanted a 94 turbo supra with t tops still want one, after my 70 charger restoration.

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Same here, but i went with a targa 6 speed c5 instead. Next is either a 70 chevelle or a 4th gen supra. The wife wants a chevelle so the supra will have to wait a bit longer haha. I love the 70 charger too though. Legit ride, you doing a full resto?