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How to convert a Ethanol DSM back to Gas with no knowledge?

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Robotech

Proven Member
148
14
Aug 28, 2014
Millers Falls, Massachusetts
I bought Phunny's 1999 GSX that he had tuned to run Ethanol (E85). I can't get this car to start, I think it is just bad ethanol since its sat for 3 months. However, when it did run, it ran like crap until it warmed up because of the Ethanol. I think I'll take the 100 hp hit and just return it back to pump gas, the problem is that I don't know a thing about it and Phunny vanished and won't answer me back. So I'm not the builder of this car, but I am now the owner of a car that I'd just assume deal with gasoline and not think about Ethanol atm.

So is there some knowledge base of how to go from ethanol back to gas? I'm a total newbie and wanted to buy a car I could just jump into and drive, and right now I can't even get it off of my lift.

This isn't your average car. This is a 2.3 stoker, FPBlack turbo, etc. I can send over the list of mods if it helps.

Thank you
David
 
I understand this. I heard that Ethanol requires you to put 40% more fuel into the system. The tuners won't take it with an empty tank and tune it to run pump gas, they want it mostly tuned and then they will fine tune it. However, Phunny won't talk to me, so I have no way of knowing if he has a regular gas map :-(
 
I understand this. I heard that Ethanol requires you to put 40% more fuel into the system. The tuners won't take it with an empty tank and tune it to run pump gas, they want it mostly tuned and then they will fine tune it. However, Phunny won't talk to me, so I have no way of knowing if he has a regular gas map :-(
Yeah its running link im assuming just go get a 5gal gas can filled and put it in after u get the e85 out and start a basic tune on the car forget his old tune its useless to you
 
A retune, also read some thread but forget the title. Was by one of our injector vendors where they mention propper maintenance of injectors running on e85 and how they clog up. Being it sat for that long might be something check up as well.
 
It has ECMLink and I've installed it on my computer. The problem is that I don't know what the baseline values should be for a gas car... I'm a newbie to tuning a car like this.[DOUBLEPOST=1411954670][/DOUBLEPOST]Interesting thought on the injectors, although sadly the cyclinder 1 and 4 are filling with fuel. The engine is trying to fire, but doesn't quite do it. Here's the video
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Depending on what injectors are in the car, they may be ruined. Ethanol draws water from the atmosphere, and can rust the inside of the injectors.

Get the serial number off the dsmlink chip in the ecu, and see if you can get a username on the dsmlink forums. There is also enough information on the dsmlink site to get a basetune for the car.

I never can stress enough that a highly modded car is never going to be a set it and forget it deal. It either takes some time, and know how to keep them running properly, or a very large wallet.[DOUBLEPOST=1411955223][/DOUBLEPOST]Most of the time injectors either leak, or stick open when they fail.
 
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Depending on what injectors are in the car, they may be ruined. Ethanol draws water from the atmosphere, and can rust the inside of the injectors.

Get the serial number off the dsmlink chip in the ecu, and see if you can get a username on the dsmlink forums. There is also enough information on the dsmlink site to get a basetune for the car.

I never can stress enough that a highly modded car is never going to be a set it and forget it deal. It either takes some time, and know how to keep them running properly, or a very large wallet.[DOUBLEPOST=1411955223][/DOUBLEPOST]Most of the time injectors either leak, or stick open when they fail.


Is there any way to know if your injectors are bad? like a test you can do? Also, can you clean them or send them somewhere to be rebuilt?[DOUBLEPOST=1411956656][/DOUBLEPOST]These are "Dynamic 2200CC injectors". They offer an inspection and cleaning service which I might have to use.[DOUBLEPOST=1411957737][/DOUBLEPOST]Here is a theory I had:
I changed the lifters using this procedure: http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/how-to-replace-lash-adjusters-lifters.265060/
The procedure calls to prime them completely with oil then drain it out completely (which makes no sense to me). What if the lifters aren't filling with oil? When the cam goes around would the valve actually open?
Although the cyclinders are filling with fuel which would indicate that the valve is opening..
 
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The bosch 2200cc injectors are particularly sensitive to sitting with e85 in them.

Why did you change the lifters?

If you don't get all the oil out of the lifters they can over extend and bend valves.
 
I have used a way to clean injectors but I'm not sure if its the correct way, although it worked well for me. I took a 3.7 volt wall plug for a cell phone, stripped the wires down to positive and negative. Then touch the leads to the connections on the injectors, the solenoid will move back and forth "hopefully" then spray carb cleaner through them to clean them. At least it's something to try if they need or can be cleaned.
 
The bosch 2200cc injectors are particularly sensitive to sitting with e85 in them.

Why did you change the lifters?

If you don't get all the oil out of the lifters they can over extend and bend valves.

This video will show you what I had for noises from the engine. The folks on this site said it sounded like lifter knock:
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I was very careful to get all of the oil out of them, although I still don't why it had me fill them with oil to just get it out again... :p[DOUBLEPOST=1411959783][/DOUBLEPOST]as a side note, when I was draining the oil I had the lifters on an aluminum table I have in my garage, the noise that a fully empty lifter makes on that table sounds exactly like this noise that you hear in the video
 
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You're more than likely dumping fuel in If the car was tuned on ethanol. I'm not saying the injectors aren't bad but I've left ethanol sit in my car for months (almost years) at a time more than once and have never seized an injector.

I'd start with something easy like adjusting the tune especially if the car wouldn't idle cold, i would assume it wasn't tuned fully and atleast look at the maps/ecu settings first before tearing the car apart.
 
Pull the injectors, clean them. Check the filter(s). Recalc the global fuel setting. Flush the fuel system and fill up with pump. Then open Link, turn down the boost, pull some timing and go see what she likes.
 
You're more than likely dumping fuel in If the car was tuned on ethanol. I'm not saying the injectors aren't bad but I've left ethanol sit in my car for months (almost years) at a time more than once and have never seized an injector.

I'd start with something easy like adjusting the tune especially if the car wouldn't idle cold, i would assume it wasn't tuned fully and atleast look at the maps/ecu settings first before tearing the car apart.

I'm not sure how to retune the car though. Are there any guides that are helpful online?[DOUBLEPOST=1412003441][/DOUBLEPOST]
Pull the injectors, clean them. Check the filter(s). Recalc the global fuel setting. Flush the fuel system and fill up with pump. Then open Link, turn down the boost, pull some timing and go see what she likes.

Thank you. I'll do this and a compression test to see if my valves are closing properly. How do you recommend I clean my injectors? Someone mentioned something about hooking up 3.7v to it which will activate the solenoid and then dump carb cleaner through it.
The information about turning down boost, pull timing, this is what i'm looking for since I really don't know. I assume I would want to turn down the injectors about 40% since I've read that ethanol takes about 40% more fuel?
 
If you're able to post a log on here, I can help make the adjustments to get it on the way to running pump.

Agree with others about pulling the injectors and have them flow tested/cleaned. Those injectors don't play nicely when sitting with E85 in them. They can either lock/seize up, which sometimes can be fixed, or they will start to rust internally. They also don't play well with E85 and can be a bit of a pain to tune, so maybe consider different injectors (FIC's new 1650's play nicely with all fuels and have stainless internals so as to not rust).
 
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