Hi, I am new to the DSM platform too, but have had my TALON TSI AWD for almost a year and I love it. I can answer SOME questions. If the motor is out, definately consider putting a perf clutch in but they set you back a little over $500. I LOVE my Southbend that I got from TMZ. Stock feel but much better holding power. Real PITA if you wait until the motor and trans is back in the car. If you get a bigger turbo, you will need bigger injectors so consider that. I battle oil leaks on mine, but I believe when I rebuild, (mine is out right now for a rod knock) if done right, oil leaks shouldn't be an issue but use GOOD GASKETS of OEM quality, NO EBAY gaskets! Also, no EBAY TURBO's. Head issues don't seem to be a problem and we (my son and I both have DSM's, 2 Talons, 2 Eclipses) have 5 engines at my place, maybe 6. No head problems other than valve guides and seals so check you guides and replace if necessary. They tend to wear and you might as well do it right. Check the throttle shaft for play, if it has any then it needs throttle shaft seals because you will have a boost leak there and most of us have to replace them. Can't answer any other questions, because I wouldn't be knowledgeable enough to give you good advice. I've built cars for 35 years but this is the first DSM, the rest were all SBC powered and I can do them with my eyes closed, but forced induction engines are a new thing with lots to consider. If you are planning any upgrades or performance stuff then I would suggest ECMLink so you have total control of tuning around the upgrades. It isn't economical either, also a little over 5 bills but you can do so much that it is probably the best thing a person can do with these. You literally talk to the ECU with a laptop and have so many things you can do with it. ECM tuning is a wonderful source. Read up on it and consider it. Do all the normal maintance, like ALL fluids changed (rear dif and transfer case for example) and use recommended fluids, REDLINE for example. You should consider a Wideband guage to monitor air fuel ratio's I(LC-2 from Inovate is what I run)and a good boost guage also. Usually they get mounted on the door pillar but there are other options. Thats all I can give you but there will be plenty others chime in and help you. Glad to have another Talon TSI AWD member! Welcome. Marty

Thanks for all the info!

I think you have some really good points here and I had better add some info so others chip in ideas too.


This is not going to be a horsepower monster, in fact i am perfectly happy with the stock 210 horsepower (if the car had it, which it does not) Ideally i would like to be around 250 or 275 at most.

This is just going to be a reliable daily driver with some performance fun. Why you might ask? Well I have a 2010 Evo X that is fully race built with tons of HP, so that's dog that gets beat when I have a need for speed

This talon is going to be clean, reliable and comfortable.

With that said, I am not sure I need a bigger turbo. Will the stock turbo put out 250hp with a few simple mods? Or is it worthless and i should upgrade no matter what?

So you think the perf clutch was a big win huh? Would a lighter flywheel be worth it as well?

And I do want the best gaskets - should i stick with OEM or is there some amazing aftermarket brand?

Are big brake kits worth it? Or is there a stock fitment brake kit that rocks?

thanks guys!

There are many problems with these cars unfortunately and the fact that they are pushing 20 years old only makes it worse. Major problems are weak transmission, crap thrust bearings in the 2Ga's and early 2Gb's, poorly designed suspension, inefficient head design, and for some reason get wrecked all the time (a joke). Overall a pretty poorly designed car, but with some effort, know-how, and money is a solid platform to build on. Overall you have to decide what you want this car for. As a daily driver, keeping it stock is best as putting even a little extra power into it you will start to see the issues come out. The transmission starts to fail first with 250+ hp, the rings will start to go when you start pushing the boost, and your thrust bearings are probably already halfway gone. Oh and your suspension parts are already probably rust welded in.

If you plan to keep it around factory hp, keep the factory clutch. It can handle its 200hp just fine and upgrading will only start adding drivability issues (ever driven a twin plate clutch or a 6 puck, its grabby as f**k), plus just be money spent that you will need for improving some other things.

Your stock turbo is fine (assuming your seals are still good) for a DD, but if you want to get a few extra hp out of it easy and make it fun, just throw an intake and exhaust on for better breathing, then a manual boost controller and turn the boost up a few psi. Also get that boost leak under control. You can get away with a slightly larger turbo, but know that the more boost you push, the faster you're going to destroy your engine. It's no 2JZ Supra engine with factory forged rods and crank.

Crank walk is easy. You can check your Crankshaft's endplay. if you can grab the crank by the pulley and push and pull the crank back and forth in the cradle then you are probably already out. if that is the case pull the pan and check it with a feeler gauge. it should be between 0.002" and 0.007". There isn't any way to really prevent it other than get new thrust bearings, and then there may still be a chance of it happening again. You can throw some King or Clevit bearings in and hope for the best (after checking your crank tolerances of course). Or you can do what a lot of other people do and switch to either a 1G block or a 4G64 block. If your endplay is all good then enjoy it while you can and worry about it later. It may not even happen to yours.

2G heads have smaller ports than the 1G so it is not an ideal design. It will work for a DD but if you plan to make some hp, you will want to either put a 1G on or port out your 2G. They crack as much as any other aluminum head. Don't overheat it and you will be fine. Just check your seals for leaks. If none then let them be.

Oil leaking is inevitable with time. No real way to prevent it. Just replace the seals. It's old enough they are probably already leaking. check your front case and rear main seals for sure.

The best way to keep reliability is just like sex...abstinence. If you let it be it will be more reliable then changing things up. If anything needs replaced try and replace it with factory parts as they are made to tighter tolerances then anything aftermarket. At this point in your car's life, and the fact that you want a daily driver (and assuming you don't want to dump a ton of money into it) give it a solid tune up and replace any worn out gaskets and seals and drive on.

mjtnismo = that is kinda what I was hoping to do. I don't want to dump a ton of cash or power into this thing. Hell, half the time my wife will be driving it.

Thanks for the great explanations on crank walk and build tolerances. I think i will keep it simple.

Do you know much about the transmission? It seemed to run fine when I drive the car a while back.

Should I have it rebuilt since its out of the car now? (car has 130000 miles on it, and i have no idea if any work has been done to the tranny)

Check the clutch while it is out, it may be pretty worn from awd launches. Make sure your flywheel and pressure plate are in good order as well. If you have to replace it, use oem or a light performance clutch (your wife will appreciate oem). Definitely change out the gear oil. If it shifts well and doesn't make any abnormal noises then the transmission itself is probably ok. Then again i hear a lot of people tearing them open and finding welded together parts from someone trying to do a quick fix. If the gear oil is full of metal shavings/particles then definitely check it out inside. Chances are though if the engine is lightly modded or not at all then your transmission is probably ok.

I'd literally disregard everything mjtnismo has stated. Sorry, I don't have time to go into particulars but it's full of misinformation and plain incorrect. Listen to 1990TSI, much better info there.

Checking crank walk with a feeler gauge? Huh?

The proper way would be with a dial indicator checking for axial play.

RenleyX said:

mjtnismo = that is kinda what I was hoping to do. I don't want to dump a ton of cash or power into this thing. Hell, half the time my wife will be driving it.

Thanks for the great explanations on crank walk and build tolerances. I think i will keep it simple.

Do you know much about the transmission? It seemed to run fine when I drive the car a while back.

Should I have it rebuilt since its out of the car now? (car has 130000 miles on it, and i have no idea if any work has been done to the tranny)

Click to expand...

I have a snaking suspicion that this car is 100% stock aside from a k&n filter and a 3" turbo back pipe.

I wont know for sure until i get into the engine this weekend but = based on the wear and tear this car has, it looks like it was kept as a sweet 16 girls car that she kept for 10 years or so then sold.

What makes me think this?
- the car was black originally, and it was macco painted bright purple
- taking out the interior the car was kept clean, neat tidy and full of hair clips, lip gloss and the like.
- the car had a 'small' stereo upgrade (tiny underseat amp, single small sub, aftermarket deck and door/backseat speakers. But nothing too crazy, just the kind of thing I installed a 1000 of when working at Soundtrack when fathers would come in to buy a gift for their daughters.
- the engine looks like it's never been touched other than light maintenance.
- the clutch worked great, so did the brakes and the parking brake
- it has power everything, seats, windows, sunroof, sideview mirrors, rear view mirror, etc etc etc...
- simple + nice, but not performance, chrome wheels

just a guess though... [DOUBLEPOST=1408393211][/DOUBLEPOST]

craig4g63 said:

I'd literally disregard everything mjtnismo has stated. Sorry, I don't have time to go into particulars but it's full of misinformation and plain incorrect. Listen to 1990TSI, much better info there.

Checking crank walk with a feeler gauge? Huh?

The proper way would be with a dial indicator checking for axial play.

Click to expand...

When you do have time, can you go into specifics please? I am hoping to do all this only once and not have to touch it again for a long time...

thanks guys!

craig4g63 said:

I'd literally disregard everything mjtnismo has stated. Sorry, I don't have time to go into particulars but it's full of misinformation and plain incorrect. Listen to 1990TSI, much better info there.

Checking crank walk with a feeler gauge? Huh?

The proper way would be with a dial indicator checking for axial play.

Click to expand...

Yes please do go into particulars. You can use a feeler gauge to check thrust bearing play. Chances are RenleyX has a set of feeler gauges sitting around vs a dial indicator with magnetic base. The test is slightly different. The end result is the same.

Nothing 1990TSI said is incorrect either, but since you have repeatedly stated you want this as a daily driver, in the end it's your decision on whether you want to spend a little money to make it reliable, like it was from the factory, or a lot more to make it faster and start stressing your 15-20 year old factory parts designed to withstand 210hp.

As for your brakes (then again take this lightly since I'm plain incorrect and spreading misinformation) most big brake kits are going to run you in the thousands for just the front or rear alone. Since you aren't planning to race this or push it much past factory spec, don't bother, as they would be overkill (unless you just want the look). If you want some solid performers for a bit cheaper go with the EVO Brembos swap. There is a guy "Lovinboost" that sells bracket adapters for the front knuckles (rears are direct bolt on) and with a little modification to the calipers this will be a cheap swap vs finding and buying $500 galant knuckles. For your performance goals you might want to just stick with some good slotted rotors (drilled rotors tend to crack) and metallic pads. There is also Powerslot big brake upgrades where they give you a bigger rotor and an adapter that pushes your factory brakes out further to accommodate them. Just out of curiosity what is the production date of your TSi? The 1994 production 2G's actually came with vented rear rotors which is pretty rare.[DOUBLEPOST=1408400162][/DOUBLEPOST]

mjtnismo said:

Yes please do go into particulars. You can use a feeler gauge to check thrust bearing play. Chances are RenleyX has a set of feeler gauges sitting around vs a dial indicator with magnetic base. The test is slightly different. The end result is the same.

Nothing 1990TSI said is incorrect either, but since you have repeatedly stated you want this as a daily driver, in the end it's your decision on whether you want to spend a little money to make it reliable, like it was from the factory, or a lot more to make it faster and start stressing your 15-20 year old factory parts designed to withstand 210hp.

As for your brakes (then again take this lightly since I'm plain incorrect and spreading misinformation) most big brake kits are going to run you in the thousands for just the front or rear alone. Since you aren't planning to race this or push it much past factory spec, don't bother, as they would be overkill (unless you just want the look). If you want some solid performers for a bit cheaper go with the EVO Brembos swap. There is a guy "Lovinboost" that sells bracket adapters for the front knuckles (rears are direct bolt on) and with a little modification to the calipers this will be a cheap swap vs finding and buying $500 galant knuckles. For your performance goals you might want to just stick with some good slotted rotors (drilled rotors tend to crack) and metallic pads. There is also Powerslot big brake upgrades where they give you a bigger rotor and an adapter that pushes your factory brakes out further to accommodate them. Just out of curiosity what is the production date of your TSi? The 1994 production 2G's actually came with vented rear rotors which is pretty rare.

Click to expand...

*update - well I'll be damned, he was right, I am wrong. The 2JZ-GTE came with a forged crank and pistons from the factory, not connecting rods. Sorry, it's been 10 years since I worked for Toyota. My apologies.*

You know, I am not sure the production date... where might I find that? On the inside door info sticker or just as a part of looking up the VIN code ?

Although, i can just take a look at the rear rotors when i get home to see if they are vented.

And I would be interested in knowing more about the evo brake rotor swap. I may not do this right away BUT - my evo is track built, and the brake calipers and rotors are in need of upgrade (for which I am willing to spend a little dough for)

So if there is a easy/cheap way to use by evo X brembos + rotors on the talon then great!

Keep em coming guys! I am making some notes and adding some links to my prep work for when i start rebuilding the engine (to whatever degree that ends up being)

http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/diy-install-evo-brakes-brembo-on-2g.260580/

http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/evo-8-10-brembo-calipers-dsm-conversion-for-1g-too.364435/

Pretty good info and yes it will definitely save you some cash to re-use your evo's brakes.

The production date can be found on the driver side door jamb.