Timing alignment first timer

chasedardis · Jul 7, 2013

I have read all the vfaq and searched the site I just trying to get conformation if my cam sprocket timing marks are ok or out of spec. I have pictures to help any response will be helpful the gap on the tension is in speck and it been over 15 minutes. This is my first time doing timing on this motor so i just want to be sure.

Dsmkauai · Jul 7, 2013

Is the first picture upsidown? And your cams are off bro! If the first picture is not upsidown than you arnt on the crank timing mark. Cam timing marks should make a perfect straight line with the motor, when cam is lined up correct, number 1 cylinder will be tdc (top dead center) and the cams if on the right stroke will line up perfect, use the valve cover as the straight line to follow.

DSM1G90 · Jul 7, 2013

You don't have the autoadjuster set correctly is why the cam marks are not in alignment.

These two marks had to be dead straight across from one another. No second guessing.

Crank sprocket mark is dead on.

chasedardis · Jul 7, 2013

the bottom pic is not upside down heres a better picture.

Dsmkauai · Jul 7, 2013

Ok crank is good, cams are slightly off, a tooth off between intake and exhaust. They should be perfectly straight across.

You need to get either the plastic cam tool or take 2 17mm wrenches loosen the timing belt and pull both the wrenches toward eachother a bit. Then use zip ties to hold the wrenches and once you get the belt on the cams use big clips to hold the belt in place on the cams. The wrap the belt around the oil pump than crank pulley than adjuster pulley, then is time to set the tension.

chasedardis · Jul 7, 2013

Im going to go to the store tomorrow and get a tap and long enough bolt to use as the special tool to depress the autotensioner to help myself out and i did do it the way you explained. Thanks for your help i just need to do it again. Should i try spinning the motor a few more times before i take it apart to see if the cams line up first.

Dsmkauai · Jul 7, 2013

You could try its not far enough off to hurt anything. How did it feel turning it after you set the timing and how many rotations did you do? And if you own a dsm you should own these tools, a well worth investment. Jay Racing Timing Belt Tools Kit [TBTS] - $50.00 : Jay Racing

DSM1G90 · Jul 7, 2013

A lot easier and cheaper method:

Get a length of 8mm rod and two 13mm nuts.

Cut the rod to a foot in length and the two nuts thread on the rod at the end. then, with 13mm wrenches, jam the two nuts together so then one can place a 13mm socket on the end.

Makes a great little adjuster compression tool and the 13mm socket wrench on the end really works in getting the required gap space in correctly.

To adjust the pulley: I used an allen wrench placed in one hole and a socket that fits the pinch bolt on the pulley. Allen wrench in the hole can pivot around the socket to get the required gap for the autoadjuster before pulling the grenade pin.

-DSM

chasedardis · Jul 7, 2013

i believe in that picture it is spun 8 times. i have the tool for the pulley tensioniner but not the long bolt t just cheaper to make it by tap that hole in the mount and using a bolt to adjust and compress. Thanks for the quick response.

pauleyman · Jul 7, 2013

I have a few questions. Why are you tapping that mount hole? It's already tapped. Also those are not 2g cam gears, is this a swapped car? You do realize the threaded rod doesn't work on a 1g to 2g swap? why is everybody saying the cam gears are off They look dead on to me. If all marks line up AND the tensioner spec is correct AFTER the motor has been turned at least 6 times the job is done. I've got a thread on this somewhere. I've done countless timing belts over 20 years. This isn't a hard job. There are no wishy washy things in my opinion. Everything is very very objective. It either IS right or it is NOT right. There is no guess work, no grey area, no maybe. nothing. It's very very very easy to tell if the marks are lined up or not.

Dsmkauai · Jul 7, 2013

^^ than how can you not see that the cam marks are slightly off? If those cam marks look dead on to you, than im glad ive never had you work on my stuff. Once all marks are aligned the cam marks should be straight across. Not almost or close, but perfectly straight. If its not than it needs to be retimed and the cam gears held in place better. Also sure it isn't a hard job for those of use that have done it a million times. But for someone new at it that has never done it before, there are lots of things that can go wrong. And to say there are no grey areas, its easy LOL

. You must not work on interference motors very much!! To a noob timing belt arnt easy bro, there are so many things that can be messed up. Instead of acting like a hot shot Mitsu tech that knows it all, maybe you should give advise and be helpful! You obviously haven't been on this forum long enough to see the probably hundreds of did I do my timing right threads or I think I screwed my timing job up!! http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/art...l-installing-timing-timing-belt-6bolt-2g.html

chasedardis · Jul 7, 2013

its a 6bolt swapped 2g

I am going to tap the engine mount to get my own bolt throw it because i dont have the special tool and would rather spend 5 bucks making it and not having to wait for it to get shipped here.

Resolved, I spun the engine 4 more times and checked it and everything was staright from there. Then spun it another 6 times and it was straight again and my tensioner is in spec. Thanks for the piece of mind.

pauleyman · Jul 7, 2013

I didnt say the job wasnt tedious. It just isnt difficult. I post in these threads to help newbs. A quick search would point to some of my writeups and others as well. Op did well. Do not infer arrogance in a post when you dont know me. I may be blunt but im far from arrogant.

rlacasse1 · Jul 7, 2013

Dsmkauai said:
^^ than how can you not see that the cam marks are slightly off? If those cam marks look dead on to you, than im glad ive never had you work on my stuff. Once all marks are aligned the cam marks should be straight across. Not almost or close, but perfectly straight. If its not than it needs to be retimed and the cam gears held in place better. Also sure it isn't a hard job for those of use that have done it a million times. But for someone new at it that has never done it before, there are lots of things that can go wrong. And to say there are no grey areas, its easy . You must not work on interference motors very much!! To a noob timing belt arnt easy bro, there are so many things that can be messed up. Instead of acting like a hot shot Mitsu tech that knows it all, maybe you should give advise and be helpful! You obviously haven't been on this forum long enough to see the probably hundreds of did I do my timing right threads or I think I screwed my timing job up!! http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/art...l-installing-timing-timing-belt-6bolt-2g.html

That is the best the cams will get.

If the OP tries to move them a tooth in either direction then he will throw the marks off further than they are right now.

I've done quite a few timing jobs on DSMs that I've had and have never seen the cams line up "perfectly". They are always off, a tiny bit, like a quarter of a tooth maybe.

Dsmkauai · Jul 7, 2013

Whatever you guys say, changing the spark plugs to most people isn't difficult on a dsm! But to say doing timing isn't is just wrong and can get a newb in alot of trouble if not carful. When I do my timing its always dead on perfect, this is why I do my own cars, and don't let people touch my cars that think close is ok. It's timing on a interference motor not adding colorful vac lines or bolting on a big ugly wing on the back. If its off than its off plane and simple and something during the process wasn't done correctly. O.p. take your time make sure everything lines up correct the way its supposed to and you won't have any problems. Or you can get it kinda close or maybe almost right and see how long the car last you, your choice.

rlacasse1 · Jul 7, 2013

Dsmkauai said:
Whatever you guys say, changing the spark plugs to most people isn't difficult on a dsm! But to say doing timing isn't is just wrong and can get a newb in alot of trouble if not carful. When I do my timing its always dead on perfect, this is why I do my own cars, and don't let people touch my cars that think close is ok. It's timing on a interference motor not adding colorful vac lines or bolting on a big ugly wing on the back. If its off than its off plane and simple and something during the process wasn't done correctly. O.p. take your time make sure everything lines up correct the way its supposed to and you won't have any problems. Or you can get it kinda close or maybe almost right and see how long the car last you, your choice.

I'm well aware that it's an interference engine, and that it's a tough job, especially for a first-timer.

But the fact of the matter is if your marks are "perfectly" lined up once you turn it over by hand a few times, then you are getting better belts than the rest of us. Typically they are something along the lines of the edges of the marks lining up.

Also, in the first pic, I'm pretty sure it just looks off because he is taking the pic from an angle looking down on the marks. At least that's why they look lower than the top of the head.

chasedardis · Jul 8, 2013

Yes the angle in the first pic is pretty bad but I did end up getting the cams to line up straight with the crank as far as I can tell( the arrow on the block I think should be a little more accurate). I'm using a gates racing belt. If I were near home I would take pics but I won't be home for 3 days now so hopefully I remember to get pics before I put the cover on and put it back in the car.

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