thrust bearing

TSITurbo95 · Dec 22, 2009

Ok, so the cause of crank walk is when the thrust bearing moves correct? Couldent you just replace the bearing that "walks" and solve the issue/possibility of getting it?

nyTalonTsi · Dec 22, 2009

Yes you could replace the thrust bearing. It will reduce the chance.

But measure your crankend play.

And if you have not done so disable your clutch safety switch. And only use the clutch when you need to, ie. leave your foot off the clutch till the light turns green.

These two things will got a long way.

LiquidX · Dec 22, 2009

There are a lot of issues that affect crank walk and truthfully, no one fully knows why it happens more often on the 7 bolt than the 6 bolt. It's capable on every enging out there and the split thrust bearing design on the 97-99 motor had less issues. Most out there with a walked block will scrap the block and just get a new one because even if you rebuild, it'll always have that chance to walk again wether it's 50 miles later or 20k later. You can take the risk to do it or you can just go 6 bolt and not worry as much about it.

Some people claim it's just thrust desing and others claim differently. There is also this for the "crankwalk cure" http://www.machv.com/conracmbcadk.html.

TSITurbo95 · Dec 23, 2009

Ah, I am just worried as I have a 7 bolt with 74k original miles, and have disabled the clutch safety, and only use it when I need to, as I dont want to put a new engine in it yet. Ok thanks.

JusMX141 · Dec 23, 2009

You need not worry. My buddy's '95 TSi AWD has 139k on the stock 7-bolt, and it's had a hard life with over 250 passes down the track ever since he picked it up with 99k on the clock.

Redwidow · Dec 23, 2009

Ill Give you guys my reason that I believe crank walk happens on 7 bolts.
First, Yes it is possible on ANY engine, but the reason I believe it happens on the 2G 7 bolts has nothing to do with the motor or the thrust bearing but in fact has to do with the clutch pedal assembly itself. Here is why.
On the 2G cars, the clutch pedal assembly is weak and is more likely to become out of adjustment a lot easier than others. Therefore when it does come out of adjustment, you do not notice because of the time period it is over. But when it is out of adjustment and you have released the clutch pedal, it actually leaves a couple pounds of pressure on the clutch causing it to push the crank in against the thrust bearing. Then the oil takes the easier route and goes around to the front side of the thrust bearing, leaving the other side lacking oil. Over a period of time the causes the bearing to eventually go out and sometimes the crank wears into the block. This is also supported by the fact the the thrust bearing that goes out is always on the back side (Clutch Side) of the block. I also believe they are less likely on the later models (97-99) because of an improvement in the clutch pedal assembly.
So Personally I do not think that it has anything to do with the fact that its a 7 bolt but that its actually the clutch pedal assembly's fault.
What do you guys think?

JusMX141 · Dec 23, 2009

Redwidow said:
So Personally I do not think that it has anything to do with the fact that its a 7 bolt but that its actually the clutch pedal assembly's fault.
What do you guys think?

Makes sense- explains why 1G 7-bolts almost never walk.

Not enough hard evidence to say this is the real reason, though.

GSTTOBEAT · Dec 23, 2009

My experiences with crankwalk have been do to high pressure clutch pressure plates. They put an excessive load on the crankshaft. Then before the clutch was change I had the engine rebuilt. The machine shop did something wrong and the engine walked on first start up. It could have been something they did or it was just time for that engine to need a leash. There are a lot of causes for this condition I believe. It's kind of like luck of the draw. Sure you can always replace the thrust bearing but it is a temporary fix for a permanent problem. I would rather just switch to a 6 bolt block and not worry about it as much. Has anybody ever had a crankwalk issue with an Eagle crankshaft or equivalent?

ziggo0 · Dec 23, 2009

GSTTOBEAT said:
My experiences with crankwalk have been do to high pressure clutch pressure plates. They put an excessive load on the crankshaft. Then before the clutch was change I had the engine rebuilt. The machine shop did something wrong and the engine walked on first start up. It could have been something they did or it was just time for that engine to need a leash. There are a lot of causes for this condition I believe. It's kind of like luck of the draw. Sure you can always replace the thrust bearing but it is a temporary fix for a permanent problem. I would rather just switch to a 6 bolt block and not worry about it as much. Has anybody ever had a crankwalk issue with an Eagle crankshaft or equivalent?

I'd agree. A buddy of mine built a motor and it was all within spec except for excessive crank in-out play, still running 45k miles later and he has a 2300lbs pressure plate. And the opposite side of that, friend with a 7 bolt built up to be a track star, WELL within factory spec, hardly any in-out - blew within 1k miles running a 2900lbs pressure plate. Upon disassemble we found crank play to be well over service limit.

TSITurbo95 · Dec 23, 2009

With my new turbo setup, I need a good aftermarket clutch, I was going with the Act 2600, is this a good upgrade? It is a daily driven car too. And again, trying to avoid crankwalk.

95talongirl · Dec 23, 2009

With the mileage on your car, i'd say you are ok. I have an ACT 2100 on mine... the engine has around 50k it since it was rebuilt @ 126,000 miles. I'm not a huge fan of ACT, tho. Why? Well, I had the pressure plate break apart (fingers broke off) with only 8000 miles on the clutch. This is one a stock car, too! I think I am going with Exedy for the next clutch. I've herd some decent reviews about them.

As far as the crankwalk thing, I believe that it was made into a much larger deal than it needed to be. Soon everything was blamed on "crankwalk." I'd say it probably has something to do with the design of the thrust bearing, like mentioned above, or oil squirters; as i believe those were redesigned in the later 2g cars and thus into the EVO 8.

TSITurbo95 · Dec 23, 2009

Ok, gotcha. Thanks to everyone for the replies, I learned a lot about crankwalk and how/why it happens. I appreciate everyone's replies. I have heard/looked up reviews about clutches, but I figured why not ask fellow dsmers. What is a good clutch to go with. With my stock turbo I dynoed 242 AWHP (have the sheet somewhere), and I have a new Evo3 Big16G sitting next to me getting ready to be put on. Obviously I am going to have more hp with this turbo. What turbo would be good for my setup? I am looking for about 350-375 AWHP. Also note my cars engine has all stock internals.

95talongirl · Dec 23, 2009

This is for Exedy, but you can use the same logic and apply it to other brand clutches.
http://www.exedyusa.com/documents/How to properly choose a sports.pdf

If you were to go with Exedy, I'd say their "stage 2" would be good for what you want. ACT, probably a 2600.

Maroon4g · Sep 23, 2012

Redwidow said:
Ill Give you guys my reason that I believe crank walk happens on 7 bolts.
First, Yes it is possible on ANY engine, but the reason I believe it happens on the 2G 7 bolts has nothing to do with the motor or the thrust bearing but in fact has to do with the clutch pedal assembly itself. Here is why.
On the 2G cars, the clutch pedal assembly is weak and is more likely to become out of adjustment a lot easier than others. Therefore when it does come out of adjustment, you do not notice because of the time period it is over. But when it is out of adjustment and you have released the clutch pedal, it actually leaves a couple pounds of pressure on the clutch causing it to push the crank in against the thrust bearing. Then the oil takes the easier route and goes around to the front side of the thrust bearing, leaving the other side lacking oil. Over a period of time the causes the bearing to eventually go out and sometimes the crank wears into the block. This is also supported by the fact the the thrust bearing that goes out is always on the back side (Clutch Side) of the block. I also believe they are less likely on the later models (97-99) because of an improvement in the clutch pedal assembly.
So Personally I do not think that it has anything to do with the fact that its a 7 bolt but that its actually the clutch pedal assembly's fault.
What do you guys think?

Makes plenty since to me, it explains why alot of people who experienced crankwalk after installing performance pressure plates. It also explains why clutch pedal adjustment is so important...maybe you hit it on the head there, who knows wish we could test that theory.

donniekak · Sep 23, 2012

I have checked a few crankwalked blocks, and this is what I have found. In the blocks with failed thrusts, the thrust surface on the block/girdle isn't perpendicular to the crankshaft centerline. This causes a high spot in the thrust bearing, that can make contact with the crank. It's like having a rod/main bearing housing that isn't round.

Talon virgin · Oct 25, 2012

I'm glad I found this thread it details possible causes of crankwalk...

But how can you actually tell w/o doing a teardown of the engine?
What are the most common symptoms of crankwalk?

JusMX141 · Oct 25, 2012

You have a 90....you have nothing to worry about.

Talon virgin · Oct 26, 2012

The question wasn't just for me, though I was looking at getting a 2g sometime in the near future.
Its for anyone, especially those with a 2g.
If they have an issue it would be good to know what some symptoms would be in order to diagnose it properly.

Lemony · Apr 22, 2013

Hate to bring this thread back from the dead, but I'm new to DSM's. I've searched for the actual symptoms of crankwalk but the only thing I come accross is people saying that turning left while the clutch is depressed makes the clutch pedal go limp. My car doesn't do that, but sometimes it bucks and shudders while I let off of the clutch in first gear slowly. Is this a possible sign of crankwalk? And also while in like 3rd rolling if I punch the gas it shudders a few times when I hit boost. I have a 95 GST with like 157k miles. Just looking for someone that has actually experianced crankwalk to explain ALL of the symptoms. I was thinking along the lines of clutch slippage but this whole crankwalk thing has got me paranoid.

little-razcal · Apr 23, 2013

Lemony said:
Hate to bring this thread back from the dead, but I'm new to DSM's. I've searched for the actual symptoms of crankwalk but the only thing I come accross is people saying that turning left while the clutch is depressed makes the clutch pedal go limp. My car doesn't do that, but sometimes it bucks and shudders while I let off of the clutch in first gear slowly. Is this a possible sign of crankwalk? And also while in like 3rd rolling if I punch the gas it shudders a few times when I hit boost. I have a 95 GST with like 157k miles. Just looking for someone that has actually experianced crankwalk to explain ALL of the symptoms. I was thinking along the lines of clutch slippage but this whole crankwalk thing has got me paranoid.[/

With 150,000+ miles on your car, you would of walked a long time ago if that was the case. Crankwalk is overrated and nothing for you to worry about. It sounds like your experiencing something ether drivetrain component related, tune/tuneup related, or both. It's definitely not crank walk, so get that out of your head and start looking elsewhere. Sounds like a tune/tune-up issue to me though. How long has it been since its bad new wires and plugs? That may go a long way just by themselves.

Lemony · Apr 23, 2013

little-razcal said:
Lemony said:
Hate to bring this thread back from the dead, but I'm new to DSM's. I've searched for the actual symptoms of crankwalk but the only thing I come accross is people saying that turning left while the clutch is depressed makes the clutch pedal go limp. My car doesn't do that, but sometimes it bucks and shudders while I let off of the clutch in first gear slowly. Is this a possible sign of crankwalk? And also while in like 3rd rolling if I punch the gas it shudders a few times when I hit boost. I have a 95 GST with like 157k miles. Just looking for someone that has actually experianced crankwalk to explain ALL of the symptoms. I was thinking along the lines of clutch slippage but this whole crankwalk thing has got me paranoid.[/

With 150,000+ miles on your car, you would of walked a long time ago if that was the case. Crankwalk is overrated and nothing for you to worry about. It sounds like your experiencing something ether drivetrain component related, tune/tuneup related, or both. It's definitely not crank walk, so get that out of your head and start looking elsewhere. Sounds like a tune/tune-up issue to me though. How long has it been since its bad new wires and plugs? That may go a long way just by themselves.
Click to expand...

I was thinking along the lines of something drivetrain related as well. I looked at my ball joints on the front and the lower is pretty much blown; so looks like I'll be ordering some new control arms in the near future. I believe the plugs and wires were changed by the last owner about a year ago, but they're bosch platinums :x, so maybe I should throw some NGK coppers back in there. It idles rock solid at 900 rpm but you never know. This is also my first turbocharged car so I'm still looking to learn what issues to look out for with a turbo. Other than a fuel filter, new plugs, and PCV valve what would be another good thing to check while I'm under the hood for a tune up?

JusMX141 · Apr 23, 2013

Lemony said:
I'm new to DSM's.

Uh huhhh....

Lemony said:
symptoms of crankwalk

Lemony said:
crankwalk

Lemony said:
crankwalk

Riiiiiight.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

I'm about 99.999% correct in making this judgement- you didn't buy a car with crankwalk, and it's HIGHLY unlikely that the car you own will ever suffer from a crank-thrust related problem. Change your oil regularly, and drive the damn car. You'll learn during your period of ownership that there are far more problems that plague our platform than something they blow completely out of proportion on the Honda forums.

CrackedDSM · Apr 23, 2013

Hey Justin, want to hear something that'll blow your mind?

I've had a 6-bolt Auto crankwalk. Measured end-play and everything.

Lemony · Apr 23, 2013

JusMX141 said:
Uh huhhh....

Riiiiiight.
You must be logged in to view this image or video.

I'm about 99.999% correct in making this judgement- you didn't buy a car with crankwalk, and it's HIGHLY unlikely that the car you own will ever suffer from a crank-thrust related problem. Change your oil regularly, and drive the damn car. You'll learn during your period of ownership that there are far more problems that plague our platform than something they blow completely out of proportion on the Honda forums.

Lol gotcha. Makes me feel better :thumb:

dacowgod · Apr 23, 2013

CrackedDSM said:
Hey Justin, want to hear something that'll blow your mind?

I've had a 6-bolt Auto crankwalk. Measured end-play and everything.

Don't Lie... 6 bolts don't crank walk ;-)

You must have had a heavy front clutch in there ..... Heavy clutches are the only reason cars ever crank walk ... LOL

Kidding aside.. its well known that any platform can crank walk.. (Even our beloved 6 bolt) Theres plenty of rant on the Supra forums about their 2jz walking all the damn time too.. .. ..... seems like 90% of the time I hear of crankwalk now adays the engine has been apart for some other reason... so I chalk it up to the builder not measuring clearances/assembling things properly... the other 9.9 % of the other 10 percent is likely due to improper maintenance or using common sense...change your oil..... don't ride the clutch at stop lights or while driving... Make sure your clutch is adjusted properly.. if you have a very heavy pressure plate avoid dry starts with the clutch depressed.. etc.. .. the other .1% are chalked up to dumb luck...

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