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Fuel injector LOUD clicking.

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comsoldier20

Proven Member
99
0
Oct 14, 2012
Manchester, New_Hampshire
Finished my clutch install. And took the car for a spin (2g gst)

car has some hesitation. There is a very loud clicking, almost sounds like electricity arcing. seems to be coming from my fueling injector #2. engine seems to be miss firing at idle and the exhaust smells rich. (engine rocks back in forth every few seconds). When I unplug injector #2 there is no change in idle or performance. If I push the gas pedal engine revs as normal. if I disconnect injectors 1,3 or 4 the idle drops and the engine comes close to stalling. when i reconnect 1,3 or 4 engine returns to normal function of misfiring every few seconds and rpms increase to 800 to 900.

here is the weird bit. when I disconnect injector #2 the clicking still occurs. but since my idle doesn't change like when I disconnect the other injectors I believe it is safe to assume that injector #2 is bad. my spark plugs have spark so I don't believe that is an issue.

I am picking up a set of 4 injectors tomorrow that are from a 1G (blue tops 450cc) from craigslist.
are these injectors a direct replacement? I can't find info on the compatibility between 1G and 2G turbo injectors. My plan is to simply swap out the "bad" injector with one of the blue tops and see if the clicking goes away.

does anyone have any input or advice? My car is generally stock in regards to my intake, injectors, ignition. I have installed 3rd gen lifters so I doubt that is the clicking. my oil pressure is also normal on the stock gauge.

Update: Just checked resistance on all four injectors. they all read 2.4 ohms. even injector #2.
 
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If it was injector number 2 there WOULD be a change in idle, when you unplug it that is. Unplug one of them until there is a change in idle. If there isn't any change, somebody else will chime in.
 
the engine behaves the same whether or not injector 2 is plugged in. my understanding is that if you unplug an injector the engine should come close to stalling like when I unplug injectors 1,3 or 4.
 
I thought you couldn't use a noid light on low impedance injectors?

UPDATE:

I swapped the injectors around on the fuel rail but the problem still persists in cylinder 2. The loud clicking sound is most likely arcing electricity from broken insulation. I also swapped out the spark plug coil pack in order to rule it out. (sound still occurred on different coil pack.) So my fuel injectors and coil pack seem to check out okay. since the sound is clearly coming from on top of the intake manifold, fuel rail I believe that there must be a broken fuel injector power wire or ground wire that is arcing OR the wires to my coil pack could be arcing. I also ruled out my spark plug wires because I switched them around and the problem still persists in cylinder #2.

Tomorrow I plan on removing the wire coverings from all of the wires on top of the fuel rail/ intake manifold and then starting the car in the pitch blackness of my garage. hopefully I will be able to see where the electricity is arcing. If that doesn't work I might just rewire my fuel injector wires and if the problem still persists, my coil pack.

This is a very weird problem.
 
Next update:

Pulled the spark plug from cylinder 2 and it had oil on it. cleaned the oil and tested it for spark. Spark was present. I took all of the protective coverings and electrical tape off of all of the wires on top of the fuel rail / intake manifold. I couldn't see any breaks in wire. I spread the wires across the manifold and reconnected everything. I then started the car. the clicking went away and the engine seems to idle more smoothly. I am now going to tape up each individual wire and clean up the mess. Then I am going to install new spark plugs and maybe get a new valve cover gasket.
 
It's highly unlikely that the clicking/"arcing" sound you are hearing is coming from the wiring harness. The battery voltage carried by the harness isn't anywhere near the level that it takes to cause that type of a problem.


... now, the ignition system is a whole different ballgame!


In fact, it was what I was thinking *may* be the problem the whole time I was reading your original post.

Killing the injectors one by one is a good way to find a dead hole, but if the hole is already dead because you're throwing the spark away, it just adds to the confusion.


I'm a little unsure by what you mean when you say you found oil on the plug

... did you mean down in the well on top of the outside of the plug?

If that's the case, you may need to reseal the valve cover. There's a perimeter gasket and four plug boss seals in the kit. Replacing the gaskey will cure that leak. Be sure the cover isn;t cracked and go easy tightening the hardware, especially the ones on the end. (see red arrows in pic below)



Now to fix the arcing, you will have to find where the spark has found another path to ground. If the plug well was wet, it's most likely going to be on the plug end of the spark plug wire. Look for white/grey traces/tracks on the wire/dark trails/tracks on the outside of the plug.

Inspect the wire terminal inside the plug wire. It should be nice and shiny.

If it's black/burned looking, it's best to just replace the wire.

In fact, I would just fire a fresh set of the factory style ngk wires and new set of (gapped) ngk plugs at it to ensure that everything is up to snuff.

Be sure to use a lil silicone di-electric on the booties to make installation/removal easier in the future.

You should feel the wires "click" into place on the plugs, and be sure that they fully seat into the coil towers.

That wire set will last the life of the car if installed with some care!

... do it once, do it right!

Be sure to check the coil terminals where the plug wires live as well! You'll see one shiny silver terminal, and one coppery looking terminal in each coil pair. If they aren't clean / or there's damage to the plastic of the towers, replace the coil, or it will ruin the plug wire end in short order.

Electrical problems can be a real nightmare, but one thing that helps is to take a calm, measured, and logical approach. Bring each system up to snuff, and it'll provide you good service for the life of the machine.


Good luck, and please update the thread when you get it up and running again. :thumb:
 

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Thanks for the input toybreaker. today i put in 4 new spark plugs, (NGKs) I started the car and took it for a spin. initially the loud clicking, arcing sound was gone. after i got back in my drive way it was back. I took it for another spin and then everything turned bad. when I would go to accelerate the car was bogging very bad and stalling. If I was idling and revving the engine everything seemed fine. The clicking / arcing sound got ALOT louder but I am still unable to pin point it. My new starter then decided to die. So my car got towed back to my house. :/ took the starter out and brought it back to the store for a refund. I will have the new one tomorrow morning. I plan on putting it in and trying to recreate the problem in my drive way. I'm starting to wonder if my throttle position sensor could be responsible for the sound? I am getting to the point of wanting to junk this problem car.

There was some drops on the end of the spark plug in cyl 2. I think I do need a new valve cover gasket for them But I doubt that would cause all these problems?

OH!
And is this a grounding circuit? (the black connector with the black wire going to the cylinder) this is a pic of the right side of the intake manifold next to the brake fluid reservoir. I don't think it is making a connection.
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... not real familiar with the 2g

However, that "looks" an awfull lot like a condensor/noise suppresor for the ignition coil. (hopefully, a wiseman familiar with the inns and outs of a 2g will be along to help)


It really does sound like you're still having problems with a plug wire or perhaps a coil terminal.

One other way to find this type of problem is to run it at night/or in a garage with the door shut and the lights off. You're looking for a spark/discharge somewhere along the plug wire,

... and when you find it, you'll know!
 
If it was injector number 2 there WOULD be a change in idle, when you unplug it that is. Unplug one of them until there is a change in idle. If there isn't any change, somebody else will chime in.
Backwards. There wouldn't be a change in idle if there is a dead injector or spark on a specific cylinder. The problem is already engaged, unplugging the problem wont fix the problem.
the engine behaves the same whether or not injector 2 is plugged in. my understanding is that if you unplug an injector the engine should come close to stalling like when I unplug injectors 1,3 or 4.
Yes. You are correct.

I've never seen a noid light work on a DSM. I've attempted to try since everyone tells me the same when I have issues and it doesn't work. Even when the car is running flawless.

Anyway, With car running, pull injector plug 2.. No change? Ok pull spark plug number 2. and quickly check for spark. Next if you can get a spare injector to use. With the car running connect a spare injector to the harness of number 2 and feel if its working. The little pin at the bottom (head side) should be ticking. If it does not, look to the harness being damaged on that rail alone. I just did the same with a friends car, he had a bad plug, somewhere inside the plug was damaged, I installed a new one and problem solved.

If the spare injector is working then look towards spark. If its some sort of electrical ticking your hearing, kinda sounds like your spark wires might be damaged and arcing to the head before getting to the spark plug. Replace spark plug wires. Possibly the spark plug wire of number 2 is damaged right before mating with the spark plug. You removing the wires and re installing them could have moved it around enough for a temp fix.

I'm not sure if Toy has already mentioned it, he just mentioned a lot and I didn't wanna read hehe.
 
I had problems with my wires going to my coil on my old 2g. They where dry rotted and cracked and the car never wanted to run. If your hearing noise your probably arching somewhere. Best bet would be to trace back the wires going to the coil pack and see if you can find a pint where they look sketchy.
 
Thanks for the continued help!

I ordered spark plug wires from my auto zone in town. I will be installing them tomorrow. If that doesn't fix it then I will follow my coil wires (3 of them) back in the harness and see if I can find a break. If that fails I might end up re wiring the coil pack and #2 injector plug.

Oh and Infinite thanks for the input! I have swapped my injectors around on the fuel rail but the problem stays in cylinder 2. I also tested resistance and function of the injectors off of the car and they all click and have 2.4 ohms. I would guess this means my problem is related to spark not getting to cyl 2. When I pulled the spark plug wire off of cylinder 2 (while the car was running) I saw sparking happening in the hole and my hand got zapped pretty bad. (don't know if this is normal).

I'll post an update tomorrow after I get the new plug wires on.
 
Well it could be related to spark. Like I said use a spare injector with the car running, connected to number 2's plug. You'll feel the injector clicking if its good. IF it does, then look at spark. IF it doesn't, look to the harness of that injector wire. I doubt it would be making noise but if its damaged the injector just wont pulse at all
 
Okay, I did the screw driver test and I can definitely hear them all clicking. I'm going to start looking through the harness today, #2 has spark when I pull the plug out and ground it using jumper cables and crank the engine. but this problem is somewhat intermittent. #2 plug usually has some oil cooking on it (spark end) but it still sparks off the car.
 
I have about 30 sec to respond to this right now but I have almost the exact same noise/situation in a 2g talon. I'll probably have time to work on it this weekend, this car is an electrical nightmare.
 
SO I just spent some time taking off all the tape and coverings of the wire harness on top of my fuel rail. Is it possible that my arcing sound could be coming from the power transistor unit?! I have a spare that I'm going to swap out. I just realized that one of the 3 ignition coil wires (blue one) goes to this connector. I think I might be getting somewhere because my wires all seem fine.

I'll keep updating this thread as I go marenallo993 (let me know if you figure something out)

Here is some pics. Yellow circles are coil pack connections. pink circles are transistor connections.
And here is a pic of my spare transistor.

UPDATE: Just swapped the transistors and still no change. cyl 2 doesn't care if injector is plugged in or not. arcing sound is still present at low rpms (600 - 800) next up is spark plug wires.

I also changed the spark plug wire position at the coil pack. I put #2 plug wire on #3's coil pack post and #3 on #2's coil pack post. however the problem stays in cyl 2. VERY WEIRD. I think I might have to do a compression test to see if cyl 2 is screwed.

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driving the car to the dealership on friday, I'll post updates in this thread. hoping their fancy computers can pinpoint the problem. they have a $100 diagnosis fee. I figured its better that I take this route instead of throwing more parts at this money pit.

Update: just pulled valve cover off. all of my lifters, rollers, cam lobes seem good. mechanically there seems to be nothing wrong with the valve train. time to make an appointment for the dealership.
 
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Dropped the car off at the dealership on friday (it is now almost midnight coming into sunday) I don't know how much longer it is going to take them. will update as soon as I know.

It was about a 35 minute drive to the dealership. I didn't have any problems considering I am pretty much only running off 3 cylinders. I even hit boost a few times.
 
I would take my car to the dealership but it's not registered yet. But dang I hope it's nothing to bad

I solved my arching sound. It was the check valve on the valve cover. The little ball is shaking making a static sound. But I know I have a vacumm leak some where
 
it is Wednesday, the car has been at the dealership for 5 days. I called them yesterday and they said they have not gotten around to looking at it yet. they must be busy haha. I will update when they tell whats going on. hopefully in a couple days.
 
UPDATE:!!!

Got the car back from mitsubishi. they did a compression test. cylinders 3 and 4 have excellent compression, cylinder 1 has good compression. cylinder 2 has close to 0 psi!!!

no idea how this happens on only one cylinder. don't know if i should just take the head off or try to inspect other things. The auto tech there says its most likely a valve issue considering that even if piston rings are bad they will make some compression. Either way I am going to start preparing they head for removal. I think I might start another thread in order to get more opinions on my next step.
 
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