When blocking off oil squirter a in a block is there a certain kit you have to buy to plug up the oil squirter holes? I'm assuming you don't just leave them unplugged..? But I'm not sure... I'm getting rid of them because I am running forged internals

If you have a 6 bolt block that is machined for them, run them.

The one time I blocked off 6 bolt squirters, I just used short bolts and a crush washer.

Just removing them and not blocking them off will cause super low oil pressure, correct?

Correct, if any pressure at all.

Okay just making sure, anyone know the exact bolt size to get to block them off so I can pick some up tonight?

If that's what you really want to do, this will give you the original size of the check valve/banjo bolt; get something shorter in length and you'll be on your way: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-miscellaneous/437697-what-size-bolt-nut-stud-fastener-1g-version.html.

great link!! thanks!

Why would you want to plug them? Many engine builders to to extremes to install them into blocks that dont come with them. You DSM guys are lucky to have them from the factory and you want to plug them up? I don't get it.

god not the oil squirter debate. an engine can be set up to use them or to not use them. not every engine NEEDS them rather they came with them or not.

900hp turbocharged busa, no squirters,
stock DSM was designed to use them, maybe your rebuild with aftermarket crank, rods, and pistons needs them, maybe it does not.

JacksonAuto said:

Why would you want to plug them? Many engine builders to to extremes to install them into blocks that dont come with them. You DSM guys are lucky to have them from the factory and you want to plug them up? I don't get it.

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I'll have to side with JAM on this. Since the block is set up for them, use them, forged bottom end or not.

New check valve/Banjo bolt from the dealer, or one of the vendors here is about $25 each.

Spend all the money building a good engine, then want to cheap out over about $100

zedicus said:

god not the oil squirter debate. an engine can be set up to use them or to not use them. not every engine NEEDS them rather they came with them or not.

900hp turbocharged busa, no squirters,
stock DSM was designed to use them, maybe your rebuild with aftermarket crank, rods, and pistons needs them, maybe it does not.

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I can understand deleting the ones in the 7 bolt that are in the mains, that clog and pop out at times and kill the crank and bearings.

But a lot of engines come factory equipped with them.

Just to name a few,
*Nissian RB26DETT
*Nissian KA24DE
*GM Ecotec
*Honda H22A4
*Mazda BP1.8
*Mazda 2.0 FE

If there was not some sort of advantage to them, the factory engineers would not want them in there, just due to the extra cost of the parts and extra machine work to install them.

zedicus said:

god not the oil squirter debate. an engine can be set up to use them or to not use them. not every engine NEEDS them rather they came with them or not.

900hp turbocharged busa, no squirters,
stock DSM was designed to use them, maybe your rebuild with aftermarket crank, rods, and pistons needs them, maybe it does not.

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It's not really about necessity. I think the argument can be made that not every engine NEEDS them, but they're nice to have. My question is simply what do you wish to accomplish by removing them? They do nothing but good things for an engine.

BogusSVO said:

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If there was not some sort of advantage to them, the factory engineers would not want them in there, just due to the extra cost of the parts and extra machine work to install them.

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Even my pickup truck has 'em

the factory installs them to prolong the life of the low quality pistons that are used. it is cheaper then using a higher quality piston. they help control situations that can cause unpredictability.

thats not to say ever using a real oil squirt is bad. but there are times when the benefit is not worth the effort of putting them in.

yes, my 6 bolt high compression build is going to use them. by stabilizing the piston temperature i will be able to fend off knock with out using drastically higher octane fuels, and hopefully with out as much need for water or other top side injection.

I know you guys do machine work for a living, but I dont think I fully agree with you saying to keep them.

So it would be ok to use a non turbo 4G63 that was not equipt with them but its not ok to block the factory ones off when using forged internals on a turbo block??

On a forged drag race or road race engine, I think they do more harm than good. Our engines have enough problems keeping oil in the bottom end as is.

ARFWD said:

I know you guys do machine work for a living, but I dont think I fully agree with you saying to keep them.

So it would be ok to use a non turbo 4G63 that was not equipt with them but its not ok to block the factory ones off when using forged internals on a turbo block??

On a forged drag race or road race engine, I think they do more harm than good. Our engines have enough problems keeping oil in the bottom end as is.

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If the block is not equipped with them, that is another story.

They are nice to have, and a road race engine should have them, for the extended times they do spend in the upper RPM band. You hammer a road race engine for miles at a time, unlike a drag engine that is full bore for 1/8 or 1/4 mile at a time.

BogusSVO said:

If the block is not equipped with them, that is another story.

They are nice to have, and a road race engine should have them, for the extended times they do spend in the upper RPM band. You hammer a road race engine for miles at a time, unlike a drag engine that is full bore for 1/8 or 1/4 mile at a time.

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But the block is pretty much the same. The n/a block has the flat provisions for the squirters. So again what makes it any different??

I can see a good use for road racing. But also in road racing when your always in the higher rpms oil is pumping so fast through the engine that theres not much left in the pan. I personally would rather block them to save what oil in the pan that I can. Then adjust my tune a bit more safe and run huge external cooling both oil and coolant.

why would you want oil in the pan instead of in the moving parts of the engine where it should be?

at full tilt there should be as much oil going out as in and there should be no 'extra' .

A high HP 4G63 Needs as much oil on the Main journals as it can get. When running the Mains at or near .003" deleting the squirters will help with keeping more oil on the Mains.

With people having issue with too high of oil pressure and having to work to get it down, removing the squirters would probably make that issue worse. I don't see an advantage by not having oil spraying on the pistons cooling them.

zedicus said:

why would you want oil in the pan instead of in the moving parts of the engine where it should be?

at full tilt there should be as much oil going out as in and there should be no 'extra' .

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From the pan it goes to all those essential parts. With how poorly designed our engines are once the oil is throughout the engine it takes to long to get back to the pan so now the pump has nothing to pickup. Cause oil dips on launch, trashed oil pumps, and can starve your turbo for that split second. So anything you can do to keep oil in the pan instead of floating around in the engine somewhere is a plus.

If its a stock engine or stock rebuild, I would reccomend leaving the squirters in the engine. You more than likely wont see the abuse to run an engine dry. Only mod worth mentioning is the Kiggly HLA.

jrohner said:

With people having issue with too high of oil pressure and having to work to get it down, removing the squirters would probably make that issue worse. I don't see an advantage by not having oil spraying on the pistons cooling them.

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I have not seen the high pressure cause any problems with these motors. My most recent motor that I built I set the Mains at .003" and the rods at .0032". I blocked off the squirters and it runs no balance shafts. On a cold start at idle it sees 105psi and if I rev it it will hit 130ish psi. Once the engine is fully warm it sees 38-40 psi at Idle and 90 psi at 2k. This is what I prefer.

You would be surprised to know that a Top fuel drag engine runs bearings clearances not far off from some of the built 4g63's. They run around .0035-.0045" on the rods. Those motors cold see 200 psi oil pressure and 160 psi hot.

I stopped porting Oil filter Housings probably 5 years ago. It's a waste of time.

Some of you are greatly over-estimating the amount of oil that the squirters use. The 4G produces more than enough oil volume and the marginal amount that the oilers consume has little, if any affect on the supply to the mains. The squirters operate entirely different from the "jets" on the 2G engines which do rob oil from the mains.

I think the gains to be had from squirters are this. They keep the pistons at a far more stable tempature. I think they would be very helpful, maybe even more with forged pistons as the tempature is more stable and piston to wall clearances may be set up tighter with no ill effects.

JacksonAuto said:

Some of you are greatly over-estimating the amount of oil that the squirters use. The 4G produces more than enough oil volume and the marginal amount that the oilers consume has little, if any affect on the supply to the mains. The squirters operate entirely different from the "jets" on the 2G engines which do rob oil from the mains.

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But my question still stands. What if you use an n/a block with no squirters for a forged build?? It's the same block. So then blocking them on on a turbo 4g engine doesn't make any difference.

Me personally have to not run the squirters. To tight of a fit with the rod I'm using.