Got a TMZ tranny with about 100 miles on it now....replaced the master, bled the lines on a power bleeder, adjusted the pedal. 3 4 and 5 are seemingly okay but 1-2-r are all super notchy...R grinds, 1st it doesn't even feel like there's a gear sometimes and needs to be forced, 2nd needs to be forced as well. Suggestions?!? Cable adjustment issue?! I mean I'm at a stand still here..completely confused....and help appreciated

The clutch is dragging.

From your description you're going to trash the 1/2 syncro's (if they aren't already).

Hal

I would get ahold of Tim and find out if he has any suggestions. Only problem is, he isnt taking any calls right now. Try emailing him and see if he responds.

changed the master, now its just first being a pain, i think the clutch is getting wore down to spec....if i just baby it like a mofo think it will break itself in properly?

Chipper308 said:

changed the master, now its just first being a pain, i think the clutch is getting wore down to spec....if i just baby it like a mofo think it will break itself in properly?

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Seriously?

Good way to trash a new transmission.

The clutch is dragging, find out why and fix it.

Hal

I have responded to a dozen plus pm's trying to help him. I have explained to him that his clutch is dragging, most likely due to a hydraulic issue because he needs to pump the clutch to get it to disengage. There is likely an adjustment issue of either under-disengagement or over-disengagement causing the clutch to drag. Either way he is not within the window of opportunity for the clutch to disengage. I already explained that he needed to disassemble and thoroughly inspect his master and slave cylinders to confirm he didn't split an inner piston seal. He has a relatively newer OEM master and an unknown age slave. I have him part numbers for OEM rebuild parts for both.

I cannot help anymore as I am taking a leave from my business to be with my family for personal matters.

It is not the transmission or the clutches fault, it is the user and its adjustment or a hydraulic issue.

Have someone push in the clutch and measure the rod movement at the slave cyl. I was having major disengagement issues at anything between 10-12mm of throw even with all new OEM clutch hydraulics properly bled and adjusted. I got it up to 14mm and the problem went away. FYI, 16mm was too much throw and the PP fingers hit the clutch disc springs.

This is all on a 1g with 2600, 2900 & 3200 ACT PP & various discs from SB Kevlar to ACT street disc and clutchnet sprung 6 puck. Haha I've been thru some clutches and trannies in the last 3 years!

Master and slave are new. Like within 48 hours.... pedal adjustment can not be adjusted anymore, its all the way as close as an 8th of a turn. Its not a hydraulic issue, I thought I said this, and after throwing parts at it I'm set with the same issue, which I said wasn't the problem in the first place, I've talked to local dsmers and every is completely baffled. Also spoke with 2 guys with evos, again no avail. Don't act like I'm clueless. I've read till my eyes bleed and read some more, I've tried every possible solution aside from ripping the trans out and its been shimmed properly and the step hieght is .610 all around. Tomorrow I am taking it to the dealership to get shifter cables checked for adjustment issues.

Now I'm as far forward to the firewall as I can go with the rod under the dash, meaning over adjustment would that mean I might want to back it off of the firewall some? Just going from jacks trans video he says to get it as far forward to get the most fluid travel possible, is this not the case in certain scenarios? Thanks

You are likely over adjusted. Back out the master rod several revolutions, crack open the bleeder, confirm no air and confirm master piston is returning to front of cylinder and getting complete travel, bleed clutch again, top off reservoir, actuate clutch, readjust master rod towards master cylinder until you get proper engagement and disengagment.

Unless you are having incorrect shift cables with the transmission, something the dealership will not have a clue about, you are better posting up ALL information in a detailed manner including if the part is mitsubishi OEM, or some parts store part.

As well, are you using brand new brake fluid or is it older? Brake fluid is extremely hydroscopic and if it is older it could be moisture contaminated and causing issues.

Chipper308 said:

shimmed properly

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There's no such thing as "properly shimmed" since these things don't have any shims in the clutch fork / TOB assembly to begin with.

Shimming the pivot ball is a hack used to cover up other issues with the clutch release geometry.

Hal

I ordered OEM, but I got just auto zone slave and master right now. Waiting for OEM to come in, okay I'll try playing with the adjustments more. New DOT 3 fluid, I actually had it hooked up to a power bleeder to be sure there was no air. I didn't know you could be over adjusted, I'll mess with adjustments in the morning. Thanks tim

Jacks video the reason he made this vid was to eliminate over adjusting.
YouTube

Yea that's the vidbi watched....I can move the slave by hand, so is that good? Or should I try backing it off some more?

Okay so opinions. this is the full story there is no bias....

tranny guys tears out my trans says it needs a rebuild, i buy a NEW trans, a USED oem flywheel never been turned and get it resurfaced, a NEW southbend clutch, he never shims the flywheel when he puts it in and it drags, its unfixable other than tearing it all back out to shim the flywheel.... is this my responsibility? or his? my outlook is i took it to a trans shop so it would be right instead of me having to tear it out a dozen times. his defense is he doesnt really feel any of the work he did inside the trans is wrong and he also mentioned "you want me to be responsible for a clutch and flywheel you bought?" even though its a new clutch and a VIRGIN OEM flywheel that had never been turned bfore, untill this week. i dont think he knew the flywheel had to be shimmed on these and neither did i, but i feel like i took it to him to do it in the first place...because i wanted a garantee that it was right the first time.

And yes this thread will be resolved soon but id like some opinions first

Thanks!

Chipper308 said:

i dont think he knew the flywheel had to be shimmed on these and neither did i, but i feel like i took it to him to do it in the first place...because i wanted a garantee that it was right the first time.

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Shimming the flywheel?????????

The shim behind the flywheel or the pivot ball...enalgagment is RIGHT off the floor.


Also this morning I discovered a new symptom....when the car is cold it shifts like an absolute dream....any ideas on why this is? I mean I can rev the engine up to 3k and put it in reverse without it missing a beat as well as first... ? But after driving for a bit its rough again

Chipper308 said:

The shim behind the flywheel or the pivot ball...enalgagment is RIGHT off the floor.


Also this morning I discovered a new symptom....when the car is cold it shifts like an absolute dream....any ideas on why this is? I mean I can rev the engine up to 3k and put it in reverse without it missing a beat as well as first... ? But after driving for a bit its rough again

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Dude stop driving it with a dragging clutch. I was lucky enough for someone to tell me that my clutch was dragging before i trashed my TRE stage 2 tranny. Go back to square one and start over with everything. And, like Hal said, shimming is B.S. and not normal (it basically covers up another issue).

Do exactly as Zimmer says

Its all been done...in fact I just left the tranny shop and shoed him the message from tim and we covered everything I said...same issue. Short of pulling the trans again its ALL been done... I keep being told to do the same things and its all done.

NO air in the lines I repeat NO air. The pedal has been adjusted by myself. The shop and 2 other people...same issue every time. The master and the slave are replaced...same issue.... shifter cables have been adjusted, it has medal bushings and short throw shifter. Same issue. Everything is done, still dragging. If shimming is be then where's the problem? 100% new parts in everthing accept the flywheel which has been machined properly and was a untouched OEM flywheel before installing the trans..... I can't clarify enough the hydraulics have been replaced from master to slave, its been bled repeatedly, the slave has been bled repeatedly and the clutch fork is having max travel.

Chipper308 said:

NO air in the lines I repeat NO air. The pedal has been adjusted by myself. The shop and 2 other people...same issue every time. The master and the slave are replaced...same issue.... shifter cables have been adjusted, it has medal bushings and short throw shifter. Same issue. Everything is done, still dragging. If shimming is be then where's the problem? 100% new parts in everthing accept the flywheel which has been machined properly and was a untouched OEM flywheel before installing the trans..... I can't clarify enough the hydraulics have been replaced from master to slave, its been bled repeatedly, the slave has been bled repeatedly and the clutch fork is having max travel.

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How does the pedal look/feel? I saw turboglenn put up something with the clutch pedal floor surface becoming a potential/feasable issue for people with their DSMs and tranny issues. I would check and make sure your pedal isnt bad too.

Pedal is awesome, my first DSM but I got a mechanic buddy who's pretty heavy into dsm and he says its one of the best feeling pedals he's felt

How does the fork sit in the transmission? Is it more to the driver or passenger side. Take a picture and post it. Have you upgraded to a stainless clutch line from the master to slave?

Edit:Other stupid stuff to look for. Make sure the starter/transmission plat was installed make sure all bell housing bolts are in and tightened to spec. Also make sure nothing is pinched between the transmission and engine.

icekilla126 said:

How does the fork sit in the transmission? Is it more to the driver or passenger side. Take a picture and post it. Have you upgraded to a stainless clutch line from the master to slave?

Edit:Other stupid stuff to look for. Make sure the starter/transmission plat was installed make sure all bell housing bolts are in and tightened to spec. Also make sure nothing is pinched between the transmission and engine.

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thanks! i will check out the bell housing and bolts, nothing stood out to me but its a long shot...worth it! also the fork sits a bit farther on the drivers side if im not mistaken.. and when pedal is down the fork cant move any further to the bell housing, ive pushed on it when i was considering an extended rod but that wont do anything, if your implying a bent fork the trans is brand new, so id hope that wouldnt be the issue...but im not ruling anything out...i will take a picture in the AM when its light, im inside for the night.

why exactly is shimming b.s? i can find much on shimming and i need to figure out what route to go, not moving forward right now. got the photo of the fork but the girlfriend took my phone to work...so no uploading for me...everything with the bell housing appears to be absolutely fine.

Anyone??