I think thats pretty common. Evo injectors are generally flowing more than they are rated. I would like to know the actual flow rate of stock 2g turbo injectors for comparison.

The listed flow rate for 2g injectors as well as 1g 450s says 450. 2g being at 43 psi fuel pressure, flowing 450.The 1g on 38 psi of pressure, flowing around 410.

Take the same injector bump up the fuel pressure, and it SHOULD flow more than its rated.

So since they are flowing 640cc and not 560cc, how would that change the settings in DSMLink? (just wondering)

e85_4g63 said:

So since they are flowing 640cc and not 560cc, how would that change the settings in DSMLink? (just wondering)

Click to expand...

By adding more fuel once its set to 600 and not 500 injectors.It's pretty much that simple..We dont use mega squirt, and use link for a reason, User friendly, and super easy to change stettings.

Bud92gsx said:

By adding more fuel once its set to 600 and not 500 injectors.It's pretty much that simple..We dont use mega squirt, and use link for a reason, User friendly, and super easy to change stettings.

Click to expand...

I meant as far as the global settings in DSMLink are concerned. I know the EVO injectors require less dwell time (dead time I believe DSMLink says), but the global settings for 560cc and 640cc are quite different I would assume?

Thats where I'll pass the torch..Because I dont have the answer.

I'm curious to see what pressure they tested them at. Like bud stated, 1g "450's" flow around 410 at 37.5psi (base fuel pressure) while on a 2g the same injectors flow 450 at 43.5psi (2g base fuel pressure). They could've tested at say 50 psi and gotten the results you're seeing.

Tyeler18 said:

I'm curious to see what pressure they tested them at. Like bud stated, 1g "450's" flow around 410 at 37.5psi (base fuel pressure) while on a 2g the same injectors flow 450 at 43.5psi (2g base fuel pressure). They could've tested at say 50 psi and gotten the results you're seeing.

Click to expand...

Did you know that before I posted the info, or after?

I'm hoping you say before..I see Brian lurking,,He can confirm if you want..He was part of that thread, and it was either him or steve that did the math on that.

Bud92gsx said:

Did you know that before I posted the info, or after?

I'm hoping you say before..I see Brian lurking,,He can confirm if you want..He was part of that thread, and it was either him or steve that did the math on that.

Click to expand...

I just pulled your 410 out of your post. It's close enough to confirm, but either way testing at a higher or lower pressure will cause a higher/lower flow rate.

Edit: just calculated- At 39psi base fuel pressure they'd be 410cc, at 37 they're obviously be a bit lower in he 385cc range.

The 5 speed 1g fpr is 38 or 38.5..So 37 and 39 are close enough..

Honestly man, I was hoping the answer to my question was "I knew that before your post"..You have been quite impressive as of late with your info..SO keep it up.

Bud92gsx said:

The 5 speed 1g fpr is 38 or 38.5..So 37 and 39 are close enough..

Honestly man, I was hoping the answer to my question was "I knew that before your post"..You have been quite impressive as of late with your info..SO keep it up.

Click to expand...

It's actually 37. I've verified this on all of my 1g's. Either way though it isn't that big of a deal.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/359811-1g-base-fuel-pressure.html

Thanks mom. I've owned enough dsms and built enough to know what I'm doing.

Tyeler18 said:

I'm curious to see what pressure they tested them at. .

Click to expand...

It says "Pressure Setting 40psi" at the bottom right of the first pic I think? Not sure if that was the pressure they used to test the injectors after cleaning, or something else.

If the Evo 8 injectors do flow 640cc, I guess I wasted my money by replacing mine with 650's.

RamenPride said:

It says "Pressure Setting 40psi" at the bottom right of the first pic I think? Not sure if that was the pressure they used to test the injectors after cleaning, or something else.

If the Evo 8 injectors do flow 640cc, I guess I wasted my money by replacing mine with 650's.

Click to expand...

I'm seeing that know. Pretty impressive if that is true.

Evo 560 Injectors normally flow 580cc at 3 Bar(43psi) a 10-15% increase in flow after cleaning is nothing new. I've been telling people a long time that they flow a LOT different based on the last time they where cleaned...
The reason they flow more is the rating is at a lower then normal Base pressure. Similar to how PTE rates they injectors at a higher then normal pressure.

Seems like Someone didn't test these at a normal pressure and/or did some odd math to come up with these numbers. Then again maybe this set Flows that much... Can you post the a pic of the whole sheet?

EDIT:
Keep in mind people just because one set of injectors flow x amount it does not mean every set will... .

Lots of numbers thrown in the wind... the paperwork states clearly that 640cc is at 3BAR (43.5psi) as FIC explains in their FAQ page, where they also explain how injectors are rated Base Fuel pressure FAQ - FIC

I'd like to see the whole sheet they sent you.

It looks like they tested them at 40 psi and then did the math (and rounded up, at that, from the actual converted number of 78) to convert those test numbers to the typical 3 BAR that injectors are tested at.

The results and math just don't quite make sense. Why are they multiplying the 80cc number by 2 and then by 4? Willing to post up who did the cleaning and testing, and maybe get an explanation from them on what the heck is going on with the math?

Ya theirs not a whole lot more on the sheet but i'll post it. The injectors came from a evo 8 with 70,000 on them.

There's so much myth and mystery surrounding EVO8 injectors...

The EVO8 ECU code is configured to treat them like they flow 545 cc/min @ 42.6psi (base pressure on EVO8, 294 kPa). So at 43.5psi, they should flow 550 cc/min. I can't imagine a stock set really flowing 640 cc/min without some fudge factors being applied or the testing temperature being raised or the fluid being less viscous than gasoline or some combination of all these things...

I'd really love to clear this all up. Someone send me a set of stock EVO8 injectors and let me test them with actual DSM and EVO8 drivers using compatible fluid and temperature controlled conditions and let's see what numbers we really come up with.

Also, the battery offset numbers (deadtime, dwell, whatever you want to call them) in the EVO8 ECU are lower not just because of the injectors, but because of the differences in the driver circuitry on the EVO8 vs. the DSM ECU. In fact, that's actually the *main* reason you find lower offset numbers in the EVO8 ECU than you'd expect.

So moving EVO8 injectors over to a DSM doesn't mean you can just drop the offset numbers to match. You can't. Well, OK, you can because they're still pretty close and minor fluctuations in fuel trim will correct anyway. But you're still using the DSM driver circuit with a slower drive time than the EVO8 circuit (primarily due to the presence of a resistor/capacitor configuration on the output of the DSM driver circuit that's missing on the EVO8). So you'd expect to need slightly higher offset values in a DSM ECU than you'd use in an EVO8 ECU for the exact same injectors.

Driver circuit differences are the main reason you can't just take injector "deadtime" numbers off flow sheets and use them in our ECUs. You have to test with our ECUs and our drivers to get those kinds of numbers.

Lots of info here if you're interested in reading.

injdata-overview [ECMTuning - wiki]

Thomas Dorris
ECMTuning, Inc.

I have a set off a low mile engine I'd be willing to let you use for testing.

MJcanada said:

I have a set off a low mile engine I'd be willing to let you use for testing.

Click to expand...

Sounds good.

ECMTuning, Inc.
1519 W Patrick St A10
Frederick, MD 21702

I'll post up results either to this thread or a new thread. If the OP wants a "retest" of his injectors with DSM drivers and defined fluid/temperature/pressure along with a full battery voltage offset table, send them in as well...

Thomas Dorris
ECMTuning, Inc.

I'm thinking he got mixed up during the test, but their going in now

what was the cost on getting that done. I need to send a few sets in

I think it was around 120 with all the o-rings

twdorris said:

Sounds good.

ECMTuning, Inc.
1519 W Patrick St A10
Frederick, MD 21702

I'll post up results either to this thread or a new thread. If the OP wants a "retest" of his injectors with DSM drivers and defined fluid/temperature/pressure along with a full battery voltage offset table, send them in as well...

Thomas Dorris
ECMTuning, Inc.

Click to expand...

Tom what were the results of your test? Very interested...

thanks