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Quartermaster VS Powertrain Technology Twin Disc Seem almost the same???

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johnboy1065

10+ Year Contributor
117
0
May 26, 2009
kingsport, Tennessee
just have a few questions of the differences between the Quartermaster and the PPT twin disc.

They seem to be basically the same thing

PPT:
http://www.extremepsi.com/store/customer/product.php?productid=19910&cat=253&page=2&veh=1G DSM

Quartermaster:
http://jnztuning.net/shop/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_30_107_118&products_id=105

the only difference that I can see is the PPT has more options for different disc material.

I have a Quartermaster in my EVO and I have been very happy with it. The only thing is it doesnt really last very long. But it does hold the power just fine.

I'm wanting a clutch for my HX40 setup that I'll be running in the near future. And was just wanting to know the differences between these two clutches.

thanks,
John
 
I own a PTT but have not installed it yet. The deciding factor for me was that I got the PTT for a good price and it is a lower profile so you don't need to grind down the clutch fork to clear it.

As far as how it performs I don't know yet. My freind has a qm in his 1G GSX and my other friend has a clutch masters in his 2G GSX so in about a month I should be able to get some good performance comparisons.
 
quartermaster discs are 7.25" compared to PTTs 7" i believe!

It says on the website that both use a 7.25 disc.


also, on the quartermaster pressure plate it says 7.25 V-drive

on the PPT I think it says 7.25 Power-V LOL

The quartermaster comes with metallic discs is that right?
 
Disk thickness is different between the Quarter Master 7.25" V-Drive Rally Twin-Disk and the PTT twin-disk -- the QM disks are 0.250" thickness each, and the PTT's are 0.200" thick. This thickness may seem negligable, but it makes a world of difference with heat dissipation, and prevention of warpage.

I recommend the Quarter Master clutch anyday over the PTT disk. The clutch fork grinding for clearance is extremely simple to do in order to clear the pressure plate.
 
Last edited:
0.200 vs 0.250 yes huge difference, but it's less than twicks' .250 vs .020!


Heh heh, you got me on that one! Edited!


Jay, I normally see a small bit of reverse synchro mushrooming, but if the clutch is properly adjusted, the other synchros usually look pretty darn good.

My current transmission is out for a refresh, as I was an idiot and mis-shifted at 9000rpm into 3rd gear at the track and toasted my hub and slider for 3rd/4th. It wasn't the clutch's fault, just my stupidity in having a faster foot than my hand as I already depressed and partially released the clutch pedal before I had shifted gears, resulting in shifting into third gear while the clutch was already engaged. Doh!

If you like, I can post up pics from this most current transmission to give you an idea of what the damage looks like when I take it apart this week.

Really though, I am all for a quality multi-disk clutch for our vehicles, as when they are properly adjusted, they are much nicer to the engine and transmission parts. The key thing to also take into account is that there are more parts putting load on the input shaft and crank, so keeping down rotating assembly harmonics is very important to maintain happy bearings. The utilization of an aftermarket high-quality harmonic damper (Fluidampr or ATI) on the crank will definitely be noticable in reduction of drivetrain harmonics, including decelleration chatter from a multi-disk clutch.

As well, if you are worried about stripping off clutch disk splines or twisting the input shaft splines, then I would recommend that you look at the prototype clutch assembly that I was running this year.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/dri...ch-sneek-peek-prototype-design-twin-disk.html

The clutch assembly is back at Quarter Master now for inspection, and I will be working with them to try and make this a reality for our application. I really feel that this design will save your input shaft, and completely end hub spline failure, along with reducing the clutch harmonics from the standard design. I spoke with Quarter Master yesterday, and will be seeing them in Florida next week for PRI to discuss the opportunity of making it a production clutch for our application as I feel it is a viable product and is a solution over the current design.
 
Twicks do you have any issues with these twin disc setups killing tranny synchros? Seems to be pretty harsh on trannys that my buddys have installed these into.

I just took apart the race transmission from this season a few minutes ago. Here's the rundown:

Reverse synchro is mushroomed and toast.
5th synchro is starting to mushroom and is not reusable.
3rd/4th hub and slider is burnt out, and 3rd/4th shift fork is worn.
5th/Reverse and 3rd/4th hub and slider springs are broken (all 4).
3rd/4th and 5th/Reverse hub and slider keys are gummed up; 3rd/4th keys have some nicks in them and require replacement.

The 5th and Reverse synchros along with the hub and slider springs are worn from the twin-disk usage.

All in all, these parts are all standard fare rebuild parts and are all extremely cheap.

As well, you have to remember that I am also running slightly than higher power levels than most ROFL.

The 3rd/4th hub and slider issue is from a hard mis-shift at 9000rpm at the track. It shifted fine up to that point.

All in all, the benefits of a twin-disk clutch far outweigh the downfalls by a longshot.
 
Thanks for the info. My buddy is not making much power at all and his tranny just went toast after about a year and we think the clutch killed it. I just wish there was a magic clutch that just worked perfect for our cars.
 
Holy cow!!! If my QM causes my shep stage4 to be toast after 1 season, I will toss it and find something else!!! I dont want to spend $2600 on a transmission every year!!!
 
Holy cow!!! If my QM causes my shep stage4 to be toast after 1 season, I will toss it and find something else!!! I dont want to spend $2600 on a transmission every year!!!

Dude, it wasn't the clutch's fault it broke stuff....shit breaks when you make ALOT of torque.

So it needed new synchros, a hub and slider, and a shift fork. That is cheap maintenence.

You have to remember, I had a number of dyno pulls on the transmission in 3rd gear (abuses the shit out of the hub and slider assembly), and had several track passes, and had a severe mis-shift that caused the hub and slider damage, and likely the reason for the broken springs.

The clutch is not the reason for the failure -- the power, and the mis-shift are.
 
From what Ive been told the clutch is a little harsh on synchros. Have heard people have to do a refresh every year on the synchros and some other parts in the tranny when running these types of clutches and power.

My buddys tranny had lots of wear on the synchros even when not making a lot of power which makes me rethink the clutch. At least with my ACT clutch I can replace it easier than refreshing syncros.
 
Well, it is the name of the game -- you want a fast-shifting clutch that can handle all the power you can put at it? Well, buy a twin-disk or a triple-disk clutch.

If you want to have a smooth, slow-shifting clutch that is nicer to your synchros and easier to drive, stick with a single-disk clutch and a street disk.

Probably the best middle ground I found was the SBC Kevlar disk with the ACT 2600PP and a Fidanza flywheel for street use (or ACT Streetlite flywheel for track use). The only downfall was that the clutch still wouldn't allow you to shift faster due to its inertia -- it could handle the torque up to ~600TQ at the wheels without failure. It just needs to be properly broken in, and then adjusted and then is fine for most of its life with little adjustment.
 
Holy cow!!! If my QM causes my shep stage4 to be toast after 1 season, I will toss it and find something else!!! I dont want to spend $2600 on a transmission every year!!!

If you think your shep glorified factory trans is gonna last you have been terribly misinformed. Be ready, its good to learn how to build you own shit, because it cost alot to pay someone to build you a trans your gonna break.
 
If you think your shep glorified factory trans is gonna last you have been terribly misinformed. Be ready, its good to learn how to build you own shit, because it cost alot to pay someone to build you a trans your gonna break.

I know, just sucks that it don't last very long!! I'm going to be droping the tranny off at sheps next month to get a welded center diff and a fresh up on the synchro's and shim's... I will pay for him to do my tranny stuff, doesn't seem to last doing it yourself!!!
 
I know, just sucks that it don't last very long!! I'm going to be droping the tranny off at sheps next month to get a welded center diff and a fresh up on the synchro's and shim's... I will pay for him to do my tranny stuff, doesn't seem to last doing it yourself!!!


Definatly sucks they dont last...if you learn the specs that alot of the high hp guys run, and replace the stuff that should be replaced it will hold.
 
I ran a PTT in mine and can assure you you wont be warping any disc. I have yet to hear of it happen... ever, with our cars that is. Remember, the guy who designed the QM/Devo left and then designed the PTT. It is far from inferior design and regardless of having to shave anything or not I found it nice to be able to bolt it up and go. The rebuild for them is cheap and easy and at any point if you want your clutch inspected simply send it in and they "refresh" it and send it back to you at no charge.

I also noticed my engagement was slightly smoother. the conical TOB did a nice job of helping this out... Due to price (the QM is or at that time was a decent amount cheaper) I was the only one running the PTT so I got to drive in other QM vehicles. And after all that, you wont notice much of a difference. The QM seemed to be louder and louder in a much more annoying way. But at this stage it shouldn't really matter to you unless you were crazy like me and driving the car on a regular basis on the street. It always was funny to hear people at every event/show/stoplight "Hey I think your transmission is grinding", "Is it out of oil, I think your bearings are toast?" "That's the worst TOB I have ever heard, you better let AAMCO check that out?" "Did your turbo blow up?" And my favorite from the haters, "I woulda got one but that sound would be so annoying all the time, could you imagine it.." :rolleyes:

Getting either one wont really change your experience. If I were you I'd go by which ever one you could find a better deal on personally. Neither is superior than the other and other than price I guarantee you no one could make a concrete enough argument over which one to pick. I preferred my PTT but I am sure it was more of a personal preference, having a TRE race tranny opposed to a Shep tranny might have been the reason it felt smoother but regardless it WORKED. A bunch of deals usually start showing up around January.

If you are worried about having a reliably fast car, then taking your transmission to Shep rather than grabbing a auto and sending it to ATP or ITP doesn't make much sense. Thats about as close to worry free as you'll get. Just remember, once you get to a point where the tranny is near indestructible meaning a Dog box (which I have seen fail) That will only lead to the next part in line going which is normally the T case and on down the line you go.. You are never safe with a manual, never. I learned from others mistakes and after watching Jake (In person/ in the Pits with him afterwards) blow his fully built drive train THROUGH his car (I've yet to see anyone with as much of a built/custom setup as he has BTW), uncomfortably close to himself I sold my DogBox and PTT within that month if not week.

Like everyone else said, you gotta pay to play and understand the risk.:rocks:
 
I will get my transmission rebuilt 500 times befor I ever go to a boring ass Auto!!! Yea I agree that an auto is easier on drive train, but what is the fun in going auto? Its all fun for me!!! I'm also as consistant at the track as it gets... I won the B1 class at the shootout this past year, with nothing but 12.0s and one 11.99s pass with a 11.90 dial in! It really don't get any more consistant then that...
 
I spoke with the guy at PTT and he said he designed the quartermaster then left and started his own business. I think I remember him saying that they are so simillar that you could even use a flywheel from one and the pressure plate from the other. I am unsure if you can interchange discs though.
 
I am still breaking in my new engine but so far for the 300 break in miles I have done I have found my PTT with the Isuzu slave cylinder to be fairly forgiving on the street. The metallic disks make some loud screech noises on downshifts if I don't rev match the shift. I will be tuning the car soon and my first trip to the 1/4 will be Feb 28th.
 
The clutch screetching will reduce once the clutch breaks in a bit more. You will become used to rev-matching every shift with a simple blip of the throttle on downshifts.

As for the PTT vs. Quarter Master stuff.... The clutch floater and pressure plates, and flywheels are interchangable. The clutch cover, hardware, and clutch friction disks are not directly interchangable unless you are using the same thickness clutch disks, as the step height is different on the PTT clutch cover using 0.200" disks vs. QM's Rally 7.25" V-Drive twin-disk that uses 0.250" disks.

In fact, I am using a PTT flywheel on my QM 7.25" V-Drive twin-disk with my custom heavy-duty disks.
 
Ok guys I had the PTT clutch installed, broke the engine in and Dyno tuned the my 91 Talon Tsi. I am not happy with this clutch. It vibrates the whole car on deceleration and chirps on down shifts. I am selling it for $750. It has less than two hundred miles on it and comes with slave cylinder. I'm going to purchase a Dampened hub OG Giken to see if that is more street able and removes the deceleration vibration. Email me at [email protected]. It has a life time warranty from the manufacturer also.
 
Ok guys I had the PTT clutch installed, broke the engine in and Dyno tuned the my 91 Talon Tsi. I am not happy with this clutch. It vibrates the whole car on deceleration and chirps on down shifts. I am selling it for $750. It has less than two hundred miles on it and comes with slave cylinder. I'm going to purchase a Dampened hub OG Giken to see if that is more street able and removes the deceleration vibration. Email me at [email protected]. It has a life time warranty from the manufacturer also.

The same is true with QM clutch. I Got one on sale with aluminum flywheel Woo Hoo I was excited. This thing is noisy as all get out. Anytime the clutch is pressed it rattles, downshifting - just like you said. But it does hold!!!
 
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