bbarnumboy
10+ Year Contributor
- 52
- 1
- Feb 20, 2012
-
Everett,
Washington
This is My solution to boost creep, which has worked absolutely flawlessly for me. Please read on to see my how to, which has cost a total of 65$ for the modifications and about 1.5 hours of my time to do.
So as a new DSM owner, I have been searching extensively for a solution to my boost creep. As most of you have the same issue, I have a full 3" exhaust system, with a 16g internally wastegated on a 1G setup.
I have seen the Mrpeepers solution. This solution is to modify the stock wastegate actuator to increase the actuator arm traveling distance. I also know all about the porting of the flapper hole and also the upgrading to the 34mm flap. I know about the porting of he o2 pipe and the turbo etc.....
So one thing that kind of upsets me when i read all these discussions about boost creep, is the guys that say "how about you just deal with it, and get the supporting mods to fuel the extra boost?" So i do not know about you guys, but when i set a turbo vehicle at 18 psi of boost, i should spool quickly and right up to 18 psi. For the guys seeing Boost creep, they are seeing the pressure go straight up to the regulated wastegate spring pressure. After that it will stay at the pressure, lets say 10psi for a few thousand rps, and all of a sudden in the higher rpm's it is jumping way up over 20psi.
The goal here is to get the full 18 psi smoothly and to have it all come in at the same time. It irritated the crap out of me, to have to wait until 4500 rpm to get my extra 8 psi of boost to come in because it was just sitting at 10 psi since 2500 rpm.
In doing my research, I have noticed that the modifications being done to increase the wastegate actuator travel, are causing side effects. These side effects were that the spring in these new or modified actuators, were not strong enough. This results in the flapper being blown open at an early boost level, causing a slow spool up. The other effect was, if you increase the spring rate, then you would possibly be increasing your boost to a higher level, as well as increasing the boost creep with it as well.
Here is what i did to fix the issue on my car. Take note that the lowest i was able to get my boost to hold steady, was around 15-17psi without creeping. Any lower than that, I was still experiencing Boost creep. Right now i have mine set at 18psi and holding steady to redline. This may not work for everyone, but it has worked for me.
I purchased a Turbonetics 30326 for $65. This is a Turbonetics Wastegate actuator, that has a dual port on it, as well as an adjustable rod. Here is the picture below.
So i have seen this actuator being used in many different ways. I decided to use it the way i want to. The pictures and steps to getting this actuator to fit on your 16G will be at the end of this post.
This actuator has approximately an 1 inch of travel!!! way more than the stock actuator. After i installed the modified actuator, i ran it using only the top port, as you would run the stock actuator. This actuator has about a 7LB spring in it. Running the car like this, gave me the same results as the stock 10lb actuator did. The boost would build up to 6.5psi (Mind you slowly because the flapper was being blown open.) After it would get to 6.5PSI at around 3,000 rpm, it would stay at 6.5 psi until about 4,500 rpm. Once it reached 4,500 RPM it would shoot straight up past 20 psi very quickly. This was the same Boost creep that i was experiencing with the stock actuator.
I decided i would utilize the second port on the actuator ( This is why i purchased this actuator.) My idea for this second port was as follows.
If this actuator has a 7 lb spring in it, and i run boost to the top and bottom port, it would equal out pressure on both sides of the actuator, resulting in no movement, because both sides are pressurized at the same pressure. This would just keep the flapper shut and run boost as high as it could. That is not what i want.
I hooked up a Manual Boost Controller to the bottom port (closest port to the actuator rod) and this is where i had my success and why purchased this actuator.
If my target goal of Boost is 20 psi, then i want my actuator to open all the way at 20psi, therefore regulating my boost. But i only have a 7lb spring in the actuator right? Easy, i set my manual boost controller at 13psi or less for the bottom port. In doing this i have added 13 lbs of force to the already 7lbs of the spring. The result is, that it will take 20psi of force to overcome the spring pressure, and regulate my boost.
It is like changing out the actuator spring, but doing it with pressure, While keeping pressure on the flapper from blowing open. All of this at the dial of a manual or electronic boost controller.
My results was a solid 18 psi to redline. The turbo spools so fast, since the back pressure of the bottom port is holding the flapper shut. I am seeing 10-13 psi at 2800 rpm or so. Just after 3-3500 rpm i am seeing my full regulated 18 psi. My boost now come is at full force, without taking a break. This is because i have now set the actuator at 18psi using boost pressure.
Below is my Mechanical how to, guiding those who wish to use this actuator.
Tools needed
-Cutting wheel or hack saw
-Marker
-Welder
-.250 1/4 inch drill bit and drill
First off, here is a comparison picture of the stock actuator vs. the new Turbonetics 30326 dual port actuator, in travel distance. The stock unit pulled around 3/8th of an inch. the Turbonetics moved about 1 inch. I marked the rod with an orange marker to show the travel distance.
Stock 16g unit
Turbonetics unit
Comparing the 2 units You can see that the new unit is much shorter. I set the 2 units next to each other. If you can see the orange markings on the rod, this is where i made my cut. I set the adjustable part of the new unit in the middle of the thread range. This will give me equal ability to tighten or loosen the rod in either direction. Set the units next to each other, cut the tip of the new unit off, and make a mark on the old unit showing where to make your cut. The goal here is to make the new unit the same length as the stock unit. We are going to use the stock units pre-bent portion.
next cut the rod off of the stock 16G unit where you made your mark and clean of the rust
Next cut the tip off of the new Turbonetics piece, leaving you a threaded sleeve. This is what we will be welding to the piece removed from the stock unit.
Here is a picture showing the parts i cut off of each unit.
Next, weld the piece that we cut off of the stock 16g actuator, onto the threaded sleeve of the new actuator
At this point you can thread it onto the new Turbonetics Unit to see how it looks! Remember to get that rod welded as straight as possible, so we don't have to redo it later if there was an interference. See how nice that looks?
Next, cut the bracket off of the stock actuator. I recommend doing this in a vise, because the spring is in there under pressure and will want to shoot out, creating a safety hazard. So be careful.
Here is the bracket after i cut it off
There are 2 nuts on the new Turbonetics actuator. holding a big washer on. This is where we will be mounting our new bracket that we cut off from the stock 16G unit. I realized after i was done, that i did not have to weld the bracket to this washer. What i did was weld the bracket to the washer after i determined how i wanted the actuator positioned. You can put it how you want, to get the vacuum nipples where desired. After you weld the washer to the new bracket, you need to drill the holes through, using the washer holes as a guide. If you want to, you could just clamp the washer to the bracket, drill the holes and you are done. But i went ahead and welded it on cause i like to weld.
here is the picture of the washer welded to the bracket, and the holes drilled. The bracket now slides onto the 2 bolts on the new actuator. Just install the 2 nuts that are provided and voila, it is complete.
Now here are a few pictures showing the completed actuator, that is ready to install. Notice how much smaller it is than the bulky stock unit. looks great!
I had no interference what so ever. It was a perfect direct install. Keep in mind that the rod is fully adjustable to get it where it needs to be, and that the rod can spin to get it lined up properly. Here are some pictures of it installed. Enjoy
I hope this will help someone as it has helped me. It has been a success and took about 1.5 hrs to do the fabrication and install. The actuator is simple to remove and install. just 2 bolts hold it to the turbo, and a cotter pin or clip holds the end of the rod to the turbo.
I am just a new DSMer who found a way to make his boost creep go away. This could not have been done without the help of all the archived threads, of past ideas. This would obviously have alot more success if you added some porting to the turbo etc.... but my boost goal is higher that 15psi so i had success. I doubt this will help anyone with Boost creep, if your target PSI is below 15.
Thanks and let me know if you have any questions or anything else.
So as a new DSM owner, I have been searching extensively for a solution to my boost creep. As most of you have the same issue, I have a full 3" exhaust system, with a 16g internally wastegated on a 1G setup.
I have seen the Mrpeepers solution. This solution is to modify the stock wastegate actuator to increase the actuator arm traveling distance. I also know all about the porting of the flapper hole and also the upgrading to the 34mm flap. I know about the porting of he o2 pipe and the turbo etc.....
So one thing that kind of upsets me when i read all these discussions about boost creep, is the guys that say "how about you just deal with it, and get the supporting mods to fuel the extra boost?" So i do not know about you guys, but when i set a turbo vehicle at 18 psi of boost, i should spool quickly and right up to 18 psi. For the guys seeing Boost creep, they are seeing the pressure go straight up to the regulated wastegate spring pressure. After that it will stay at the pressure, lets say 10psi for a few thousand rps, and all of a sudden in the higher rpm's it is jumping way up over 20psi.
The goal here is to get the full 18 psi smoothly and to have it all come in at the same time. It irritated the crap out of me, to have to wait until 4500 rpm to get my extra 8 psi of boost to come in because it was just sitting at 10 psi since 2500 rpm.
In doing my research, I have noticed that the modifications being done to increase the wastegate actuator travel, are causing side effects. These side effects were that the spring in these new or modified actuators, were not strong enough. This results in the flapper being blown open at an early boost level, causing a slow spool up. The other effect was, if you increase the spring rate, then you would possibly be increasing your boost to a higher level, as well as increasing the boost creep with it as well.
Here is what i did to fix the issue on my car. Take note that the lowest i was able to get my boost to hold steady, was around 15-17psi without creeping. Any lower than that, I was still experiencing Boost creep. Right now i have mine set at 18psi and holding steady to redline. This may not work for everyone, but it has worked for me.
I purchased a Turbonetics 30326 for $65. This is a Turbonetics Wastegate actuator, that has a dual port on it, as well as an adjustable rod. Here is the picture below.
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
So i have seen this actuator being used in many different ways. I decided to use it the way i want to. The pictures and steps to getting this actuator to fit on your 16G will be at the end of this post.
This actuator has approximately an 1 inch of travel!!! way more than the stock actuator. After i installed the modified actuator, i ran it using only the top port, as you would run the stock actuator. This actuator has about a 7LB spring in it. Running the car like this, gave me the same results as the stock 10lb actuator did. The boost would build up to 6.5psi (Mind you slowly because the flapper was being blown open.) After it would get to 6.5PSI at around 3,000 rpm, it would stay at 6.5 psi until about 4,500 rpm. Once it reached 4,500 RPM it would shoot straight up past 20 psi very quickly. This was the same Boost creep that i was experiencing with the stock actuator.
I decided i would utilize the second port on the actuator ( This is why i purchased this actuator.) My idea for this second port was as follows.
If this actuator has a 7 lb spring in it, and i run boost to the top and bottom port, it would equal out pressure on both sides of the actuator, resulting in no movement, because both sides are pressurized at the same pressure. This would just keep the flapper shut and run boost as high as it could. That is not what i want.
I hooked up a Manual Boost Controller to the bottom port (closest port to the actuator rod) and this is where i had my success and why purchased this actuator.
If my target goal of Boost is 20 psi, then i want my actuator to open all the way at 20psi, therefore regulating my boost. But i only have a 7lb spring in the actuator right? Easy, i set my manual boost controller at 13psi or less for the bottom port. In doing this i have added 13 lbs of force to the already 7lbs of the spring. The result is, that it will take 20psi of force to overcome the spring pressure, and regulate my boost.
It is like changing out the actuator spring, but doing it with pressure, While keeping pressure on the flapper from blowing open. All of this at the dial of a manual or electronic boost controller.
My results was a solid 18 psi to redline. The turbo spools so fast, since the back pressure of the bottom port is holding the flapper shut. I am seeing 10-13 psi at 2800 rpm or so. Just after 3-3500 rpm i am seeing my full regulated 18 psi. My boost now come is at full force, without taking a break. This is because i have now set the actuator at 18psi using boost pressure.
Below is my Mechanical how to, guiding those who wish to use this actuator.
Tools needed
-Cutting wheel or hack saw
-Marker
-Welder
-.250 1/4 inch drill bit and drill
First off, here is a comparison picture of the stock actuator vs. the new Turbonetics 30326 dual port actuator, in travel distance. The stock unit pulled around 3/8th of an inch. the Turbonetics moved about 1 inch. I marked the rod with an orange marker to show the travel distance.
Stock 16g unit
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Turbonetics unit
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Comparing the 2 units You can see that the new unit is much shorter. I set the 2 units next to each other. If you can see the orange markings on the rod, this is where i made my cut. I set the adjustable part of the new unit in the middle of the thread range. This will give me equal ability to tighten or loosen the rod in either direction. Set the units next to each other, cut the tip of the new unit off, and make a mark on the old unit showing where to make your cut. The goal here is to make the new unit the same length as the stock unit. We are going to use the stock units pre-bent portion.
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
next cut the rod off of the stock 16G unit where you made your mark and clean of the rust
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
Next cut the tip off of the new Turbonetics piece, leaving you a threaded sleeve. This is what we will be welding to the piece removed from the stock unit.
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
Here is a picture showing the parts i cut off of each unit.
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
Next, weld the piece that we cut off of the stock 16g actuator, onto the threaded sleeve of the new actuator
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
At this point you can thread it onto the new Turbonetics Unit to see how it looks! Remember to get that rod welded as straight as possible, so we don't have to redo it later if there was an interference. See how nice that looks?
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
Next, cut the bracket off of the stock actuator. I recommend doing this in a vise, because the spring is in there under pressure and will want to shoot out, creating a safety hazard. So be careful.
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
Here is the bracket after i cut it off
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
There are 2 nuts on the new Turbonetics actuator. holding a big washer on. This is where we will be mounting our new bracket that we cut off from the stock 16G unit. I realized after i was done, that i did not have to weld the bracket to this washer. What i did was weld the bracket to the washer after i determined how i wanted the actuator positioned. You can put it how you want, to get the vacuum nipples where desired. After you weld the washer to the new bracket, you need to drill the holes through, using the washer holes as a guide. If you want to, you could just clamp the washer to the bracket, drill the holes and you are done. But i went ahead and welded it on cause i like to weld.
here is the picture of the washer welded to the bracket, and the holes drilled. The bracket now slides onto the 2 bolts on the new actuator. Just install the 2 nuts that are provided and voila, it is complete.
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
Now here are a few pictures showing the completed actuator, that is ready to install. Notice how much smaller it is than the bulky stock unit. looks great!
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I had no interference what so ever. It was a perfect direct install. Keep in mind that the rod is fully adjustable to get it where it needs to be, and that the rod can spin to get it lined up properly. Here are some pictures of it installed. Enjoy
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
You must be logged in to view this image or video.
I hope this will help someone as it has helped me. It has been a success and took about 1.5 hrs to do the fabrication and install. The actuator is simple to remove and install. just 2 bolts hold it to the turbo, and a cotter pin or clip holds the end of the rod to the turbo.
I am just a new DSMer who found a way to make his boost creep go away. This could not have been done without the help of all the archived threads, of past ideas. This would obviously have alot more success if you added some porting to the turbo etc.... but my boost goal is higher that 15psi so i had success. I doubt this will help anyone with Boost creep, if your target PSI is below 15.
Thanks and let me know if you have any questions or anything else.