Sound clips?

Ive always been harassed for that as well even though ive never had a problem. The issue is with non adjustable BOV's that leak at idle and dont snap shut all the way between shifts. Ive used the TurboXs RFL and I just put enough washers in to tighten the spring so it doesnt leak and never had one issue. Every problem I have ever seen is from non adjustable OR impropper setting (not enough adjustment)

My camera takes some pretty poor videos, but I can probably arrange that. It's pretty loud. Slight flutter to it from the valve reverberating.

Oh and since the forum MODs decided my old thread was useless and trashed it, here is the brass check valve I'm using.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BQY6RQ

I also used a small length of 3/4 threaded pipe so the hose had something to slip over and clamp onto.

Even if it does work, I would never consider popping my hood at the track or a meet with that in there...

Isn't the higher the number, the leaner? So your results show it runs richer without recirc than with. Which proves against your theory of it doesn't matter. However props to sticking to your guns!

Oh the lengths that people will go to to purposely make their car run worse.

I'm not convinced and your rich shifts are still going to cause you some issues with your fuel trims.

I expect this will make it about a day before it hits the dead end threads section.

Seriously though I just don't get it and I happen to be someone who has a VTA bov but ONLY because my intake doesn't allow it AND I run SD. FWIW as soon as I switched to a MAF delete pipe with no recirculation I immediately noticed a loss of spool after blowing off. If I had a manual I absolutely wouldn't run a VTA, and as it is I wish that I had a recirculation port but I haven't gotten around to finding someone to weld one on for me yet.

Go ahead and say that you don't notice a difference but I and everyone else who has experience with these cars KNOWS that there is a performance loss even in conditions such as a blowthrough setup or SD.

Why wouldnt you just recirc with a metal tube , if you want the noise, keep an air horn next to you or wire it into a button on your TurboNos steering wheel that disconnects with a pushy twist.

But seriously, for your starting fuel trim to be 10:1 after a shift, and getting into the next gear, thats too rich, thats why you get performance loss, right after that shift, your running richer and i can always tell when someone shifts a nice black puff comes out when they go vented. Btw, after a shift, the ratio should be around 12:1 to lean you out for the next gear.

the lower the afr, the richer. For future advice so you dont blow your shit up.

GL

So show me this "performance loss" everyone speaks of? I haven't seen one person log any kind of major negative performance issues from modifying the valve like I have. And while is believable there is some loss in spool and HP, I think it to be a negligible amount.

Before someone deletes my post this time I'd appreciate some proof. Not this "I know best" stuff.

And while I hate to admit it 98% of the DSM owners out there aren't anal retentive enthusiasts looking to squeeze every ounce of power the most efficient way possible. Lots of us just want a fun car that makes laser noises. It's an iconic symbol of a turbocharged car. No different than the v8 guys chucking a rev at the local car meet.

I'll be happy to take my car to the track and run back to back passes with it my way and OEM recirc. But with a manual car it is pretty hard to get consistent runs.

I'll also be running a dsmchips.com chip so I'll have the no lift to shift option.

Either way 2 points on the AFR's isn't going to cause any damage IMO. I get no black smoke etc. It's leaner on the shifts than the factory fuel maps. Why would I get a rich puff going leaner?

If I can find someone willing to loan me an intake tube with a recirculation port I would happily run logs with a MAP sensor which will show the difference in spool post blowoff, I'll even run them with the virtual dyno room so that you can see the difference in how fast horsepower comes on. There is a HUGE difference and if you don't want to see it then so be it but 98+% of DSMers do want their cars to run right and squeeze ever ounce of power out of their motors, if you would rather have silly sounds than a car that runs the way it is supposed to then that is your business but to say that it works just because you've managed to marginally reduce the significant negative effects is largely bullshit.

Props on trying to fix a problem creatively but until you really understand that problem and why your solution doesn't work then don't preach against a dogma that is rooted in fact and extensive testing.

Where are you going leaner? You just said

"First run with the BOV setup OEM style. At 18lbs WOT I'm seeing around 9.5:1 AFR's. Lifting to shift (BOV active) AFR's jump to mid to high 12's. Then jump back up to 9.5:1.

Swapped in my brass check valve vented to atmosphere. PLugged open hole on intake tube. Same WOT AFR's same boost. At the shift AFR jumps up a bit less at 10.2-10.6, then drops back to mid 9's. "


Your first run re-circd AFR's jump to mid to high 12's.

Your second run vented shifted, AFR's jump up a bit less at 10.2-10.6.

12 a/f ratio is leaner than 10.2
10.2 a/f ratio is richer than 12

??Get it yet?? You shifted vented to atmos, and your AFR (10.2) was richer than OEM afr ( mid 12)

I jsut explained this. our vent to atmosphere is richer after the shift. Causing you to run rich and slower. You just proved you were wrong in your post

One last time, read this very carefully. 10.2 afr is RICH, 12.5 afr is LEAN. You were not LEANER venting to atmosphere, you were running RICHER. = NOT GOOD

EclipticalGS said:

Where are you going leaner? You just said

"First run with the BOV setup OEM style. At 18lbs WOT I'm seeing around 9.5:1 AFR's. Lifting to shift (BOV active) AFR's jump to mid to high 12's. Then jump back up to 9.5:1.

Swapped in my brass check valve vented to atmosphere. PLugged open hole on intake tube. Same WOT AFR's same boost. At the shift AFR jumps up a bit less at 10.2-10.6, then drops back to mid 9's. "


Your first run re-circd AFR's jump to mid to high 12's.

Your second run vented shifted, AFR's jump up a bit less at 10.2-10.6.

12 a/f ratio is leaner than 10.2
10.2 a/f ratio is richer than 12

??Get it yet?? You shifted vented to atmos, and your AFR (10.2) was richer than OEM afr ( mid 12)

I jsut explained this. our vent to atmosphere is richer after the shift. Causing you to run rich and slower. You just proved you were wrong in your post

Click to expand...

You're not pickin up what I'm putting down grasshopper. I know how a WB works.

What I said was the factory AFR targets are in the 9.5 and richer at that point. So it is still leaning out the fuel curve with the valve the way I have it during a shift. It's leaning it from the 9.5 to the 10's. While this isn't as lean as it goes with the valve recirculating, it is still leaning out the fuel trim. It never goes richer than factory map.

Look I'm just saying I bunked the whole myth that running a vented BOV causes a massively rich condition while shifting. Also, there is no cylinder wash down etc. It is slightly richer than with the valve recirculating but not more so than the fuel maps.

The only thing lost is the air recirculating back into the turbo helping it keep spooled up between shifts IMO.

the_mork said:

If I can find someone willing to loan me an intake tube with a recirculation port I would happily run logs with a MAP sensor which will show the difference in spool post blowoff, I'll even run them with the virtual dyno room so that you can see the difference in how fast horsepower comes on. There is a HUGE difference and if you don't want to see it then so be it but 98+% of DSMers do want their cars to run right and squeeze ever ounce of power out of their motors, if you would rather have silly sounds than a car that runs the way it is supposed to then that is your business but to say that it works just because you've managed to marginally reduce the significant negative effects is largely bullshit.

Props on trying to fix a problem creatively but until you really understand that problem and why your solution doesn't work then don't preach against a dogma that is rooted in fact and extensive testing.

Click to expand...

I do understand the problem. And I never claimed to have a solution. I've went over this in the first thread before it was deleted. Everyone was telling me there was this massively rich condition and it would wash the oil off the cyl walls and make the car run horribly. And that is not the case. I never claimed this was ideal. It's not! I just claim there are no dangerous side effects. And I have a stock vented BOV with no major driveability issues.

Thats it... "get it"?

dont be a cheap skate, if you want to vent ,buy a MAFT ....

I ran open bov for a long time, got my link and did all the lil corrections i could do. Switched to gmaf and forgot all about the factory venting, even with all the correcting you can do with link you still cant fix that bucking and you cant get the smoothness between shifts like you can with gm maf at partial throttle. Its better to just do things the right way if your a ricer like me cause i like blow off its awesome.

It sounds like you're doing this because

forcefed86 said:

Lots of us just want a fun car that makes laser noises.

Click to expand...

With a cone intake and a 1g bov on my 2g, when the bov vents it is very noticeable. Just get an aftermarket intake, and you'll have your noises without running rich and increased spool times (and the accompanying loss of power).

Why are we even telling him, he obviously "knows" what he is doing. Just dont come back a month later whining that your car dies all the time and then blame it on crankwalk like all the other ricers.

Both quotes below are the exact type of myths that are total BS. If you set it up like mine I don't have these issues at all!

No bucking or other BS, No crankwalk, no dieing etc.... I ran my other 93 for years this way. It drives just fine.

JEFFREYCASTGSX said:

Why are we even telling him, he obviously "knows" what he is doing. Just dont come back a month later whining that your car dies all the time and then blame it on crankwalk like all the other ricers.

Click to expand...

untouchablecc said:

I ran open bov for a long time, got my link and did all the lil corrections i could do. Switched to gmaf and forgot all about the factory venting, even with all the correcting you can do with link you still cant fix that bucking and you cant get the smoothness between shifts like you can with gm maf at partial throttle. Its better to just do things the right way if your a ricer like me cause i like blow off its awesome.

Click to expand...

The discharge from the blow off valve is metered airflow thats been accounted for by the MAF. When the air volume is relived from this "count" that the maf has calculated without returning back into the system, YES it will go rich right after the shift. It's the way the p.o.s dsm MAF system is designed from the factory.
To show it's ugly head do a 1-4 gear short shift sequence, full throttle and see how it recovers in forth gear. Or just cruise in 3rd gear and light your blow off valve like 5 times in row.

Based on your testing and theory, your saying that severe boost leaks shouldn't cause a rich condition either with a stock MAF system?

Yes it's going richer between shifts, you don't stay on the top line (rich part) of the fuel map when you're shifting, that's when you're boosting. When you shift, you probably drop down to the bottom half of the fuel map. When you VTA, you stay higher up in the fuel map, so not only is it injecting extra fuel because of it dumping out the air it's already metered, it's putting you higher in the fuel map which is also set richer.

I VTA since I havent rigged up a way to get it recirc'ed because of how bad of a place my BOV sits. I crushed my BOV as far as possible (to try hold high boost), so that does help quite a bit but it still gets quite rich between shifts. Yes it spools slower on shifts this way.

I don't have a problem with the idea of a louder blow off valve. You can run your car this way but you cannot get the best tune and drive ability this way. My blow of valve is recirculated and it is loud? I have a 3.5 inch intake going to the turbo made of metal and it makes the b.o.v loud.

I don't know why we're still having this discussion after all these years.

Here's all the proof I need: when I first got my TSi FWD, I attempted to run the valve vented between my house and my buddy's house, and the damn car stalled everytime I came to a stoplight and pushed in the clutch. Needless to say I hooked the dump tube back up, and never looked back.

Anyone that wants to risk stalling at every intersection to make their blow off valve 2dB louder is out of their mind.


If you're running a high enough boost level, it doesn't matter whether the valve is vented or not. We've done that experiment on a friend's 2G running around 25psi using a 1G BOV on our way home from the drag strip one night.

I actually felt that my bov became quieter when I started running it as VTA, I'm assuming that this is because my restrictive stock intake tube and massive FIPK on the end worked as a megaphone to amplify the sound of my bov.

I do like the sound of my bov, I do not like feeling like I wake people up every time I step off the throttle on my way home at night. I just don't see how you could want a louder bov than you get with hard pipes and 15-20psi of boost.

Yay you got it to work. Grats. Do you want a cookie?

For the record I attempted this on my 2g about 5 years ago before reading much on these forums. I thought it would be ok at first and after 3 days I changed it back to stock and my ass dyno was happy again. Ever since then I know when I hear a BOV that's been modded like this. I laugh at the ricer that thinks it sounds cool(Sounds more like a giant queef than any upgrade or stock BOV) not because I judge but because I've been there and learned from it. Asside from flaming you for doing this there are a lot of people here that honestly hate to see someone make the same mistake we made. GL with whatever comes of it...

to the op , what do you want to prove /??/??? its known and its a fact for years that its not good to vent your BOV. what exactly do you need???// you want to do it on your car , do it but dont come later on an ask for help.