1G Best source for replacement knock sensor?

[benspilk09]

Car is a '91 TSi AWD.

I'm having random phantom knock problems, and my knock sensor has lost it's goo so I'm sure it's bad. Its happening randomly under vacuum, I haven't seen it knock under boost.

Anyway, where is the best place to get a new knock sensor? Looks like OEM is discontinued. Autozone/oreilly shows they can get an aftermarket one, but I'm always wary of their sensors. It might be worse than what I have.

Anyone have a source for OEM sensors, or a known good aftermarket?

Thanks!

 

[DSMPT]

I followed the "mazda lead" and found some other sensors (for 626 and Premacy I think)
E1T50371
E1T14772
FSD7
FP39-18-921
E1T14874 (looks like this one was done by Mitsubishi)

I used eyeballing as a scientific method of choice. My temporary criteria was: "does it look close enough?"

ECU is throwing 31 error (not permanently, it's 50/50 on and off) but all symptoms suggest that it's bad sensor. I did't pull it out yet, but since I have the battery relocated to the trunk I was able to squeeze my hand behind the intake manifold and grope the sensor a little bit - definitely the silicone-cap-thing is gone...

Could anyone provide some expertise? Those sensors have one more advantage from my perspective: there are plenty of them on my local market (Poland) but those are the only ones - nothing else mentioned earlier in the thread seems to be available in Europe, especially in Poland. I'm getting desperate...

Thx in advance for any insights.

As much as I know many Suzuki kei cars and some Mazda have a Mitsubishi supplied 1G style knock sensor (with a Mitsubishi sticker). But all of them are body ground type.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

As much as I know many Suzuki kei cars and some Mazda have a Mitsubishi supplied 1G style knock sensor (with a Mitsubishi sticker). But all of them are body ground type.

@DSMPT , would that explain the shield wire that wasn't exposed but he found and wired in like our mitsu's? Just wondering your thoughts.

 

[DSMPT]

@DSMPT , would that explain the shield wire that wasn't exposed but he found and wired in like our mitsu's? Just wondering your thoughts.

@1990TSIAWDTALON Marty, I am not so sure. maybe due to the difference on the filter side/circuit in ECU. I just wanted to give him more choices for sensors since he mentioned that it's hard to find it in Europe. because I am interested in this, too. since I couldn't make this before.

First of all, I didn't proof anything and I could be very wrong. And I can't tell why or how. It's just speaking of my thoughts and some experience. I didn't go deep but I planned the same before.
But I had a big concern and I wanted to make it clear but I couldn't was, since this is not a latest donut style sensor, the piezo plate in the sensor could be different depending on the cylinder diameter or target knock frequency range. In case if it's different, even the appearance is the same and even if I would make the circuit the same as DSM to avoid to get the cel, there would be possibility that it wouldn't be detecting knock properly. (The sensor I had was from a Suzuki kei turbo car that has 68mm cylinders. The same as the one in the pic).
I couldn't make sure about the things like above, plus I went AEM EMS and sold all 1g sensors, so the plan went fade-out about 10 years ago. Again, I didn't spend much time for this and I confirmed nothing.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

 

[benspilk09]

It looks like the SMP sensors are extinct now. I was about ready to try one.

I am also worried about the frequency range the sensor is designed to detect.

Does anyone have a "new" OE DSM knock sensor to pull numbers off of? Several of the Mazda parts have mitsubishi tags on the sensor and on the plug. I'm wondering if we can find a match for the sensor that way.

The one I'm looking at now is a 2 wire plug, it fits a 90-91 Mazda 929 with the 3.0 V6. Standard Motor Part # KS133

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/smp-ks133

On the sensor body there is a mitsubishi part number

JE50 E1T14871 4127

Edit: I found a photo of a DSM sensor and of course the numbers are all different. Who knows what they actually mean though. I sent NTK an email asking if the miata and mitsu sensors are functionally the same, hopefully they can respond. The '00-05 miata sensor is a 2 wire plug, just like the DSM, and that engine uses an iron block.

Another possibility is a 1st gen Mazda MX6 or Ford Probe GT. They were turbocharged, from the same era as a 1G DSM, and use an identical knock sensor. Surely they are tuned the same.

 

[mooserage]

These are just questions because I am definitely interested in alternates but they have to be asked because others may trust their motors on the results:

How do you expect to test? Do you have a method in mind that recreates on demand a dependable condition which you can compare their behavior in action (ie. engine running and under load conditions) or are you intending on doing signal analysis of the (likely) piezoelectric elements to compare frequency response in controlled bench tests?

Great question, testing would likely take the form of tapping the block to see if I can get any readings with the engine off and then taking similar pulls and comparing results. To your point, its not very scientific, ideally someone with instruments to measure the filtered frequencies, or confirmation from any of the manufacturers would be the best method.

Anyway, I do have the Miata sensor, I made a plug n play harness so I don't have to destroy and wiring. Biggest problem now is getting it all back on the road to test it.

It looks like the SMP sensors are extinct now. I was about ready to try one.

...
On the sensor body there is a mitsubishi part number

JE50 E1T14871 4127

...

I did the same thing with the part# for the Miata part, but didn't find anything linking it with the 1G sensor. Unfortunately it seems like Mitsubishi just did their own thing with their own part numbers.

 

[NWHTanK]

Not to sound like a dumb ass, but what about Hyundai since they used the 4g63 also.

 

[benspilk09]

Excellent news everyone

Remember the late 80's Mirage turbo that used the 4G61T?

It supposedly uses the same sensor, just a different length wire. They're supposedly interchangeable. Rockauto still has these NTK sensors in stock, part number ID0263.

I just ordered mine, now don't you jerks hoard all of them

Edit: the old Dodge/Mitsubishi Colt Turbo also appears to use that sensor, but with an older style plug. NTK brand sensors for those are also in stock

 

[mooserage]

Excellent news everyone

Remember the late 80's Mirage turbo that used the 4G61T?

It supposedly uses the same sensor, just a different length wire. They're supposedly interchangeable. Rockauto still has these NTK sensors in stock, part number ID0263.

I just ordered mine, now don't you jerks hoard all of them

Edit: the old Dodge/Mitsubishi Colt Turbo also appears to use that sensor, but with an older style plug. NTK brand sensors for those are also in stock

Fascinating if true! Did you find some info that confirmed its the same sensor with just a different length of wire?

 

[curt-s]

rockauto has the same part # for the 1990 galant 2.0L which was a 4g63.

 

[benspilk09]

I came across a thread on 4G61t.org where someone was asking about the correct knock sensor for their application, and they said to use a 4G63 sensor since at the time they were more common.

Its the same plug. Since the 4G61 is basically just a de-stroked 4G63, they share most ancillary components and I'd be shocked if they actually changed that sensor.

I'm comfortable being a guinea pig here, rather than spending $80 on a sensor for a 10 year newer mazda.

 

[jrm-1992talon]

Rockauto only had one remaining (not sure if that's true or just a marketing tactic) so I ordered it today as well. I'll install it as soon as I get it and let you guys know if my CEL goes away. It's on now because I used to run a 4G ecu and evoscan with a 2g knock sensor but recently switched back to a 1g ECMlink.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

 

[ist dwa]

Silly question, has anyone ever just filled in the knock sensor where the black goo is with urathane?

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Rockauto only had one remaining (not sure if that's true or just a marketing tactic) so I ordered it today as well. I'll install it as soon as I get it and let you guys know if my CEL goes away. It's on now because I used to run a 4G ecu and evoscan with a 2g knock sensor but recently switched back to a 1g ECMlink.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

Those sensors work fine, I have 2 spares and one on my car.

 

[hupdmbl]

I was able to order a knock sensor from Auto Zone for my 1990 Talon TSi made by Santech PN KS0120 and cost $109 (the Duralast was not available). After I installed it, it wouldn't plug in because the connector was different. looks like they used the same connector that goes to my EGR temp sensor instead of the Knock sensor connector. I filed down the two ridges that kept it from plugging in and hooked it up. I got a check engine light. Maybe its pinned backwards. I plan to swap them and see if it operates correctly.

 

[Dericsh]

After realizing I missed out on the ID0208, I started doing some digging and found a thread on the galantvr4 forum that said MD131681 looked like it was compatible in ASA. The pictures look to me like it’s the same and even the sticker on the plug appears to have the same numbers from what I can tell.

I’m a double whammy of no help here because my car is in the beginning of a rebuild and hasn’t run in about a year. So I can’t easily just test it for everyone. Also I’ve not gotten a chance to get familiar with caps or asa or whatever, so could someone confirm that the think this will work?

Seems to be a good bit of availability on this part number on various marketplaces.

EDIT: I see on rockauto they have the ID0263 previously mentioned under that Mitsubishi part number, so it should work! I’m gonna order one.

 

[benspilk09]

I got around to installing the Mirage knock sensor in my talon. So far it appears to be working. No CEL and i still get random knock events around 2500rpm in vacuum like my OE sensor would pick up, though they happen much less frequently.

Here are a few comparison pictures. As you can see it has the Mitsu tag even though it's NTK. It plugs right in, though the wire is about 1" shorter. You can't clip the connector to the intake manifold brace due to that, but oh well.

 

[Dericsh]

I got around to installing the Mirage knock sensor in my talon. So far it appears to be working. No CEL and i still get random knock events around 2500rpm in vacuum like my OE sensor would pick up, though they happen much less frequently.

Here are a few comparison pictures. As you can see it has the Mitsu tag even though it's NTK. It plugs right in, though the wire is about 1" shorter. You can't clip the connector to the intake manifold brace due to that, but oh well.

thanks for the update!

 

[Pirrofab]

Funny that the part appears to cross over to Mazda Miata as my private search had me looking up similarity between the 13b rx7 knock sensor and the dsm

 

[biglady112]

I just finished tuning a 1989 Right hand drive, Galant VR4 with a 1g Ecmlink V3. I used a 99-05 Miata knock sensor as the factory was one shot and the wire tore.

All I did was take the factory connector off the 1G knock sensor and off the Miata sensor and wire it to to the Miata knock sensor. The car worked and performed flawless and the knock sensor functioned as normal during tuning.

So there you have it. A Miata knock sensor is a viable option.

 

[ChessmoDSM]

I just finished tuning a 1989 Right hand drive, Galant VR4 with a 1g Ecmlink V3. I used a 99-05 Miata knock sensor as the factory was one shot and the wire tore.

All I did was take the factory connector off the 1G knock sensor and off the Miata sensor and wire it to to the Miata knock sensor. The car worked and performed flawless and the knock sensor functioned as normal during tuning.

So there you have it. A Miata knock sensor is a viable option.

Care to share the part number?

 

[biglady112]

Just research. 1999-2005 Mazda Miata MX-5. They only made the car one way. 1.8L.

Beck Arnley 158-1039

 

[dsmmario]

Thanks for this post. I’ve been using the Galant one with no issues to report. I zipped tied the shorter wire. Purchased it from eBay.

New 92 93 Mitsubishi Galant Engine Knock Sensor MD131681 w/o turbo Original OEM | eBay

Part Numbers: MD131681. Mitsubishi Galant Engine Knock Sensor. GALANT 92-93 (2.0L), DOHC, w/o turbo. OEM Factory Original. We are more than happy to quickly resolve any problems if by chance they may happen.

www.ebay.com

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

 

[Mech Addict]

So odd they still have these for Galant, and not TELs. Even NTK, which makes so many electrical parts for Japanese cars has seemingly stopped making an aftermarket version.