Roll bar/roll cage design

[terefic181]

"15.6.18:

I'm guessing what that means is for cars that have ERW cages before 4/30/03 installed then they are grandfathered in? What happens if you've been building the car for the last 3 years to compete, is it still grandfathered in?

Jake,

All I can tell you is that at the time 4/30/03, I got in just under the wire to get mine inspected, and a race log book issued before the cut off date. So the car was able to be grandfathered in. I was using ERW, which was legal at the time. I had worked on the cage for quite some time and didn't want to have to remove it all, and start over. I actually didn't have time to add some xbars as I had planned, but will be doing so now that I'm getting settled into a new residence.

You can check with your local region, but I wouldn't expect a very promising answer regarding granfathering after the fact.

 

[Bob 95 Talon]

I finally installed the Jegs cage. The fit was real good. I am very happy with how it turned out. I took some pictures today but don't know how to attach them. If some one could be kind enough to walk me through the process I would be happy to send the photos from all different angles.
So I got the cages a few days ago, I ordered three of them. I enduro race and cars may not last too long so cost is an issue. Not to comprimise safety but I needed to stay under 300.00 per car for cages. The Jegs cages shipped were just under 600.00 for three. So I did fine with that. I did have to bend the door bars and I added a 2"x2"x 3/16" square tube along the rocker panel on the drivers side. I need side impact protection only on the drivers side so I ran two bars down the drivers side and only one on the passengers side without the 2"x2" stock. The Main hoop fit perfect and I think it would work just fine in a car with the interior installed. I'm not sure how you would attach the rest of the bars with an interior. You would have to get somewhat creative. All the bars are pre notched on one end and you cut whatever mitre you need at the other end. They give you a bunch of plates to anchor to the floor pan or where ever you desire. I cut approximately 3" off of the legs on the main hoop. With a headliner you might cut an inch more. The interior panels in the 2G's hug the sheet metal fairly tight.

Well as soon as someone explains to me how to send the photos to this forum I will get them posted. I can get them on to my computer but don't know where to go from there.

Thanks, Bob

 

[kpsc93TSi]

here is a link to a roll cage that is "SCCA & NASA" compliant for club racing
Roll Cages for the Mitsubishi 1G Eclipse-Talon from HorsepowerFreaks

 

[Project2G]

here is a link to a roll cage that is "SCCA & NASA" compliant for club racing
Roll Cages for the Mitsubishi 1G Eclipse-Talon from HorsepowerFreaks

Dang this thread is old. I have an Autopower 4 point. I got it directly from Autopower (it was cheaper).

 

[Ludachris]

I wanted to bring this thread back to talk about mounting points. I'm still looking at adding a 4-6 point roll bar, 4 points in the rear with 2 forward mounting points to serve as door bars. The question I have is the main hoop mounting points - I was wondering if we can mount the main hoop to the back seat base location as opposed to the floor. I'd like to leave the option open of moving the seat back to allow for a longer steering column for weight distribution, plus I'd like more clearance for my head when I drive on the street without a helmet. Is this mounting point safe and strong enough to be used?

 

[99gst_racer]

Chris, my main hoop in my 1G attaches to the back seat area. The material there is actually thicker (a layer or two more sheet metal) than that of the floor. Also, I'm a big guy, and my fixed position seat sits back pretty far, so having the main hoop a bit farther back allowed be to keep it perfectly vertical instead of having it angled back like many others that I've seen. More head room is another bonus.

PICS

 

[Scott McIntyre]

Check your rule set... Usually the top of the roll bar must be no more than "x" inches behind the driver's helmet when the driver is seated in the normal driving position.

 

[swillits]

FYI: This site has a gallery of images for a 2G cage.
GT Fabrications :: Gallery

 

[xloki77x]

This is the official FIA Roll Cage & Safety Requirements

 

[gsxitement]

Oh ya BIG thing! if you are doing it yourself..........NO MIG WELDING....... must be ARC or TIG. mig is not strong enough, and the inspectors will check the welds. I really recommend going to SCCA and printing out the rules & regulations on roll cages. its only about 10 pages long, and really good info.

No where in the GCR does it say no MIG welding. It DOES say if you're using alloy steel, to weld in accordance with accepted industry procedures. I car chiefed for an A/S Camaro and won two regional championships as such. Mig welding is fine. All of our cars were. Just know what you're doing, or have someone who knows what they're doing do it. My auto power four point was migged from autopower, and the rest of the 6 point will be migged as well.

 

[xloki77x]

^^+1^^

In fact, some sanctioning bodies frown upon the use of TIG'd 4130 cages. Some argue that the heat treated properties of the 4130 change when you TIG weld it, actually altering the internal grain structure of the metal itself. This is dangerous with such thin (in comparison to DOM standards) materials such as 4130 tubing used for a roll cage.
Do you realize how long it would take to TIG weld an entire roll cage?! Every single cut must be a PERFECT fit with zero gap which would take a LONG LONG time. That also produces scrap and scrap = wasted $$$. You talk to any frame/cage builder and they will all tell you the same thing. MIG welding is perfectly suitable for frame and cage building.

Pete

 

[gsxitement]

In fact...NASCAR migs their cages. And if anyone has ever seen a cup car wreck...and we all have, The drivers walk away, pretty much unscathed. If it's good enough for roll overs at 180+ mph.....it's good enough for my time trial DSM.

 

[kev98gsx]

If it's good enough for roll overs at 180+ mph.....it's good enough for my time trial DSM.

True That!!!

 

[Flash]

How many times do cars actually roll in racing or even in time trial for that matter?

 

[gsxitement]

How many times do cars actually roll in racing or even in time trial for that matter?

Why risk it? Cars have and will roll over in motorsports. Why not be as protected as possible. This past week in racing has shown that you cannot become complacent when it comes to racing safety. If you're going be on track, be as safe as you can. Cause it's not just you that can have a problem. Everybody on track should have their safety as a priority not only for themselves, but because what happens to you could very well impact other people.

 

[dexterholland04]

I have a S&W Race Cars roll cage (point). As long as you install it as per the NHRA rules, their kit is perfectly weld/bolt in.

 

[gsxitement]

I have the Auto-power 4 point and the pieces for the U-weld it bit to make it a 6 point. Not as close to the car as I'd like...but still decent.

 

[greengoblin]

How many times do cars actually roll in racing or even in time trial for that matter?

It's safety equipment that keeps you alive. Failure is not an option. It has to be done right. You only get one chance to test it. That is why it matters.

 

[Flash]

It's safety equipment that keeps you alive. Failure is not an option. It has to be done right. You only get one chance to test it. That is why it matters.

I never questioned the safety. I was asked the same question by a friend, and it changed my way of viewing a cage. A cage transforms a cars handling, nothing has as big of an impact as a cage... But most DSMer's (as I've read) are more concerned with passing the minimum requirements for a cage that barely impacts handling.
Think about this- 1. this is a road course forum, not drag racing so cages should also be thought of as impacting handling. 2. a better/quality cage correlates to increased safety and increased rigidity.

 

[greengoblin]

I must have misinterpreted what you meant from this:

How many times do cars actually roll in racing or even in time trial for that matter?

It seemed like you where asking why cages mattered.

I agree with what you said below:

I never questioned the safety. I was asked the same question by a friend, and it changed my way of viewing a cage. A cage transforms a cars handling, nothing has as big of an impact as a cage... But most DSMer's (as I've read) are more concerned with passing the minimum requirements for a cage that barely impacts handling.
Think about this- 1. this is a road course forum, not drag racing so cages should also be thought of as impacting handling. 2. a better/quality cage correlates to increased safety and increased rigidity.

I do agree most are looking for the a cheap basic cage. I'm sure a lot that has to do with budget and access.

It will also will boil down to rules. What if any chassis reinforcements they will allow the cage to make for the class of racing you want to run. So the first question like always should be: "what am I'm going to use my car for?" then followed by "What do the rules say."


Kevin

 

[xloki77x]

...A cage transforms a cars handling, nothing has as big of an impact as a cage... But most DSMer's (as I've read) are more concerned with passing the minimum requirements for a cage that barely impacts handling.
Think about this- 1. this is a road course forum, not drag racing so cages should also be thought of as impacting handling. 2. a better/quality cage correlates to increased safety and increased rigidity.

A cage is a safety device FIRST. As a by product, inherent in it's design, it also adds chassis rigidity along with a significant amount of weight. As long as you are not doing wheel to wheel racing or reaching speeds of 150+mph, a harness bar (4 pt) to a 6 point cage is sufficient. As soon as another vehicle is on track with you, a true 10-12 point weld in cage is usually mandatory. As stated though, its all outlined in the rules of your sanctioning body.

FYI - TIRES have the biggest impact on handling, without question.

Pete

 

[gsxitement]

The bottom line is always follow the rules of the sanctioning body. And theres so many things that affect a cars handling you can't just say this thing makes the biggest difference in a cars handling. Tires and alignment are probably two of the most important , as are springs rates and corner weights, damping...the list goes on. A cage is for safety first. Thats it.

 

[96awd]

Does anyone have the SW Racecars 10pt Roll Cage for a 1g installed? I've been talking with Lee over there and wanted to get other input to see if there was any changes that had to be made or if the speakers in teh dash had to me removed or relocated.

 

[greengoblin]

I have heard only good thing on the link fourms about Ken's Kustom cages.

Here is a link:

ken's kustom chassis

 

[greengoblin]

I like pictures so here are some cage pictures. Hope you guys don't mind.

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Archer Racing car.

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