Hahn s20g and fp mani clearance issue?

[DannyE]

Hey fellas, I have a slight issue with my new turbo and manifold. The problem I’m having is the t3 10cm turbine housing is contacting the block right at the balance shaft bulge. The turbo is a hahn s20g and the manifold is an fp, also the turbo has the adapter for it to work on the dsm manifolds, I’m not sure if even a manifold spacer will work seeing I have about a 1/4” gap between the manifold and head. I mean, I see people say it’s a bolt up affair? I would like to know how that is, yeah it’s a bolt up job maybe if you can make a custom manifold. Any info on this would be appreciated.

 

[DannyE]

Here’s a pic.

 

[DSMPT]

Try a 1/2" spacer and thicker gaskets such as 4 ply or copper, I have done it for FP mani + T4 .81 housing and the issue was solved.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

You COULD have it angle milled so it would cock it a bit but thats some pocket change. (Your FP mani, which would make it unique to your set up)
Just a thought. We all have to adapt some times.

 

[DannyE]

@1990TSIAWDTALON That certainly would be a unique setup, the only concern that I could thank of would be the angel of the bolt holes so those may need to be milled as well but that would be the most perfect fit and finish.

@DSMPT yeah, I wasn’t sure if a half inch spacer would do it or not so today I took that cracked chinese manifold that came with the car and chopped the flange off then grinded it flat, turns out it gives me ample room.

I’m going to just buy one of those RRE flanges, run two gaskets and port match everything. Hopefully when it’s all said and done I won’t have any leaks.

Thank you fellas for all of the help, I really do appreciate it.

 

[Mello]

Back in the days when Hahn was selling their Super Turbo they came in a full install kit for bolt-on. One of the items in the kit was a 1/2" thick spacer flange for the manifold to head which almost cleared everything. They still had to shave two flats on the Compressor housing OD to get things to fit.

 

[DannyE]

@Mello Ahh I see, yeah I figured something wasn’t right because I kept seeing people say it was a bolt up affair. That turbine housing is massive, I compared the turbo to the old 14b to it and the 20g can literally eat the 14b.

Thanks for letting me know that Mello, that makes me feel a lot better running a spacer seeing the original kit came with it.

 

[Mello]

Here's a picture of everythtingthat came with their kit(s). The spacer flange is hiding under the double set of MLS exhaust gaskets i nthe upper left corner.

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[DannyE]

A picture is worth a thousand words. There it is clear as day, along with those extended mani studs.

Once again Mello you made my day, thanks man.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

You have a spacer between the turbo and manifold that is pushing it toward the block.

Someone else not long ago had this issue as well. Remove the spacer between the turbo and manifold and itll be fine no need for spacer flanges anywhere.

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[brian9397gsx]

That's a dsm to t3 adapter, I used a decent 7cm tdo5 housing rather than the 10cm

 

[Archer Fabrications]

That's a dsm to t3 adapter, I used a decent 7cm tdo5 housing rather than the 10cm

And thats why it hits the block

 

[boostdawd]

Good eye archerfab!

 

[DannyE]

Correct, that’s a t3 to mhi adapter. I don’t want to go out and buy a evolll 7cm turbine housing. That’s the whole reason I wanted the s20g because the t3 10cm housing flows much better and the extra lag helps in my application seeing I’m fwd.

The adapter just moves the turbo slightly downwards, it’s the front to back which is the issue. Going to the 7cm housing may work and get me the clearance I need, but then again that’s another $120 right off the bat. If I end up running the rre flange and have leaks then I will just go ahead and purchase the 7cm housing.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

We all have to adapt....
Kyle can tell you why it is happening, I bet, if anyone can.
Thanks @Archer Fabrications for the input!
Danny, he makes fabulaous shit every day, just fyi, and has the jigs to mock it all up with.
If I needed a mani, I'd talk to him, but understand your particular situation.

 

[DannyE]

Oh I believe you, from the looks of it he makes top notch stuff. I’m thinking the RRE flange/spacer will work fine, but like I said if it does leak I will just have to go with a 7cm evolll turbine housing.

The only other option for me would be to part with my brand new fp manifold and find a treadstone t3 manifold.

Thanks again for all the help fellas.

 

[Mello]

Make or get both faces of the RRE flange faced just like you'd deck a head. This can be DIY with a plate of glass, sandpaper, & elbow grease. Also that T3 MHI adapter flange is part of Hahn's turbo kit & in the picture too.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

Oh I believe you, from the looks of it he makes top notch stuff. I’m thinking the RRE flange/spacer will work fine, but like I said if it does leak I will just have to go with a 7cm evolll turbine housing.

The only other option for me would be to part with my brand new fp manifold and find a treadstone t3 manifold.

Thanks again for all the help fellas.

It moves it down and like 1/2" toward the block from the looks of it. It's off center

 

[DannyE]

@Archer Fabrications I thought the same thing at first, but when I gave it a good second look it appears to just space it straight down. The fp manifold tilts the turbo slightly forward away from the block but they didn’t factor in someone trying to do what I’m doing.

@Mello I was hoping no one would say that I thought they came surfaced and ready to go. Well luckily for me I rebuilt dirt bikes and atvs so I already have a large granite lapping stone and wet paper. To be honest I don’t want to sit there lapping the thing for hours seeing it’s made from steel.

 

[DSMPT]

@DannyE
I think a 1/2" spacer would probably solve the issue but in case if still the turbine housing contact the block with a 1/2" spacer between the manifold and the cylinder head then make an angled T3/DSM adapter.
I had a similar issue before and I made a couple of angled adapters and worked good. Maybe you can use the adapter you have if it has sufficient material.
What I did was, weld to fill out the bolt holes only one side and resurface the side with putting a little bit of angle, then tap threads at the last. machine shop can do that.

I attached some pics of the angled adapters I made before, the one with a lot of angle was made for without a 1/2" spacer (That was too much, I guess affects the exhaust flow), and the one mounted was made for with a 1/2" spacer and this could give me some 4-5mm extra clearance.

 

[DannyE]

@DSMPT i see what you did there, you milled the surface at just enough of an angle to clear the block.

I was actually thinking of welding the adapter to the turbine housing so I don’t have any leaks. I may also do the same for the rre spacer to the fp mani, that way I eliminate a gasket and another potential leak.

Then again I’m sure I will most likely have to have the manifold surfaced after the welding just in case there is distortion.

Thanks again for all the help man, it’s greatly appreciated.

 

[Mello]

Welding my cause more problems than it may fix. First the flanges & adapter are made from low carbon steel. The manifold & turbine housings & cast iron. Yes welding is going to cause warping & distortions. The exahust flange is going to bow (curl) a lot when welded.

There is no need to do any angle machining of the flanges with the Hahn turbos if doing like Hahn has designed their kit. Also, whatever added space you get between the block & turbo you will loose between the turbo & radiator (& fans).

If this was for me I would check each component's mating faces for each gasket for flatness with a quick lap to see if there are any highs & lows, correct those that are not flat, & use gaskets as intended. If all the faces are flat you will not have any leaks.

 

[DSMPT]

@DannyE
What @Mello said is exactly the same thing as I was told by a welder at local machine shop when I made the adapter.
And to use a spacer with gaskets means you will be able to have 2-3mm more clearance between the turbine housing and the block, if you use thick gaskets.
I have used a 1/2" spacer and I didn't have any leak.
Just don't forget to prepare longer stud bolts for manifold, M8 x 1.25 x 60mm do the job for a 1/2" spacer.

Hope you will solve the issue soon,

 

[DannyE]

Ok guy’s, I’m going with the RRE 1/2” manifold flange and just going with the copper gaskets.

I will make sure to check the RRE flange for straightness out the box, if it needs to be lapped then I can handle that but it it needs more, I will just take it to the machine shop and have them do it. I’m pretty close to jackson machine.

Once I get the RRE flange, I will let you guys know how it goes. I do know that it will work because I tried that 1/2” junk flange I had and it provided the space I needed plus some. I just don’t want any leaks that’s all.

Thanks again fellas, your help is priceless to me

 

[DannyE]

@Archer Fabrications just looked at some of your work and I must say, that is some of the most beautiful tig work I have laid my eyes on and that’s coming from a guy that welds.

I’m not sure how much your work cost, but I will be keeping you in mind when I go to upgrade to an hx40 no matter what price.

And thank you for the words of wisdom bud.