1G Building a Shortblock 101

jakelandry · Nov 12, 2018

90laserRSfwd said:
I wish someone would make a sticky of short block (101) and cylinder head (101) and have all the correct bolt sizes / torque values / etc listed. Along with, a complete, parts list. People don't understand how many parts and bolts there literally are doing work like that. They think, block / pistons / rods / crank and bam! blocks done... when really there is so much more. Just front case alone with a complete BSE setup takes some time. Castle plug and o ring, both oil pump gears and bolts, BSE spacer if you do it correctly, crank bolt, dampr and bolts, oil pick up / strainer and bolts, BS bearings spun to block off the holes, etc. It takes a good amount of time and patience to assemble a 4g.. Ring gaps your shooting for seem good for 25 - 35psi (under 700whp). Piston to wall sounds like a Wiseco 2816 forging. Guessing rod and main bearing clearances are in the .024 - .028" range?

I made an incredibly rough spreadsheet that calculated clearances to be used while blueprinting that had a list of bolt sizes/taps needed for all the basic stuff. I’d love to get back on cleaning it all up and adding some torque specs and whatnot but unfortunately I can either work on my car or spend time doing things like that and cars don’t build themselves.

bastarddsm said:
Do you have a rigid hone? A good sunnen bore gauge and the setting fixture.

I’d venture to say the quantity of people on this forum who own those tools can be counted on one hand and that’s including the people who do this for a living.

After a few of us talked about it on the link forums, I feel like a Fowler .0001” gauge and 3 setting rings for less than 400 dollars total should be adequate for my needs. Not disagreeing with you at all, cause you’re right about the sunnen, just bringing up the topic for people who haven’t really researched gauges.

bastarddsm · Nov 12, 2018

That is a good point. If your just fooling around and assembling stuff that a machine shop machined for you, a cheaper bore gauge is just fine. Even a set of snap gauges is good enough. But if your going to be attempting to actually hone a cylinder to increase the clearance, a Sunnen AN hone and a Sunnen gauge is the gold standard. My dad my brother and I just picked up a serviquip power stroke hone. I just need a line hone mandrel and a surfacer and I can be free from the machine shop.

donniekak · Nov 12, 2018

A truing sleeve fixes that, or just running it in an iron cylinder for a couple minutes.

Sunnen stones aren’t perfect either. I use lisle, Goodson, sunnen, and rottler heads/stones. The best thing about the sunnen stuff is the tension wheel so you don’t have to stop the machine to increase tension, that and stone availability. We usually don’t run actual stones to cut, that’s for diamonds.

donniekak · Nov 12, 2018

bastarddsm said:
That is a good point. If your just fooling around and assembling stuff that a machine shop machined for you, a cheaper bore gauge is just fine. Even a set of snap gauges is good enough. But if your going to be attempting to actually hone a cylinder to increase the clearance, a Sunnen AN hone and a Sunnen gauge is the gold standard. My dad my brother and I just picked up a serviquip power stroke hone. I just need a line hone mandrel and a surfacer and I can be free from the machine shop.

I found a small shop that lets me use their stuff, next best thing.

I almost bought a servquip for $3500 with a sunnen head and stones.

motomattx · Nov 12, 2018

donniekak said:
A truing sleeve fixes that, or just running it in an iron cylinder for a couple minutes.

Sunnen stones aren’t perfect either. I use lisle, Goodson, sunnen, and rottler heads/stones. The best thing about the sunnen stuff is the tension wheel so you don’t have to stop the machine to increase tension, that and stone availability. We usually don’t run actual stones to cut, that’s for diamonds.

What are you cutting with diamonds? I only use diamonds to true stones with, the Kwikway uses carbide tipped cutters to bore, not sure what uses diamonds.

bastarddsm · Nov 12, 2018

Many hones now days use diamond stones to hone with. The old school vitrified stones won't cut some modern cylinders very well. Machine shop that does stuff for me was showing me a 7.3 powerstoke block that was junk from another shop trying to bore and then hone it. It had some really hard spots in the cylinder that wouldn't cut.

bastarddsm · Nov 12, 2018

The place I've been using is basically the service center for a lot of the top fuel teams blocks and heads f***ing wild the shit they have in there.

donniekak · Nov 12, 2018

We rarely bore anything. A sunnen cv616 and diamonds can take a block .020” over faster than you can bore and hone, and it’s perfect. One of the only things we bore are holes for sleeves.

SasaniFab · Nov 13, 2018

donniekak said:
We rarely bore anything. A sunnen cv616 and diamonds can take a block .020” over faster than you can bore and hone, and it’s perfect. One of the only things we bore are holes for sleeves.

Well maybe that exactly what my machine shop is doing. I just would never hand hone a .020 over job. One day i will have a shop with all the goodies...... one day

SasaniFab · Nov 13, 2018

The new rods came in boys. They def screwed up. I was even questioning my sanity. 7 bolt rods in 6 bolt box. Manley asked if i was a competent engine builder....

90laserRSfwd · Nov 13, 2018

I'd say figuring out you got the wrong rods in the box, before trying to start the engine, qualifies you, at the very least, as a "competent" builder! Can't wait to see the finished product!

SasaniFab · Nov 13, 2018

90laserRSfwd said:
I'd say figuring out you got the wrong rods in the box, before trying to start the engine, qualifies you, at the very least, as a "competent" builder! Can't wait to see the finished product!

Really took the wind out of my friends sails...... Ill never give up. Never. I dont give a shit what happens. Always gotta keep pushing.

SasaniFab · Nov 16, 2018

Ok guys so I got everything up to temperature. The bloc and the pistons, I remeasured the bore diameter and miced the pistons. The finals numbers were .0045 .0044 .0045 .0045 plus or minus for ptw clearance . My friend who owns a machine shop varified these for me. The rings ended up .022 top ring .024 bottom ring. Main bearing came in at .003, the rods were a bit tighter at .0025. Overall im happy with how she came out

SasaniFab · Nov 16, 2018

The only thing I noticed was some minor piston protrusion. Im hoping its not going to effect valve clearance to much. We are using bc 270 cams with stock cams gears,

SasaniFab · Nov 18, 2018

So we hAve another complication. My friend ordered alot of the parts before we began and/ or before speaking with me. With the new issue that came up with the piston protrusion I felt we could mitigate some of the danger with the headgasket. Unfortunately the gasket he ordered was the 1.2mm hks variety and not the 1.6mm headgasket I usually run . Luckily he will be able to swAp them out. I will be home tuesday so Ill be able to take some measurements of the deck and head.

SasaniFab · Nov 24, 2018

Checked over everything 10x, the pistons only protrude a very tiny amount , either way I rechecked the clearances and we are good to go. Engine is almost complete...just little things now

donniekak · Nov 25, 2018

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Something like this is your friend.

motomattx · Nov 25, 2018

That one in the picture appears to have about .095" unless all is not as it appears, LOL

.

donniekak · Nov 25, 2018

motomattx said:
That one in the picture appears to have about .095" unless all is not as it appears, .

.005” in the hole. The dial indicators are set to 0 on the deck.

motomattx · Nov 25, 2018

donniekak said:
.005” in the hole. The dial indicators are set to 0 on the deck.

Yes, duh. It would be running backwards, without having it in my hands and doing it myself I lose my mind.

SasaniFab · Nov 28, 2018

Shes primed and ready to go. I alwAys make sure to prime the engine when the belts off by spining the pump gear with a drill

Vegas Smith · Nov 28, 2018

Is this for a Galant? What's the purpose of the compressor clocking?

SasaniFab · Nov 28, 2018

The car is a galant yes, thats how the current piping setup works. I will be fabbing new stuff for him.

SasaniFab · Jan 7, 2019

Good news boys, new engine fired right up. Everything looks great so far. We will be taking the car out to break in the rings and Im going to take the car to my garage for some fab work. Cant say how relieved I am......when you your playing with other peoples money it can be nerve racking. I try to be as thorough as possible. Hasnt failed me yet.

TheBrownMike · Jan 28, 2019

Good writeup! Just curious what your/others opinions are on breaking in new motors. Last time I built a motor was 10+ years ago. I think general idea was dino oil, high idle and varied rpm driving for like 100 miles, change to normal oil and send it. I know everyone and their mom has their method but figured there are new ways these days

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