A mustang will beat a focus but its made by the same company. A charger will rape a avenger but its made by the same company. A nsx will bury and Integra.... do I need to go on?

So by your logic any car made by Mitsubishi, Chrysler, Eagle or Dodge is a Dsm?

No. Any car made under the dsm monacer is a dsm. Kinda simple logic I think...

honda_burner said:

No. Any car made under the dsm monacer is a dsm. Kinda simple logic I think...

Click to expand...

That makes no sense. Just because they had a mitsu motor doesnt mean it was a dsm. Chrysler basically owned mitsu since late 88'. The evo died because chrysler refused to bail them out again.

So with that being said, since chrysler owned mitsu, any chrysler car with a mitsu motor is a dsm by your logic?

89-94 1g dsm's are the only true dsm, 2g's are excepted because of similarity and the fact that they continued the eclipse, and the wide variety of interchangeable drivetrain parts.

3kgt's/stealths are far more a dsm then cloud cars. The first gen 3k's were 90-94. During the dsm collaboration.

Is it coincidence that the avenger/etc was never made before 95? No cloud car was ever produced under the dsm collaboration. If a cloud car is considered a dsm then so is a base model neon. Since their motor was used in both the cloud car platform and 2g n/t's.

91stocker said:

That makes no sense. Just because they had a mitsu motor doesnt mean it was a dsm. Chrysler basically owned mitsu since late 88'. The evo died because chrysler refused to bail them out again.

So with that being said, since chrysler owned mitsu, any chrysler car with a mitsu motor is a dsm by your logic?

89-94 1g dsm's are the only true dsm, 2g's are excepted because of similarity and the fact that they continued the eclipse, and the wide variety of interchangeable drivetrain parts.

3kgt's/stealths are far more a dsm then cloud cars. The first gen 3k's were 90-94. During the dsm collaboration.

Is it coincidence that the avenger/etc was never made before 95? No cloud car was ever produced under the dsm collaboration. If a cloud car is considered a dsm then so is a base model neon. Since their motor was used in both the cloud car platform and 2g n/t's.

Click to expand...

Your argument makes no sense. What makes a dsm a dsm by YOUR terminology then? because by my thought process if it says dsm, its a dsm. Once again, not too hard to understand. Maybe for you it is. Just because some jackass on the street says it's not doesn't make it anything else.

honda_burner said:

Your argument makes no sense. What makes a dsm a dsm by YOUR terminology then?

Click to expand...

Here let me explain this again for the special kids. 1g eclipse, laser, talon produced from 89-94. Thats it. Pretty easy to understand. And its not "my" terminology, its how it is. The "dsm" collaboration was over in 94. Its common knowledge.

Im guessing you didnt actually read any of my posts. Or maybe you cant read, its hard to tell from your posts.


By your own logic, you disprove that cloud cars are dsm's.

honda_burner said:

No. Any car made under the dsm monacer is a dsm. Kinda simple logic I think...

Click to expand...

When was the dsm collaboration over? And when was the first cloud car produced? Its ok, i'll wait...

91stocker said:

Here let me explain this again for the special kids. 1g eclipse, laser, talon produced from 89-94. Thats it. Pretty easy to understand. And its not "my" terminology, its how it is. The "dsm" collaboration was over in 94. Its common knowledge.

Im guessing you didnt actually read any of my posts. Or maybe you cant read, its hard to tell from your posts.


By your own logic, you disprove that cloud cars are dsm's.


When was the dsm collaboration over? And when was the first cloud car produced? Its ok, i'll wait...

Click to expand...

Does it make you feel better if we change it to
"An avenger/sebring coupe is AS MUCH a DSM as any other 2g eclipse/talon"

because that statement is truth.

necrotopsy said:

Does it make you feel better if we change it to
"An avenger/sebring coupe is AS MUCH a DSM as a 2g N/T eclipse/talon"

because that statement is truth.

Click to expand...

Fixed i suppose

91stocker said:

Here let me explain this again for the special kids. 1g eclipse, laser, talon produced from 89-94. Thats it. Pretty easy to understand. And its not "my" terminology, its how it is. The "dsm" collaboration was over in 94. Its common knowledge.

Im guessing you didnt actually read any of my posts. Or maybe you cant read, its hard to tell from your posts.


By your own logic, you disprove that cloud cars are dsm's.


When was the dsm collaboration over? And when was the first cloud car produced? Its ok, i'll wait...

Click to expand...

Hey special kid, never said anything about your 'cloud cars'. I said and will say again. If the car has a genuine from the factory oem dsm badge (which mine does and hey, guess what, its a 95) than it must be a dsm. Not because I said so, because the people who made the car said so. If it quacks like a duck... Wait, sorry, that last comment might have been over your head...

honda_burner said:

Hey special kid, never said anything about your 'cloud cars'. I said and will say again. If the car has a genuine from the factory oem dsm badge (which mine does and hey, guess what, its a 95) than it must be a dsm. Not because I said so, because the people who made the car said so. If it quacks like a duck... Wait, sorry, that last comment might have been over your head...

Click to expand...

Get over yourself kid. No one will argue that a 2g awd isnt a dsm.

Re-read the op's post and the entire point of this thread.

91stocker said:

Get over yourself kid. No one will argue that a 2g awd isnt a dsm.

Re-read the op's post and the entire point of this thread.

Click to expand...

my 95 avenger had a "manufactured by Diamond Star Motors" badge in it in two different places

i even made it's own thread on here about it. solid proof that an A/S is a DSM.

91stocker said:

When was the dsm collaboration over? And when was the first cloud car produced? Its ok, i'll wait...

Click to expand...

I do believe this is where you are misinformed...an Avenger/Sebring is not a "cloud car" and bears no similarities other than similar drivetrain options to a "cloud car". The A/S was manufactured by Mitsubishi in the Mitsubishi plant in Normal right along side the Eclipse and Talons. Cloud car arguments are not relative in any respect because those are Chrysler designed and built cars, that happened to share the same badge on the bumpers.

Avenger/Sebring is the hybrid bastard child that fell somewhere between the Eclipse and the Galant. Galant wheel base, made to be a coupe, and is just as similar to a 2g "DSM" as a 2gNT is. Its no coincidence that the front sheet metal can be interchanged without modification, the chassis is from top to bottom, designed, and built by Mitsubishi.

This is not the case for a Dodge Neon or Stratus (cloud car) which has zero Mitsubishi affiliation.

Initially Diamond-Star Motors was a 50-50 joint venture between Chrysler and Mitsubishi. In order to circumvent this, the two partners officially incorporated Diamond-Star Motors in October 1985.

So wouldnt any car manufactor out of any Chrysler or Mitsubishi plant be consider a DSM. Before 95 of course.

chinola69 said:

Initially Diamond-Star Motors was a 50-50 joint venture between Chrysler and Mitsubishi. In order to circumvent this, the two partners officially incorporated Diamond-Star Motors in October 1985.

So wouldnt any car manufactor out of any Chrysler or Mitsubishi plant be consider a DSM. Before 95 of course.

Click to expand...

That is the point they are trying to make, that after 95 none of them have rights to that claim even back to 92 if you want to be specific.

The tuners here should agree to disagree that the name implies a 4G63 powered eclipse talon or laser. Which is fine they are the majority they will win the argument.

I refer to my avenger as a 2g all the time but I've had 4 different 2gNTs all needing the same routine work, and sharing the same parts so it all blends together for me.

And diamond star motors was Basically chryslers money to keep mitsubishi in buisiness during that period, Chrysler had there own factories and there cars are not related at all to the DSMs.

If we look to only 4g63 powered E/T/L, then you MUST include the 2g. Why?? Because, every 2G exported out of the America's (Hello Europe and Japan) had 4G63's in them. The 420a was an America's engine only.

Correct, the 4g guys want to segregate the 420a out of the group is all they are saying.

Piddly stuff. I would never own a 420 powered vehicle, but I say let 'em in!!

[I said and will say again. If the car has a genuine from the factory oem dsm badge (which mine does and hey, guess what, its a 95) than it must be a dsm. Not because I said so, because the people who made the car said so. If it quacks like a duck...

Kinda have to agree with him, if it was made in the same plant same assembly line with same stamp. doesnt that make it a DSM? its like making a tweenkie in the same plant with same ingredients, changing the look slightly and ship it to another country and call it something else. At the end of the day it was still a tweenkie right

95VENG said:

[I said and will say again. If the car has a genuine from the factory oem dsm badge (which mine does and hey, guess what, its a 95) than it must be a dsm. Not because I said so, because the people who made the car said so. If it quacks like a duck...

Kinda have to agree with him, if it was made in the same plant same assembly line with same stamp. doesnt that make it a DSM? its like making a tweenkie in the same plant with same ingredients, changing the look slightly and ship it to another country and call it something else. At the end of the day it was still a Hostess Product right

Click to expand...

^^^^^Most logical statement in this retarded thread.^^^^^^

Although I fixed one thing.

Omg this is still going on? ok ill continue to play.

Why do all the these non 1g and 2g car owners want so desperately to be included as a DSM? Hell I've even heard neon owners claim to be a dsm because they share a engine with a n/t 2g and they're faster but that's another thread topic. You Avenger/Sebring owners are like the special needs kid in gym class and n/t 2g's are like the fat uncoordinated kid who sucks at sports. Some people may accept you, some people will tell you that you are no diffrent than anyone else, but at the end of the day your ass still isnt getting chosen for the pickup game. No matter how hard you try you are just never gonna fit in with the cool kids in class you so desperately want to hang out with. That's just something that you will eventually have to come to terms with. It's too bad because we throw the best parties.

At no point has chrysler ever "pretty much owned mitsubishi". They have and still do collaborate on projects togeather. (GEMA), but if you know anything about mitsubishi, then you know that auto manufacturing is but a very small part of the global market share owned by mitsubishi heavy industries. They make everything from paper to shipping containers. I work for chrysler and know that mitsubishi as a cooperation dwarfs chrysler in diversity and annual revenue.

So

BoostedPhoenix said:

That is the point they are trying to make, that after 95 none of them have rights to that claim even back to 92 if you want to be specific.

The tuners here should agree to disagree that the name implies a 4G63 powered eclipse talon or laser. Which is fine they are the majority they will win the argument.

I refer to my avenger as a 2g all the time but I've had 4 different 2gNTs all needing the same routine work, and sharing the same parts so it all blends together for me.

And diamond star motors was Basically chryslers money to keep mitsubishi in buisiness during that period, Chrysler had there own factories and there cars are not related at all to the DSMs.

Click to expand...

So what would you call my 2002 sebring coupe ? Im still trying to find out if its a 420a, 4g63, or a 4g64 like what my car sticker says. Lol could use a lesson. Do i look for a Mitsubishi engine tuner or a chrysler ( wich are very hard to find for a 02 ) ? Sorry for the dirty engine pic . It was when i first bought it .

D3tro1tDi3sel420 said:

So

So what would you call my 2002 sebring coupe ? Im still trying to find out if its a 420a, 4g63, or a 4g64 like what my car sticker says. Lol could use a lesson. Do i look for a Mitsubishi engine tuner or a chrysler ( wich are very hard to find for a 02 ) ? Sorry for the dirty engine pic . It was when i first bought it .

Click to expand...

Also what make should i be buying performance parts for ? Lol