The Top DSM Community on the Web

For 1990-1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse, Eagle Talon, Plymouth Laser, and Galant VR-4 Owners. Log in to remove most ads.

Please Support Morrison Fabrications
Please Support ExtremePSI

1G Stock block 1g fp black.... Want to pick your brains

This site may earn a commission from merchant
affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

I still will never understand the "get stuff rated for ethanol" thing. Fuel has had 10% ethanol in it since I can remember. I would think if it were going to ruin something in your fuel system then everyone running gasoline would be seeing fuel system failures.

It is because E85 is so strong with ethanol (which attracts moisture) it can rust up the insides of fuel injectors so bad that they are not useable anymore. You will notice that E85 users usually run "gas" through their fuel system if they are not going to be running the car for a month or longer. My son had a set of 2150's that had E85 sit in them for a year and they had to be completely rebuilt by FIC for that very reason and that is the information that they told him.
 
It is because E85 is so strong with ethanol (which attracts moisture) it can rust up the insides of fuel injectors so bad that they are not useable anymore. You will notice that E85 users usually run "gas" through their fuel system if they are not going to be running the car for a month or longer. My son had a set of 2150's that had E85 sit in them for a year and they had to be completely rebuilt by FIC for that very reason and that is the information that they told him.
That is why I follow factory flex fuel recommendation e85 every other tank.
 
I'd like to ad that I get the same "spill" about using the "cheap gas" from my local gas attendant (yes they still pump gas for you in these parts) and I tell him the same thing....I've been running this stuff (10%) for years in my car and have never had any issues because of it. I also asked him, if he thought it was so terrible, why was he selling it and I didn't get an answer. Of course he has no idea I run E85 in my fun car, but just 10% ethanol doesn't hurt anything because it is 90% gasoline. I use the cheap gas in my dd and my lawn mower etc, but if your using high ethanol content fuel, it will attract moisture and can cause issues, just to be clear, so keltalon is really doing the "right" thing by using real gas occasionally.
 
I'd like to ad that I get the same "spill" about using the "cheap gas" from my local gas attendant (yes they still pump gas for you in these parts) and I tell him the same thing....I've been running this stuff (10%) for years in my car and have never had any issues because of it. I also asked him, if he thought it was so terrible, why was he selling it and I didn't get an answer. Of course he has no idea I run E85 in my fun car, but just 10% ethanol doesn't hurt anything because it is 90% gasoline. I use the cheap gas in my dd and my lawn mower etc, but if your using high ethanol content fuel, it will attract moisture and can cause issues, just to be clear, so keltalon is really doing the "right" thing by using real gas occasionally.
I have a few filter inserts from the fuel lab filter you can clearly see the residual mess that is filtered from using e85. Gas breaks down the mess to keep things in order. I have using the 2150s for some years but I do get them cleansed at least twice a year. Heck I get all my injectors cleaned twice a year just because.
 
I've run e85 in my car for at LEAST 5 years and left it sitting for months on end with half a tank. Fired right back up with proper AFR's every time. I've never not once ever had an issue with anything in my injectors or fuel system. I seriously think this "mystery" of e85 messing things up is yet to be solved. I'm not doing anything special to my fuel system other than driving the car. I've also used e85 stations (probably 5 in total) between Dallas Fort Worth and Austin, TX.

While we're on the "bad gas" discussion.... recently I was gifted a "non working" weed eater and I had some 2-stroke mix in a can that was from 8 months ago. Big no-no right, don't use this crappy old 2-stroke gas... right??? Well I put it in the weed eater and it wouldn't start. My neighbor and friend both said "it's bad gas, you need new gas, how old is that gas." Me, being the naysayer at "general rules", tuned the carb's high and low speed screws a bit and got it to run like a champ, with the gas that I put in there. I dunno what kind of fuel people have access to in other parts of the country but I've never experienced any fuel related failures due to hydroscopicity or "old" fuel. Maybe I'm just lucky.
 
Mixed 2 stroke gas is a whole other story. When is the last time you had to rebuild a 2 stroke carburetor because the gas sat in it and turned to varnish? I never have. That's because the oil in the mix helps to stabilize the fuel much in the same way Stabil and other additives work for normal gasoline.
 
The new intercooler has arrived!Im going to double check my base timing as Im finding im running very very high timing in comparison to others. Once I verify the timing im going to turn up the boost..... I dropped off my block at rrt today for some machine work. Im going to be running a wiseco hd 8.8:1/ eagle rod setup. Im going to be shooting for 500whp, I feel like that is a safe number..yes? Im also going to be having raif build me a transmission as im still runing completely stock minus the clutch of course. Gotta hit that 10!
 
Safe numbers are all in the tune. If you have competent engine assembly then you will have no problems there outside of making sure that the tune is correct for your engine.

Mixed 2 stroke gas is a whole other story. When is the last time you had to rebuild a 2 stroke carburetor because the gas sat in it and turned to varnish? I never have. That's because the oil in the mix helps to stabilize the fuel much in the same way Stabil and other additives work for normal gasoline.

I rebuilt the carb in the weed eater before running it and found that there were no damaged, worn out, or varnished parts. I didn't even really get anything dirty out of it with the brake cleaner I used. I replaced the diaphragms and float needle because I was already in there cleaning it and had the new parts. I'm sure it can turn to varnish somehow, but i'm pretty sure the modern 2 stroke oils have fuel stabilizers, as you mentioned, in them.
 
Safe numbers are all in the tune. If you have competent engine assembly then you will have no problems there outside of making sure that the tune is correct for your engine.



I rebuilt the carb in the weed eater before running it and found that there were no damaged, worn out, or varnished parts. I didn't even really get anything dirty out of it with the brake cleaner I used. I replaced the diaphragms and float needle because I was already in there cleaning it and had the new parts. I'm sure it can turn to varnish somehow, but i'm pretty sure the modern 2 stroke oils have fuel stabilizers, as you mentioned, in them.
I mean shit im running over 50lb/min on a stock block 6 bolt LOL........these motors are amazing. I think you need to pick up a shortblock to understand what makes them so tough. An empty block with the caps on is almost 100lbs.

Time to party....ets race core
 

Attachments

  • IMG_1539.JPG
    IMG_1539.JPG
    324.2 KB · Views: 64
The ETS cores are nice but I'm very partial to water to air intercoolers after using one on my daily driver. Also, if you watch videos of some of the fastest boosted vehicles almost none of them are using air to air cores with a mile of piping. I equate it with old tech.
 
The ETS cores are nice but I'm very partial to water to air intercoolers after using one on my daily driver. Also, if you watch videos of some of the fastest boosted vehicles almost none of them are using air to air cores with a mile of piping. I equate it with old tech.
what is the price difference? You need the core, pump and tank yes?
 
Yep, frozenboost 350hp core kit is the kit I used. I also have a 1200hp core kit from them on the shelf for my race car whenever I motivate myself to finish it's assembly. Don't bother with the cheesy bilge pump (the white one).... pay the extra and get the bosch pump.... it's what is used OEM on a supercharged 03/04 Cobra for it's water to air system. If you look at my profile picture you can see where the core is mounted just before the throttle body elbow.

The reasons I think water to air is superior:

* Short intercooler piping
* ability to plumb an ice box and drop boosted charge temps BELOW ambient (not possible with air to air core)
* can run small core and large heat exchanger (I'm using the stock a/c condenser core in the stock location for my heat exchanger)
* stealthy setup because you don't have some grinning ass FMIC.
* no hacking of the bumper, can retain fog lights easily.
* returns to ambient air temp VERY quickly after a pull.
* cost is about the same by the time you factor in the cost of a QUALITY air to air core (~$1000) and custom built piping.
* oem cars that make much more power than a DSM use them stock, I cannot think of many cars besides and evo or a wrx that come with "large" air to air cores from the factory.
* examples: bugatti veyron, corvette zr-1, mustang s/c cobra, etc.
* as I mentioned above, if you watch cars that go in the standing mile or do anything worth a rat's ass on the 1/4 mile you're going to see water to air..... look at the stuff that has no problem making 1000hp like v8 turbos.

The only cons I can think of:

* a little bit of a bi*** to set up (I have water lines running underneath my car)
* probably a bit heavier in total to an air to air setup, but that doesn't matter because you're making some real hp right? :D
* the location of my core makes it "fun" to do work on the transmission/motor mounts when necessary... but it's not that big of a deal, I leave the water lines on and just move it out of the way while I work.

I've been daily driving in Texas heat with a water to air system in my car for years now. I've never used ice in the hatch mounted reservoir. My pump is mounted next to the reservoir and controlled with a switched relay that comes on when the car's ignition is turned on. It IS another pump to run so you have to consider that there will be more draw on your electrical system, although I've done nothing about this and am still running a stock alternator.... just fine.
 
Yep, frozenboost 350hp core kit is the kit I used. I also have a 1200hp core kit from them on the shelf for my race car whenever I motivate myself to finish it's assembly. Don't bother with the cheesy bilge pump (the white one).... pay the extra and get the bosch pump.... it's what is used OEM on a supercharged 03/04 Cobra for it's water to air system. If you look at my profile picture you can see where the core is mounted just before the throttle body elbow.

The reasons I think water to air is superior:

* Short intercooler piping
* ability to plumb an ice box and drop boosted charge temps BELOW ambient (not possible with air to air core)
* can run small core and large heat exchanger (I'm using the stock a/c condenser core in the stock location for my heat exchanger)
* stealthy setup because you don't have some grinning ass FMIC.
* no hacking of the bumper, can retain fog lights easily.
* returns to ambient air temp VERY quickly after a pull.
* cost is about the same by the time you factor in the cost of a QUALITY air to air core (~$1000) and custom built piping.
* oem cars that make much more power than a DSM use them stock, I cannot think of many cars besides and evo or a wrx that come with "large" air to air cores from the factory.
* examples: bugatti veyron, corvette zr-1, mustang s/c cobra, etc.
* as I mentioned above, if you watch cars that go in the standing mile or do anything worth a rat's ass on the 1/4 mile you're going to see water to air..... look at the stuff that has no problem making 1000hp like v8 turbos.

The only cons I can think of:

* a little bit of a bi*** to set up (I have water lines running underneath my car)
* probably a bit heavier in total to an air to air setup, but that doesn't matter because you're making some real hp right? :D
* the location of my core makes it "fun" to do work on the transmission/motor mounts when necessary... but it's not that big of a deal, I leave the water lines on and just move it out of the way while I work.

I've been daily driving in Texas heat with a water to air system in my car for years now. I've never used ice in the hatch mounted reservoir. My pump is mounted next to the reservoir and controlled with a switched relay that comes on when the car's ignition is turned on. It IS another pump to run so you have to consider that there will be more draw on your electrical system, although I've done nothing about this and am still running a stock alternator.... just fine.
That's interesting, I've always wanted to do a setup like that. You have a tank in the hatch and run the water lines under the car into the passenger side tranny area were the intercooler sits? Then u run a small "radiator" on the front to cool the water? Does the pump start asa the ignition is turned on?
 
It does. I've never had any cranking/battery problems. Finding a way to route the water lines was the most difficult part next to figuring out how to mount the water reservoir and what to do about a heat exchanger. One of the nice things about a water to air setup is that you effectively have 2 heat exchangers when you're not in boost. The core itself will cool the "hot" water passing through it with ambient temperature air that is being sucked into the intercooler. This is in addition to the water flowing through your heat exchanger out front that is transferring ambient air temp to the water.

One of my engineer friends (TKelly) told me that a water to air system is only as good as the heat exchanger is large and this got me to thinking about what I could do in that regard. My options were to run complicated water lines between two fender well heat exchangers, figure out some crazy crap to mount a large heat exchanger in the rear of the car and duct air to it somehow, or mount a large heat exchanger up front where an FMIC would go. So I had this stupid a/c condenser that wasn't being used for anything since my a/c hasn't worked/been fixed since I've owned my car. This was always installed in the stock location and I got to thinking that this could be used for water. I mean, it's a heat exchanger, that's it's function, why not use it for water? That's exactly what I did and it works beautifully. I'd like to someday have a/c in my car again since it is a DD and I live in Texas but when I decide to do this I'm going to buy an aftermarket a/c condenser and potentially put two of the largest ones I can fit in the fender wells. I know this is probably backwards as crap from what most people would do but this car hasn't been "the norm" since I've owned it and I don't intend to put it that way now. I was running a 2g head on my 6 bolt block when people on this site were still naysaying about how it's restrictive. I also have had an evo 3 intake manifold on my car for quite a while.... probably close to 5 years now, since before the craze on those oem manifolds hit. I'm not putting myself on a pedestal, I'm simply saying that not doing what everyone else does has served me very well and should continue to do so.

I'm also running what my logger says is 450hp through the 350hp core and it seems fine. I do 4th and 5th gear pulls quite often @30PSI on FP HTA88 so take it for what it's worth. I think the ac condenser out front is sucking up a lot of the the would be heat from using more hp than the core is rated for since it's so large.... much larger than the small heat exchangers that they sell with the kits.
 
Vegas smith u are a funny dude! Great knowledge from this forum as always. Thanks for sharing best practices and what works for u tuners.
Head gasket went last night boys 35 psi, made the mistake of shifting into 5th. I'm going to be installing a set of l19s with a composite gasket tmrw. See how she goes
 
Should be good with that combo .
I have so many things going on at once, i have a block being built as we speak but i wanted to get her on the dyno as a before and after. The composite gasket is only 60 bucks so its not really a big deal money wise. I think im going to keep the standard arps and save the l19s for the new motor. We will see tmrw, ive taking this car apart so many times its like second nature.
 
hav
A Fel pro composite should only be like $40 from AutoZone or oreilys, and I have got them from rock auto for like $12.
Have an oem composite sitting in my garage

Im off for two days now so I get to play in the garage all day tmrw! I gotta take the women out friday though :banghead: Ill keep you guys posted, gunna start early and see if i can pound it out
 
Support Vendors who Support the DSM Community
Boosted Fabrication ECM Tuning ExtremePSI Fuel Injector Clinic Innovation Products Jacks Transmissions JNZ Tuning Kiggly Racing Morrison Fabrications MyMitsubishiStore.com RixRacing RockAuto RTM Racing STM Tuned

Latest posts

Build Thread Updates

Vendor Updates

Latest Classifieds

Back
Top