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ECMlink Double Check My Tune

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GST with PSI

DSM Wiseman
2,728
1,503
Jul 27, 2005
San Diego, California
1). Any boost, vac, or exhaust leaks?
No boost leaks

2). Verified mechanical timing?
Yes

3). Verified base timing?
5* BTDC

4). Ignition system
COP or Stock Coil: COP
Wire brand and Age: N/A
Spark Plug brand, type and Gap: BPR6ES

5). Motor health (Compression Test)
Newly built motor @ ~4,500 miles
Cylinder 1: 135
Cylinder 2: 135
Cylinder 3: 130
Cylinder 4: 135

6). Performed basic throttle body adjustments?
Idle Switch: Simulated
Throttle Cable: Good
TPS: Adjusted properly
BISS: Adjusted properly

7). Compression ratio
Ross 2G 85.5mm 8.3:1 forged aluminum pistons

8). Any known bad sensors or brittle wiring?
None

9). Any DTC/CEL codes?
None

10). Electrical system
Car off (not running): Good
Car running: Good

11). Base fuel pressure and injector values
Base Fuel Pressure: 37psi
Injector Size (cc/min): Evo VIII 560cc

12). Properly calibrated and configured wideband sensor
Sensor Brand: Innovate LC-1
Calibration Date: Nov 15, 2014

13). Type of fuel
Type: 93 pump
Percent of Ethanol:

14). Watched ECMlink how-to videos?
Yes

I recently installed the final parts I needed to really start tuning the car, mainly, the Innovate WB and Evo 8 MAF. I spent about 3 hours today doing 3rd gear pulls and tweaking the tune, and I think I'm pretty close. I'm fairly new to tuning, so I'd like another set of eyes to confirm I'm not screwing this up.

I'm working from stock Evo 8 timing and fuel tables that's I've modified. My profile and mod list is complete and up to date. I have uploaded 3 logs of 3rd gear pulls from ~2500-7000 RPM. I made minimal changes to the maxoct timing table and MAF sliders between pulls. Everything else was unchanged. The logs are chronologically labeled pull 11, 8 and 7. Pull 11 being the most recent and complete tune.

-Boost: I'm running ECMlink boost control. The car is set to 17psi, and tapers off to about 15 by 6500 RPM.

-MAF: So, I've got the AFRatioEST and the WB to line up the best I can. From 500-700hz, the car never wants to play nice. I'll add or take out air to get it to line up better, and it seems like it doesn't make much of a difference. I think the map needs some work after about 1200hz as well, but I didn't mess with it much.

-Knock: I tried to do at least 2 back to back pulls before making any changes to the tune. Sometimes, 3 pulls on the same tune would or would not yield knock. My coolant and intake temps were all pretty much the same each pull, and there didn't seem to be any rhyme or reason as to why I would sometimes get a degree or 2 of knock, and sometimes I wouldn't. I was satisfied with a degree or under, so someone please let me know if that's unacceptable.

-MAP sensor. I'm logging it, but it's not reading correctly. I need to screw with the scalar to get it registering right. Just disregard the MAP readings.

Any advice, corrections or feedback would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.
 

Attachments

  • log.2014.12.18-10.pull 11.elg
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  • log.2014.12.18-07.pull 8.elg
    20.9 KB · Views: 62
  • log.2014.12.18-06.pull 7.elg
    23.6 KB · Views: 61
Looking at the 11 log, you need to adjust the 1000hz by approx 2.1%. The 1100-1300hz need a 3.6% adjustment. You have done a good job getting them to mimic each other so far, they just need a little adjustment.

The 600 and 700hz seem like you should pull air out to lean the mixture. If it will not lean out, there must be an underlying issue.

To check out your idle settings, post up a idle log at full operating temp.

As for the knock, I personally ignore values below 1 degree if they appear sporadically. Anything above 1 degree and I tend to pull timing or adjust AFR’s to correct.
 
I worked on the tune some more, and it's much better sorted today. I have the WB and AFRatioEST lining up almost exactly. I'm getting some variation from pull to pull, but overall it's lining up nicely.

On the log titled pull 15, I get a bit of knock up top. I have since pulled a degree of timing from the affected cells, and that seems to have taken care of it.

I have also attached a 2-3 gear pull. The car feels great, so hopefully the logs reflect what the ass dyno is registering.

Again, comments, adjustments and suggestions welcome. Thanks.
 

Attachments

  • log.2014.12.19-06.pull 15.elg
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  • log.2014.12.19-10.elg 2--3.elg
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Your wideband and AFRest look great. Its really not going to get any better than that.

Its good that you pulled that timing from the 15 log (assuming it was repeatable) because it started knocking as soon as the ECU commanded 16degrees.

Like stated above, if you would post an idle log at full operating temp; we can check out your idle.
 
Robert,

I really appreciate your feedback thus far. I'll get an idle log up as soon as I can for evaluation. Thanks again for your time.
 
Last edited:
My only suggestion is copying your TmgMaxOct table into your TmgMin, currently the Min table has the more aggressive stock 1g loaded.

Nice job so far though, you and Robert have covered all the bases of tuning. Your AFR's lineup and if you took care of the consistent knock by pulling timing you had the right idea. My only question is what your goals are for the car's current setup? I only ask because according to your VR-4's profile you're running very low boost for that setup. Granted timing is pretty advanced for pump gas but you're nowhere near it's potential power levels if you ran more boost.

If you're looking for opinions and trying to run within the limits of your setup, while making some power, I'd personally shoot for 23-25psi. You'll lose a few degrees of timing, probably seeing 10* peak (maybe less), and may have to richen AFR's to ~10.8:1 (which is easy to do now that you've got your MAF sliders tuned) but still be making more power with the 6-8psi increase in boost. Another way to help airflow is to tune the BCS table, as boost tapers in the higher RPM's increase the WG duty cycle to maintain boost.

If you do decide to turn up the boost, load a conservative timing table because the one you've got is too aggressive to just throw that much boost at on pump gas. I attached a conservative pump gas base timing table (to your existing DA) that you can load IF you want to turn up boost pressure. Using it (or something similar) will allow you to get the boost set without running aggressive timing, then you can advance it from there...
 

Attachments

  • Pump Gas Base.eda
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Corey,

Thanks very much for your response.

My goals for the car are definitely to up the boost to around 23-25 psi as you've suggested. I realize I'm not pushing the car it it's full potential, and that there's room for improvment. I'm fairly new to tuning though, so my current goal is to get a good baseline and ensure I have the hang of things before I up the boost too much.

I've made some preliminary changes based on your feedback. I haven't driven the car or done any pulls yet after making these changes, but I hope to do so later today. In addition to the changes below, I'll be swapping to a set of colder NGK BR7ES (not BPR7ES) plugs today.

Timing table- I reviewed the timing table you posted, and made some changes to my current timing table. Maybe I'm just looking in the wrong places, but the table you posted didn't look too much more conservative than the one I already had. So, what I did was take the most conservative value from either table and merge them into one VERY conservative table. I'm hoping by doing this, it gives me some room to add boost across the board. I'm hoping after adding boost, I can add timing back in, rather than have to pull more out. Lastly, I have copied the TmngMaxOct directly over to the TmngMaxOct table, so they mirror each other as you've suggested.

Fuel table- Per your guidance, I've made some substantial changes to the OpenLoopMaxOct fuel table. For starters, I'm targeting a 10.8 AFR in the deeper table cells. I have also made some changes to the low RPM transition area (coordinates for the block: 0.9 - 1.8 x 1750 - 3500) where I was seeing a bit of intermittent knock. I'm hoping this will help combat knock as the AFRs make the transition from from lean to rich. I didn't modify the OpenLoopMinOct at all from the Evo 8 stock map, as it's more conservative. Let me know if you think I should.

Boost- In all of my previous logs, I have the duty cycle of the BCS lowered up top just as a bit of a safety net. I'll level it off to a higher boost level as I get comfortable with the tune, and how the car is performing at my current boost level. I hoping to play with that a bit today.

Once again, thanks very much for the feedback. I really appreciate your guys' time.
 

Attachments

  • directaccess.2014.12.20-01.Pump Gas.eda
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...I'll be swapping to a set of colder NGK BR7ES (not BPR7ES) plugs today.
Any reason for this? The 7ES, whether it's the projected tip or not, is the same temp spark plug and no colder. The only advantage the non-projected tip (BR) has over the projected tip (BPR) plug is that it pulls the spark plug out of the combustion chamber and from what I understand, allows for a better burn which is beneficial on E85 applications but there isn't much benefit on a pump gas setup that I'm aware. If you need to replace the plugs and you want to try something different, I've had good luck with the NGK EIX series which seem to last longer but aren't as easy on the wallet. BPR7EIX.

The ES series plug I was throwing 30psi at with a gap of .024" to keep from getting spark blow out and replacing them every 3 months. Since I've switched to the EIX series plug I'm still throwing 30psi at them but they're only gapped down to .028", the tight side of factory limits, and having no problems with blow out on the stock ignition setup. You may have different results since they're a lot of factors involved but that's been my experience with my setup...

Fuel table- Per your guidance, I've made some substantial changes to the OpenLoopMaxOct fuel table. For starters, I'm targeting a 10.8 AFR in the deeper table cells. I have also made some changes to the low RPM transition area (coordinates for the block: 0.9 - 1.8 x 1750 - 3500) where I was seeing a bit of intermittent knock. I'm hoping this will help combat knock as the AFRs make the transition from from lean to rich. I didn't modify the OpenLoopMinOct at all from the Evo 8 stock map, as it's more conservative. Let me know if you think I should.
You may find the car doesn't mind running 11:1 even with an increase in boost, you'll just have to find out. Just running a few points rich but squeezing a few more pounds of boost from the setup without detonation will increase horsepower, not running less boost and leaner AFR's which is all I was trying to get at. You probably knew that already though.

Boost- In all of my previous logs, I have the duty cycle of the BCS lowered up top just as a bit of a safety net. I'll level it off to a higher boost level as I get comfortable with the tune, and how the car is performing at my current boost level. I hoping to play with that a bit today.
You can also use the 0% / 100% BCS settings to tune boost spike creep, which is nice on smaller turbo setups like ours. The problem is, it uses your logged MAP sensor reading so you'd need to fix that thing first and then you can tune it properly but the WG duty cycle table will work just fine.


Looking forward to seeing a 21psi+ log. :sneaky:
 
4). Ignition system
COP or Stock Coil: COP
Wire brand and Age: N/A
Spark Plug brand, type and Gap: BPR6ES

If I am not mistaken, he is currently on BPR6ES’s; unless it has changed since the initial posts. I had to read it twice but I think the OP was just putting emphasis on using the Non-projected plug?
 
After looking around a bit, I just thought I'd give the non-projected tips a try, as I was going to move to a colder plug anyways. If I see any negative side effects, I can always swap back to the BPR7ES, or even 6's if I need to. The decision to try the non-projected plugs was going to be more trial and error type testing, since plugs are cheap. I may also give the EIX plugs a try, as you suggested, Corey.

I didn't get to do any tuning yesterday. I have a few mechanical issues I need to address before I get back into it. Robert, Corey, thanks once again for the help and guidance. It's greatly appreciated.
 
It also helps with detonation, at least in theory by not having a projected tip where the air/fuel mixture can ignite prematurely. It's also harder to blow out a non-projected plugs tip. It helped instantly relieve a friends 6266/stock ignition spark cut problem he was having where it was blowing out above 20psi. No other changes to gap or setup, just swapping to non-projected tip cured all of the knock issues he was having and the spark blow-out. I was the one to recommend and actually swap plugs, and we did a pull..instant relief.


However they do foul out faster. But, that's an easy fix.
 
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