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4g63 rebuild question

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Insane20

10+ Year Contributor
545
11
Jun 12, 2012
Natrona Heights, Pennsylvania
Ok I have a 95 talon that is 6 bolt swapped. Motor has 130k with no issues but id like to do a rebuild this winter to freshen things up. I plan on putting in new gaskets, seals, bearings, rings and arp heads mains and rod bolts.

My question is, since the motor has no issues can I just take it apart and put the new parts in without machining the rods and crank? I already plan on honing the cylinders and getting the head decked. Any input would be appreciated!
 
I'd honestly only rebuild if you were seeing an issue or were doing something that would overstress the stock rods or pistons. You can get away with not boring if the bores are in good shape, however the ability to tweak the clearance by going overbore is a good benefit. My car has stock bores which were honed and stock bore pistons installed and I get a bit of piston slap when the engine is cold. No issues once everything is to temperature, but having everything be exactly how you want is a positive thing.
 
Ill post a pic up of the oil squirter. As far as balance shafts go, should I delete mine? Do you notice any differences without them?
 
Anyways I got the motor apart and everything looked fine except my #1 oil squirter is broken. The 90 degree elbow broke off and was laying in my oil pan. anyone have any idea what would cause this to happen?

I just rebuilt mine, and if you go to the end of page 4 on my build for pics, the oil squirters lined exactly up with the new pistons, so I had to bend them over. I'm sure LOTS of people may overlook this, and not rotate their assembly and look there before finally putting it altogether, and I just happened to see this, didn't particularly look for it.

So during rotation, my pistons would hit the squirters, maybe not enough to break them, but there was definite interference and some flexing of the squirter end, so I had to remove them all and gently bend them over to the middle of the piston.

Something for everyone to think about during their next rebuild...
 
Resist the temptation to "save a few bucks" on the outset and do a proper rebuild right off the bat and you will save your self HUGE headache and heartbreak later on! as mercaholic said have EVERYTHING measured and resized as necessary!
 
Ill post a pic up of the oil squirter. As far as balance shafts go, should I delete mine? Do you notice any differences without them?

Personally, I would delete the balance shafts while you have the motor out. It's cheap insurance. Make sure you use the Mitsu OEM stub shaft which has the oil groove, not the junk Ebay type.

As far as being able to notice a difference with or without them, that's debatable, and a matter of opinion mostly. There is a ton of information/debate on the matter, and a quick Google search will yield hundreds of results. Just search around, and make that call on your own.

In short, they can and should be eliminated on any performance build IMO.
 
Ya im leaning towards a bse, I read the jacks transmission article and it kind of scared me out if doing it. But after seeing how many people have done them without an issue I think im going to do it.
 
Does the car still have balance shafts? One time, I had a balance shaft bearing spin, which took out an oil squirter. Other than that, not sure how that could have happened. How's the squirter look?
Now its time to build and fix the weaknesses in the 4g63 platform!
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Ya im leaning towards a bse, I read the jacks transmission article and it kind of scared me out if doing it. But after seeing how many people have done them without an issue I think im going to do it.
I have done both, BSE kit and race shaft and after 3 engine builds since 2002 I prefer the race shaft its what is currently in the car as we speakLOL
 
I wouldn't use a race shaft any more than I would use a balance shaft. I'm sure the debate about this could go on for years, but the race shaft poses many of the same risks as a balance shaft. That is; you have a belt driven shaft spinning twice the speed of the crankshaft. That equates to ~14,000 RPM at redline.

I suppose if you are hell bent on keeping the balance shafts, then the race shaft would be the better choice of the two. However, if you're debating on whether to delete the shaft completely, or use the race shaft, it's a no brainer. The reason you delete the shaft in the first place is to remove the "liability" of the shaft. Mainly, that means removing the risk of the balance shaft bearing spinning, or the belt snapping...possibly taking out your timing belt, bending valves, destroying pistons, blah blah blah.

You need to weigh the risk of each option, and decided which is best for your particular situation. If you are building a street car that will be driven on a consistent basis, maybe a little extra support for the oil pump gears would be good. If you're building a weekend warrior or all out track car, you probably don't want a balance shaft constantly spinning at high RPM while you constantly beat the shit out of the car. This is how the debate can go on forever, because there are good and bad reasons on both sides of the coin. YOU need to decide which risk is the least likely to affect you for you build and goals for the car. Whatever you decide to do though, there are really only two options. Either delete ALL the shafts, or keep them (one of them, both of them, whatever). A race shaft is still in the "keep them" category. There's no half way, IMO.
 
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I wouldn't use a race shaft any more than I would use a balance shaft. I'm sure the debate about this could go on for years, but the race shaft poses many of the same risks as a balance shaft. That is; you have a belt driven shaft spinning twice the speed of the crankshaft. That equates to ~14,000 RPM at redline.

I suppose if you are hell bent on keeping the balance shafts, then the race shaft would be the better choice of the two. However, if you're debating on whether to delete the shaft completely, or use the race shaft, it's a no brainer. The reason you delete the shaft in the first place is to remove the "liability" of the shaft. Mainly, that means removing the risk of the balance shaft bearing spinning, or the belt snapping...possibly taking out your timing belt, bending valves, destroying pistons, blah blah blah.

You need to weigh the risk of each option, and decided which is best for your particular situation. If you are building a street car that will be driven on a consistent basis, maybe a little extra support for the oil pump gears would be good. If you're building a weekend warrior or all out track car, you probably don't want a balance shaft constantly spinning at high RPM while you constantly beat the sh** out of the car. This is how the debate can go on forever, because there are good and bad reasons on both sides of the coin. YOU need to decide which risk is the least likely to affect you for you build and goals for the car. Whatever you decide to do though, there are really only two options. Either delete ALL the shafts, or keep them (one of them, both of them, whatever). A race shaft is still in the "keep them" category. There's no half way, IMO.
Yes it does but keep in mind it's spinning without the load that's placed on any other bearing in the engine the oil film stays consistent. It's like you said the debate is all over the tuners forum each person has to chose for himself I have never had any success with keeping an oil pump with the stubby shaft current race shaft no issues.
 
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Yes it does but keep in mind the it's spinning without the load that's placed on any other bearing in the engine the oil film stays consistent. It's like you said the debate is all over the tuners forum each person has to chose for himself I have never had any success with keeping an oil pump with the stubby shaft current race shaft no issues.

Load or no load, it's a belt driven component riding in a journal bearing that has the potential to see speeds up to 14,000+ RPM. Nothing you do the the shaft itself changes these facts.

Also, keep in mind that the stub shaft is a factory OEM Mitsubishi part. If Mitsubishi saw fit to install it in the higher revving 1.6L 4G61 from the factory, that's good enough for me. Regardless of what AMS and other vendors claim, the thought of oil pumps eating themselves after installing OEM parts seems ridiculous to me. I'm sure the race shaft works great for some people, I just wouldn't personally recommend it.

The race shaft is better than the factory balance shaft...but the stub shaft is better than both in my personal opinion. Of course, opinions are like assholes, and everybody has one.
 
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Load or no load, it's a belt driven component riding in a journal bearing that has the potential to see speeds up to 14,000+ RPM. Nothing you do the the shaft itself changes these facts.

Also, keep in mind that the stub shaft is a factory OEM Mitsubishi part. If Mitsubishi saw fit to install it in the higher revving 1.6L 4G61 from the factory, that's good enough for me. Regardless of what AMS and other vendors claim, the thought of oil pumps eating themselves after installing OEM parts seems ridiculous to me. I'm sure the race shafts work great for some people, I just wouldn't personally recommend them.

The race shaft is better than the factory balance shaft...but the stub shaft is better than both in my personal opinion. Of course, opinions are like assholes, and everybody has one.

it's all good use what makes you happy:).
 
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Ok guys I just got a rebuild kit, I went with an evergreen. Would any of you use this head gasket? Im going to use the other gaskets and king bearings but idk if I should use this head gasket.
 

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I'm not sure about that gasket. I've never heard of the brand. It looks like a decent part, however, for a quality and proven composite head gasket, the Fel-Pro composite gasket (9627PT) is a great choice. They have a good track record, and are fairly cheap as well.
 
I've used the Evergreen HG and it held up to a fully supported 16G, even with issues. Trapped 91mph in the 1/8th on an Auto AWD with a relatively simple setup. But for anything more than a basic 16G I would pass.
 
I have used the evergreen gaskets in builds before, I normally set the head gasket to the side and grab the felpro. For $40 I feel a bit more secure with it.
 
I run a Cometic, and so far have had no issues, although with a MLS gasket you need very very good surfaces for them to work properly.



If you end up going with a bigger turbo and running more boost before I get my setup together you gotta keep me updated on compression numbers and how well your HG is holding up. I had a shit ton of issues keeping a HG on my 30r/G4CS combo when I lived in CO, but I didn't have the technology we do today. As it is I'm still a little nervous. What size Cometic did you go with, the standard gasket or the 87mm one?
 
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